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I welcome this public by default pattern. Same thing could be said from the other side, public by default is an educational problem, it's to figure out the best

by matz1 8y ago

I welcome this public by default pattern. Same thing could be said from the other side, public by default is an educational problem, it's to figure out the best practices for how to teach it to the older generation on how to adapt in the society where everything is public. To me privacy issue is better solved by radical transparency for everyone. Public by Default is a good initial step.

briandear 8y ago
Please provide a link to your latest bank statement, your last 5 years of web browsing history, full address, phone number and a link to a gallery of every photo on your phone. Perhaps your last 10 tax returns as well. Maybe a video feed of you and your family. You want “radical transparency?” Lead the way.
- matz1 8y ago
  Sure, if you give me yours as well. Ideally i want all of this to be public for everyone.
  - roywiggins 8y ago
    Doxxing everyone will have wildly disparate impacts. How many dead domestic abuse victims is it worth to achieve your ends?
    - facetube 8y ago
      How many defaced pictures of peoples' kids redistributed to harass people? FYI: I see that insane failure of human decency happening in 2018, on Facebook, in reality currently.
  - facetube 8y ago
    I volunteer to hold the data in escrow (I'd also like a detailed log of masturbatory habits as collateral, unless that's also part of the transaction). In all seriousness: you have not thought this through. It'd take weeks to explain in detail the various types of horrors such a policy would be capable of unleashing on humanity. Just... wow.
  - 394549 8y ago
    > Please provide a link to your latest bank statement, your last 5 years of web browsing history, full address, phone number and a link to a gallery of every photo on your phone. ... You want “radical transparency?” Lead the way. > Sure, if you give me yours as well. Ideally i want all of this to be public for everyone. You're the one advocating solving the privacy issue with "radical transparency for everyone." It's cowardly for you to expect others to take the risk and lead the way, especially people who don't agree with you. You go first. We'll all then follow your lead. At least put your real name, phone number, and email address in your HN profile. But if you can't put up, shut up.
    - matz1 8y ago
      I'm not interested to be the leader, but I'll support other, in this case such as what venmo did. Regardless what I did, the society seems to go toward that way anyway.
eerwrq 8y ago
> To me privacy issue is better solved by radical transparency for everyone. Human societies don't work like this, and never had. People aren't meant to live in a world where everything is public. You are advocating for a very dangerous and unhealthy transformation.
- matz1 8y ago
  Society always changing. It will not be a quick change, it will be gradual. It seem like the trend is going toward that way though.We have this expression "Information wants to be free". The advancement of technology make it easier for information to spread. Most kids today is already gradually accustomed to live where many thing is public.
  - jonahx 8y ago
    > We have this expression "Information wants to be free". This expression refers to public available information which is nevertheless copyrighted and costs money. [0] I have never in my life (before now) heard anyone seriously argue that all private information, and all personal secrets should be free. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information_wants_to_be_free https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information_wants_to_be_free
    - leetcrew 8y ago
      i always took the expression to be a valueless statement on the tendency of digital information to be widely disseminated. more "you can't stop the signal" than a moral claim.
- paulcole 8y ago
  > People aren't meant to live in a world where everything is public. You're saying this like it's a well-known fact. Is there any research or just your opinion?
bogomipz 8y ago
>" To me privacy issue is better solved by radical transparency for everyone. Public by Default is a good initial step." Transparency and privacy are orthogonal concepts. "Radical Transparency" is a management philosophy whereby everyone has access to the same information for the benefit of organizational performance[1]. Posting salary ranges or even employees salaries might be considered part of radical transparency policy. How they spend that salary in their free time is not. The latter provides zero contribution to workplace culture. I couldn't help but notice your profile doesn't contain your real name or email address or anything about you. That seems at odds with someone who claims to welcome the "Public by default" pattern no? [1] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/your-brain-work/201210/why-radical-transparency-is-good-business https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/your-brain-work/2012...
sdf43543t345 8y ago
I very deeply disagree with your sentiment. This kind of thing is about normalising authoritarian intrusion into your life, and total destruction of privacy. Radical transparency for all is the worst possible scenario -- you, me, we all have secrets; Secrets are important for business, they are important for friendship, they are important for the continued prosperity of society. There are many things that you dont have the right to know, and I have the right not to tell you. You are talking about coercively forcing all secrets into the open. I can tell you that many would not live productive, or even long lives if this was the case.
- matz1 8y ago
  I would expect transparent society would be a very different society, whether it worse, I'm not sure. I hate having to keep secret because it inconvenient and costly but unfortunately in today society is necessary.

by matz1 8y ago

briandear 8y ago

Please provide a link to your latest bank statement, your last 5 years of web browsing history, full address, phone number and a link to a gallery of every photo on your phone. Perhaps your last 10 tax returns as well. Maybe a video feed of you and your family. You want “radical transparency?” Lead the way.

matz1 8y ago
Sure, if you give me yours as well. Ideally i want all of this to be public for everyone.
- roywiggins 8y ago
  Doxxing everyone will have wildly disparate impacts. How many dead domestic abuse victims is it worth to achieve your ends?
  - facetube 8y ago
    How many defaced pictures of peoples' kids redistributed to harass people? FYI: I see that insane failure of human decency happening in 2018, on Facebook, in reality currently.
- facetube 8y ago
  I volunteer to hold the data in escrow (I'd also like a detailed log of masturbatory habits as collateral, unless that's also part of the transaction). In all seriousness: you have not thought this through. It'd take weeks to explain in detail the various types of horrors such a policy would be capable of unleashing on humanity. Just... wow.
- 394549 8y ago
  > Please provide a link to your latest bank statement, your last 5 years of web browsing history, full address, phone number and a link to a gallery of every photo on your phone. ... You want “radical transparency?” Lead the way. > Sure, if you give me yours as well. Ideally i want all of this to be public for everyone. You're the one advocating solving the privacy issue with "radical transparency for everyone." It's cowardly for you to expect others to take the risk and lead the way, especially people who don't agree with you. You go first. We'll all then follow your lead. At least put your real name, phone number, and email address in your HN profile. But if you can't put up, shut up.
  - matz1 8y ago
    I'm not interested to be the leader, but I'll support other, in this case such as what venmo did. Regardless what I did, the society seems to go toward that way anyway.

eerwrq 8y ago

> To me privacy issue is better solved by radical transparency for everyone. Human societies don't work like this, and never had. People aren't meant to live in a world where everything is public. You are advocating for a very dangerous and unhealthy transformation.

matz1 8y ago
Society always changing. It will not be a quick change, it will be gradual. It seem like the trend is going toward that way though.We have this expression "Information wants to be free". The advancement of technology make it easier for information to spread. Most kids today is already gradually accustomed to live where many thing is public.
- jonahx 8y ago
  > We have this expression "Information wants to be free". This expression refers to public available information which is nevertheless copyrighted and costs money. [0] I have never in my life (before now) heard anyone seriously argue that all private information, and all personal secrets should be free. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information_wants_to_be_free https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information_wants_to_be_free
  - leetcrew 8y ago
    i always took the expression to be a valueless statement on the tendency of digital information to be widely disseminated. more "you can't stop the signal" than a moral claim.
paulcole 8y ago
> People aren't meant to live in a world where everything is public. You're saying this like it's a well-known fact. Is there any research or just your opinion?

bogomipz 8y ago

>" To me privacy issue is better solved by radical transparency for everyone. Public by Default is a good initial step." Transparency and privacy are orthogonal concepts. "Radical Transparency" is a management philosophy whereby everyone has access to the same information for the benefit of organizational performance[1]. Posting salary ranges or even employees salaries might be considered part of radical transparency policy. How they spend that salary in their free time is not. The latter provides zero contribution to workplace culture. I couldn't help but notice your profile doesn't contain your real name or email address or anything about you. That seems at odds with someone who claims to welcome the "Public by default" pattern no? [1] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/your-brain-work/201210/why-radical-transparency-is-good-business https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/your-brain-work/2012...

sdf43543t345 8y ago

I very deeply disagree with your sentiment. This kind of thing is about normalising authoritarian intrusion into your life, and total destruction of privacy. Radical transparency for all is the worst possible scenario -- you, me, we all have secrets; Secrets are important for business, they are important for friendship, they are important for the continued prosperity of society. There are many things that you dont have the right to know, and I have the right not to tell you. You are talking about coercively forcing all secrets into the open. I can tell you that many would not live productive, or even long lives if this was the case.

matz1 8y ago
I would expect transparent society would be a very different society, whether it worse, I'm not sure. I hate having to keep secret because it inconvenient and costly but unfortunately in today society is necessary.