4 ms·

How we fit an NES game into 40 Kilobytes [video]

163 points by scott_s 8y ago

Scaevolus 8y ago
Retro City Rampage for NES did something similar (32KB program ROM, 256KB graphics ROM), but the author also developed a High Level Assembler so you he could write structured code more directly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hvx4xXhZMrU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hvx4xXhZMrU
- monocasa 8y ago
  A lot of asm work back in the days was with fairly powerful macro assemblers that let you 80/20 rule yourself to fairly structured code.
- unwind 8y ago
  Well this video is about fitting all of the vertically-scrolling 4-player run-and-jump action into 40 KB, with some very neat tricks to shave and save everywhere. Really interesting if you're into low-level stuff. The NES looks kind of fun to develop for ...
  - bopbop 8y ago
    It is actually - I've done quite a bit over the past two or three years and 6502 assembly is really nice to program - it's hard to explain, but the fact it only has three registers combined with a relative ton of storage space for variables means you're constantly doing this three-card Monte shuffle that is very satisfying. It's also all eight bit, obviously, so you're also dealing with nice, human manageable numbers of 0 to 255.
Hydraulix989 8y ago
How big are they normally?
- lostgame 8y ago
  256kb, 512kb?
- firdak 8y ago
  Offical NES games were between 24KB (e.g. Excitebike) and 768KB (Kirby's Adventure) in size. The Japanese Famicom even had a 16KB game (Galaxian).
  - 0xcde4c3db 8y ago
    Famicom also had a 1024KB game (Metal Slader Glory).
mattseattle 8y ago
It's an interesting project, and I enjoyed watching the video, Thanks for sharing.
bopbop 8y ago
Haven't watched this but follow the nes dev scene closely, and I'm looking forward to this. Some other good new releases(all three of these are freely downloadable): Project blue: http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=16785 http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=16785 Star Evil and FF: http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=16993 http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=16993 For anyone interested in doing some new programming, I recommend starting with nesdougs tutorials, which'll get you started with a dev environment in c: https://nesdoug.com/ https://nesdoug.com/ And checking out forums.nesdev.com in general.
- bopbop 8y ago
  Oh and should probably mention there's another nes kickstarter on now, nebs n debs, which is looking good: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/dullahan-software/nebs-n-debs-a-new-nes-platform-game?ref=user_menu https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/dullahan-software/nebs-...
makapuf 8y ago
quick summary : (video still interesting) - optimize sprites as 8x8 tiles, use symmetry - reuse sprites / tiles with different palettes - define levels as metatiles of 32x32 made of 4x4 tiles - set levels as symmetric, use high bit of metatile indices to define rotation of each metatile line. - delta-encode hard mode wrt standard mode
Dowwie 8y ago
In addition to this talk, I recommend watching a documentary, Beep, about how musician-programmers managed to compose meaningful sounds and music in memory constrained systems. http://www.gamessound.com/ http://www.gamessound.com/

163 points by scott_s 8y ago

Retro City Rampage for NES did something similar (32KB program ROM, 256KB graphics ROM), but the author also developed a High Level Assembler so you he could write structured code more directly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hvx4xXhZMrU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hvx4xXhZMrU

monocasa 8y ago
A lot of asm work back in the days was with fairly powerful macro assemblers that let you 80/20 rule yourself to fairly structured code.
unwind 8y ago
Well this video is about fitting all of the vertically-scrolling 4-player run-and-jump action into 40 KB, with some very neat tricks to shave and save everywhere. Really interesting if you're into low-level stuff. The NES looks kind of fun to develop for ...
- bopbop 8y ago
  It is actually - I've done quite a bit over the past two or three years and 6502 assembly is really nice to program - it's hard to explain, but the fact it only has three registers combined with a relative ton of storage space for variables means you're constantly doing this three-card Monte shuffle that is very satisfying. It's also all eight bit, obviously, so you're also dealing with nice, human manageable numbers of 0 to 255.

Hydraulix989 8y ago

How big are they normally?

lostgame 8y ago
256kb, 512kb?
firdak 8y ago
Offical NES games were between 24KB (e.g. Excitebike) and 768KB (Kirby's Adventure) in size. The Japanese Famicom even had a 16KB game (Galaxian).
- 0xcde4c3db 8y ago
  Famicom also had a 1024KB game (Metal Slader Glory).

mattseattle 8y ago

It's an interesting project, and I enjoyed watching the video, Thanks for sharing.

bopbop 8y ago

Haven't watched this but follow the nes dev scene closely, and I'm looking forward to this. Some other good new releases(all three of these are freely downloadable): Project blue: http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=16785 http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=16785 Star Evil and FF: http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=16993 http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=16993 For anyone interested in doing some new programming, I recommend starting with nesdougs tutorials, which'll get you started with a dev environment in c: https://nesdoug.com/ https://nesdoug.com/ And checking out forums.nesdev.com in general.

bopbop 8y ago
Oh and should probably mention there's another nes kickstarter on now, nebs n debs, which is looking good: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/dullahan-software/nebs-n-debs-a-new-nes-platform-game?ref=user_menu https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/dullahan-software/nebs-...

makapuf 8y ago

quick summary : (video still interesting) - optimize sprites as 8x8 tiles, use symmetry - reuse sprites / tiles with different palettes - define levels as metatiles of 32x32 made of 4x4 tiles - set levels as symmetric, use high bit of metatile indices to define rotation of each metatile line. - delta-encode hard mode wrt standard mode

Dowwie 8y ago

In addition to this talk, I recommend watching a documentary, Beep, about how musician-programmers managed to compose meaningful sounds and music in memory constrained systems. http://www.gamessound.com/ http://www.gamessound.com/