5 ms·

The world is much larger than just the US, and the interests of one country are rarely the interests of all citizens of the world (e.g. human rights).

yourbandsucks 8y ago
Avoiding conflict or cold war is also in the interest of all citizens of the world. Some of the rhetoric I'm seeing fly around on the topic sounds a little overheated to me, compared to how bad things could get.
- craftyguy 8y ago
  You know what's overheated? Suggesting that the only way enforce human rights is through armed conflict or cold war.
  - dpc59 8y ago
    There's not really other ways to do politics other than to project soft power (cold war) or hard power (armed conflict)
    - geezerjay 8y ago
      Refusing to do business with totalitarian regimes dedicated to violate their citizen's human rights is in itself a way to leverage soft power.
      - true_religion 8y ago
        That is a cold war if you do it at the national level. It is basically a trade embargo. When you refuse to do business, and "encourage" your allies to do the same, then the other side begins to think that perhaps it may just be easier to take your resources by force.
    - DoctorOetker 8y ago
      Well, there's always the bizarre weirdo's who believe we can design provably fair and cryptographically secure decentralized cosmopolitan egalitarian societies... but no one should pay these people any attention right?
  - snaky 8y ago
    Suggesting that the only way enforce human rights is through armed conflict or cold war is the way to win elections in the United States.
ElBarto 8y ago
You won't help human rights in China by refusing to work there. And it's not clear how working there will influence human rights either way. Based on that, better to be in than out.
- 394549 8y ago
  > You won't help human rights in China by refusing to work there. Maybe so, but you definitely can hurt human rights by working there. I would say providing censored search results (and putting an American stamp of approval on them) is hurting human rights there. Furthermore, giving an authoritarian government economic leverage over an American search engine company can hurt human rights here.
  - ElBarto 8y ago
    This is China. Search results are censored and people are fully aware of that. This is a storm in a tea cup, but it shows that the US feel increasingly insecure when it comes to China.
    - WalterSear 8y ago
      Aware or not, they are still being manipulated. 25 years after Tiananmen, most Chinese university students have never heard of it https://www.vox.com/2014/6/3/5775918/25-years-after-tiananmen-most-chinese-univeristy-students-have-never https://www.vox.com/2014/6/3/5775918/25-years-after-tiananme...
      - jessaustin 8y ago
        Lots of stuff gets swept under the rug. I received 13 years of USA primary and secondary education, and I've traveled in the Philippines. Despite that, I didn't learn until earlier this week that USA soldiers had killed hundreds of thousands of Filipinos at the turn of the century.
        WalterSear 8y ago

yourbandsucks 8y ago

Avoiding conflict or cold war is also in the interest of all citizens of the world. Some of the rhetoric I'm seeing fly around on the topic sounds a little overheated to me, compared to how bad things could get.

craftyguy 8y ago
You know what's overheated? Suggesting that the only way enforce human rights is through armed conflict or cold war.
- dpc59 8y ago
  There's not really other ways to do politics other than to project soft power (cold war) or hard power (armed conflict)
  - geezerjay 8y ago
    Refusing to do business with totalitarian regimes dedicated to violate their citizen's human rights is in itself a way to leverage soft power.
    - true_religion 8y ago
      That is a cold war if you do it at the national level. It is basically a trade embargo. When you refuse to do business, and "encourage" your allies to do the same, then the other side begins to think that perhaps it may just be easier to take your resources by force.
  - DoctorOetker 8y ago
    Well, there's always the bizarre weirdo's who believe we can design provably fair and cryptographically secure decentralized cosmopolitan egalitarian societies... but no one should pay these people any attention right?
- snaky 8y ago
  Suggesting that the only way enforce human rights is through armed conflict or cold war is the way to win elections in the United States.

ElBarto 8y ago

You won't help human rights in China by refusing to work there. And it's not clear how working there will influence human rights either way. Based on that, better to be in than out.

394549 8y ago
> You won't help human rights in China by refusing to work there. Maybe so, but you definitely can hurt human rights by working there. I would say providing censored search results (and putting an American stamp of approval on them) is hurting human rights there. Furthermore, giving an authoritarian government economic leverage over an American search engine company can hurt human rights here.
- ElBarto 8y ago
  This is China. Search results are censored and people are fully aware of that. This is a storm in a tea cup, but it shows that the US feel increasingly insecure when it comes to China.
  - WalterSear 8y ago
    Aware or not, they are still being manipulated. 25 years after Tiananmen, most Chinese university students have never heard of it https://www.vox.com/2014/6/3/5775918/25-years-after-tiananmen-most-chinese-univeristy-students-have-never https://www.vox.com/2014/6/3/5775918/25-years-after-tiananme...
    - jessaustin 8y ago
      Lots of stuff gets swept under the rug. I received 13 years of USA primary and secondary education, and I've traveled in the Philippines. Despite that, I didn't learn until earlier this week that USA soldiers had killed hundreds of thousands of Filipinos at the turn of the century.
      - WalterSear 8y ago