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This is bullshit and reflects the bias built into your own views. This is a deeply rooted viewpoint of many like you, most likely based on your experiences wit

by jabits 8y ago

This is bullshit and reflects the bias built into your own views. This is a deeply rooted viewpoint of many like you, most likely based on your experiences with your narrow network of "older" people.

russdpale 8y ago
Or the fact that the older people at my job still barely know how to type or use the printer or heaven forbid, scan to email! Even though they've had decades to learn it? Im not a young dev anymore, but I can see why the older crowd has the rap they do. It doesn't make ageism right, at all.. but I can understand how it has happened. An entire generation of people like me who have heard our older loved ones say they need their "foxfire" fixed or whatever. 10 years ago this was more palatable. Now a days it is dissolving as more older people learn the technology and more older people want to learn the technology. I personally never want to stop learning. My colleague is well into his 50's and still takes college course in math and CS. It has challenged my own personal prejudices and pushes me to be better as well.
- tabtab 8y ago
  There are negative stereotypes about inexperienced (young) workers also. Stupidity happens at all levels, and I could tell stories for months.
- skookumchuck 8y ago
  Taking math and CS courses isn't going to help you with scan to email.
DoofusOfDeath 8y ago
> This is bullshit Please keep the discussion civil.
- s73v3r_ 8y ago
  Calling bullshit on an argument that is not made from fact is not being uncivil. I'd argue that making an argument that is such bullshit is far more uncivil than saying the word "bullshit".
  - dang 8y ago
    You have a point, but it's trumped by the cruder point that when people get into the habit of hurling nasty words at each other, it leads to stupid discussion. Not from everybody, of course, but from most; the systemic effect is what dominates. That's why we don't allow that name-calling on HN (though that comment was hardly a serious instance of it).
umvi 8y ago
I disagree. Anecdotally, my company is an ANSI C + ClearCase shop. Anytime discussion comes up about transitioning to safer languages like C++ or about using different VCS like Git or Mercurial it is shot down immediately by the senior developers who feel that those things are faddish. Anecdotally, my parents always hated Windows and Microsoft Office upgrades because they would no longer be able to navigate the UIs. They became extremely resistant to upgrading anything that required them to relearn anything. Heck, there's ancient adage "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" - why does that saying exist if it doesn't contain a kernel of truth?? There may be some older developers who are the exception to this, but my argument is that generally the older you get, the more entrenched your opinions and patterns become. That's not necessarily a bad thing since those opinions and patterns were forged through decades of experience and hence contain much wisdom, but at a certain point when you are still using ANSI C and ClearCase in 2018 because there's "no need to switch to faddish version control like Git when ClearCase works perfectly fine" you are no longer fairly evaluating the technologies available on the market.
- brlewis 8y ago
  You disagreed, then confirmed that, as the comment you replied to said, your view is 'based on your experiences with your narrow network of "older" people'. In addition, switching the VCS your company uses is possibly not what your engineering organization should focus on. I don't know enough about your company to say if switching away from ANSI C is worthwhile.
  - umvi 8y ago
    And how do I know that your experiences based on your network of "older" people isn't equally narrow and biased?
    - kasey_junk 8y ago
      You can be sure that it is. The difference is that they aren’t making arguments based on their age based biases.

by jabits 8y ago

This is bullshit and reflects the bias built into your own views. This is a deeply rooted viewpoint of many like you, most likely based on your experiences with your narrow network of "older" people.

russdpale 8y ago

Or the fact that the older people at my job still barely know how to type or use the printer or heaven forbid, scan to email! Even though they've had decades to learn it? Im not a young dev anymore, but I can see why the older crowd has the rap they do. It doesn't make ageism right, at all.. but I can understand how it has happened. An entire generation of people like me who have heard our older loved ones say they need their "foxfire" fixed or whatever. 10 years ago this was more palatable. Now a days it is dissolving as more older people learn the technology and more older people want to learn the technology. I personally never want to stop learning. My colleague is well into his 50's and still takes college course in math and CS. It has challenged my own personal prejudices and pushes me to be better as well.

tabtab 8y ago
There are negative stereotypes about inexperienced (young) workers also. Stupidity happens at all levels, and I could tell stories for months.
skookumchuck 8y ago
Taking math and CS courses isn't going to help you with scan to email.

DoofusOfDeath 8y ago

> This is bullshit Please keep the discussion civil.

s73v3r_ 8y ago
Calling bullshit on an argument that is not made from fact is not being uncivil. I'd argue that making an argument that is such bullshit is far more uncivil than saying the word "bullshit".
- dang 8y ago
  You have a point, but it's trumped by the cruder point that when people get into the habit of hurling nasty words at each other, it leads to stupid discussion. Not from everybody, of course, but from most; the systemic effect is what dominates. That's why we don't allow that name-calling on HN (though that comment was hardly a serious instance of it).

umvi 8y ago

I disagree. Anecdotally, my company is an ANSI C + ClearCase shop. Anytime discussion comes up about transitioning to safer languages like C++ or about using different VCS like Git or Mercurial it is shot down immediately by the senior developers who feel that those things are faddish. Anecdotally, my parents always hated Windows and Microsoft Office upgrades because they would no longer be able to navigate the UIs. They became extremely resistant to upgrading anything that required them to relearn anything. Heck, there's ancient adage "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" - why does that saying exist if it doesn't contain a kernel of truth?? There may be some older developers who are the exception to this, but my argument is that generally the older you get, the more entrenched your opinions and patterns become. That's not necessarily a bad thing since those opinions and patterns were forged through decades of experience and hence contain much wisdom, but at a certain point when you are still using ANSI C and ClearCase in 2018 because there's "no need to switch to faddish version control like Git when ClearCase works perfectly fine" you are no longer fairly evaluating the technologies available on the market.

brlewis 8y ago
You disagreed, then confirmed that, as the comment you replied to said, your view is 'based on your experiences with your narrow network of "older" people'. In addition, switching the VCS your company uses is possibly not what your engineering organization should focus on. I don't know enough about your company to say if switching away from ANSI C is worthwhile.
- umvi 8y ago
  And how do I know that your experiences based on your network of "older" people isn't equally narrow and biased?
  - kasey_junk 8y ago
    You can be sure that it is. The difference is that they aren’t making arguments based on their age based biases.