4 ms·

It's different when a phone-level tracking suddenly appears on your desktop. No privacy-minded person was using Android before, but they used Windows. Now they

by bitL 8y ago

It's different when a phone-level tracking suddenly appears on your desktop. No privacy-minded person was using Android before, but they used Windows. Now they don't.

Brakenshire 8y ago
On the other hand, having access to phone data is exceptionally invasive. Location, accelerometer, contacts, call history, browsing history, all combined.
- amelius 8y ago
  Don't forget camera and mic.
close04 8y ago
This just proves how little understanding and tech education most users have (still doesn't stop them from having strong opinions on this though). Android data collection which has been happening for close to a decade is orders of magnitude more intrusive than what Microsoft does with basic telemetry. Yet most people see MS as bad and embrace Google for being "ethical". A classic case of "guess what".
- nojvek 8y ago
  I don’t think people are seeing Google as “not evil”. Google most probably has a much larger reserve of everyone’s dirty laundry. Most android users just don’t realize how invasive the entire OS is and there is little they can do about it. It sucks thah Apple is the only tech company that gives a shit about privacy seriously. We definitely need more pro-privacy choice.
  - fencepost 8y ago
    Google most probably has a much larger reserve of everyone’s dirty laundry. Like a record of every website you've gone to that uses JS served fast and free from Google, fonts served fast and free from Google, on-site search by Google (complete with a logo most likely served direct from Google), etc. And that ignores the most obvious: Google Analytics, where in addition to telling webmasters # of distinct visitors to the site, for each of those visitors they can track "Visited site X" for their own internal use.
- HillaryBriss 8y ago
  > most people see MS as bad and embrace Google for being "ethical". IDK if it's just me, but I've seen an above-average number of news stories in the last year about how Google is not a consumer-friendly, trustworthy company now. The general public is, I guess, becoming more and more aware of this perspective. We've certainly heard a lot about Facebook's privacy breaches and other problems. As a tech company, Google's reputation is probably hurt by that too. It seems to me that Google has probably entered a new public relations era. And it's pretty hard to go back to the old days where consumers believed in "Don't Be Evil."
- jchw 8y ago
  Microsoft added a bunch of hooks to get your location and track offline searches without adding almost any usefulness. Privacy advocates definitely hate Google's location tracking, but Google made it into a feature with the location timeline. Does Microsoft even let me see what searches or locations I've shared with them?
  - reaperducer 8y ago
    Google made it into a feature with the location timeline. Does Microsoft even let me see what searches or locations I've shared with them? The point of the article is that Google is storing your location outside of the Location Timeline, and labeling it in ways that don't plainly indicate that's what's going on.
  - iokanuon 8y ago
    Additionally, it has pretty much been a feature before, because tracking was used to implement the "live traffic" feature in Maps and create their WiFi AP to physical location database.
  - golf1052 8y ago
    Yeah, Microsoft created a dashboard last year that let's you view all the privacy info they have on you https://www.engadget.com/2017/01/10/microsoft-privacy-dashboard/ https://www.engadget.com/2017/01/10/microsoft-privacy-dashbo...
    - jchw 8y ago
      Oh, that's pretty cool. I want to try this when I get home. I think it would help me sleep easier with my Windows installs, though I don't know if any of them are logged into Microsoft accounts anymore.
- jimmy1 8y ago
  The flip side, and I bet more people see it this way than you think: I see the value and fruits of the labor for the data collection Google does on me: Unlimited storage emails and photos, the absolute best mapping application on the market completely free, the best search engine on the market completely free, most of their developer APIs like google reverse geocoding completely free for modest traffic, realtime traffic updates completely free, office products completely free, etc. What did Microsoft give me? Locked down ecosystem, a subpar OS, expensive office products, and a paid-for vendor specific development ecosystem that is frequently becoming just a copier of the emergent industry trends, and a feigned attempt to embrace open source (capture market share) with cringeworthy bumperstickers displaying "Microsoft Hearts Open Source"
mtgx 8y ago
It's not different at all. It's just that on mobile the "frog" has been sufficiently boiled before this happened. Didn't Google deny something like this very recently saying it was an "error" (Facebook's favorite excuse, too), though?
- bitL 8y ago
  "Judgement error" I guess. But with phones after destruction of privacy-minded Nokia there was basically no alternative, and they executed marketing flawlessly, having both geeks and normies desiring their phones, stuffed with tracking.
TeMPOraL 8y ago
Let's not also forget the pretty much forced upgrade from Windows 8 to Windows 10. That really registered; I even saw my non-tech family members notice how the system tries to trick them into upgrade; this really made people curious about the purpose of "telemetry" in the system ("they wouldn't be forcing us to upgrade if they weren't making money off spying on us").
- beenBoutIT 8y ago
  No one chooses to use Windows, Windows is a disease. Parents spread it to their kids and schools force it upon their students.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    People choose Windows to get office work done. In a sense, this is forced by everyone else using Windows too, but this kind of "forcing" is common everywhere in life.
    - beenBoutIT 8y ago
      A lot of kids get forced into Windows through their schools.
  - jevgeni 8y ago
    I chose Windows as a development and creative machine. Visual Studio and .Net are great for what I do.

by bitL 8y ago

It's different when a phone-level tracking suddenly appears on your desktop. No privacy-minded person was using Android before, but they used Windows. Now they don't.

Brakenshire 8y ago

On the other hand, having access to phone data is exceptionally invasive. Location, accelerometer, contacts, call history, browsing history, all combined.

amelius 8y ago
Don't forget camera and mic.

close04 8y ago

This just proves how little understanding and tech education most users have (still doesn't stop them from having strong opinions on this though). Android data collection which has been happening for close to a decade is orders of magnitude more intrusive than what Microsoft does with basic telemetry. Yet most people see MS as bad and embrace Google for being "ethical". A classic case of "guess what".

nojvek 8y ago
I don’t think people are seeing Google as “not evil”. Google most probably has a much larger reserve of everyone’s dirty laundry. Most android users just don’t realize how invasive the entire OS is and there is little they can do about it. It sucks thah Apple is the only tech company that gives a shit about privacy seriously. We definitely need more pro-privacy choice.
- fencepost 8y ago
  Google most probably has a much larger reserve of everyone’s dirty laundry. Like a record of every website you've gone to that uses JS served fast and free from Google, fonts served fast and free from Google, on-site search by Google (complete with a logo most likely served direct from Google), etc. And that ignores the most obvious: Google Analytics, where in addition to telling webmasters # of distinct visitors to the site, for each of those visitors they can track "Visited site X" for their own internal use.
HillaryBriss 8y ago
> most people see MS as bad and embrace Google for being "ethical". IDK if it's just me, but I've seen an above-average number of news stories in the last year about how Google is not a consumer-friendly, trustworthy company now. The general public is, I guess, becoming more and more aware of this perspective. We've certainly heard a lot about Facebook's privacy breaches and other problems. As a tech company, Google's reputation is probably hurt by that too. It seems to me that Google has probably entered a new public relations era. And it's pretty hard to go back to the old days where consumers believed in "Don't Be Evil."
jchw 8y ago
Microsoft added a bunch of hooks to get your location and track offline searches without adding almost any usefulness. Privacy advocates definitely hate Google's location tracking, but Google made it into a feature with the location timeline. Does Microsoft even let me see what searches or locations I've shared with them?
- reaperducer 8y ago
  Google made it into a feature with the location timeline. Does Microsoft even let me see what searches or locations I've shared with them? The point of the article is that Google is storing your location outside of the Location Timeline, and labeling it in ways that don't plainly indicate that's what's going on.
- iokanuon 8y ago
  Additionally, it has pretty much been a feature before, because tracking was used to implement the "live traffic" feature in Maps and create their WiFi AP to physical location database.
- golf1052 8y ago
  Yeah, Microsoft created a dashboard last year that let's you view all the privacy info they have on you https://www.engadget.com/2017/01/10/microsoft-privacy-dashboard/ https://www.engadget.com/2017/01/10/microsoft-privacy-dashbo...
  - jchw 8y ago
    Oh, that's pretty cool. I want to try this when I get home. I think it would help me sleep easier with my Windows installs, though I don't know if any of them are logged into Microsoft accounts anymore.
jimmy1 8y ago
The flip side, and I bet more people see it this way than you think: I see the value and fruits of the labor for the data collection Google does on me: Unlimited storage emails and photos, the absolute best mapping application on the market completely free, the best search engine on the market completely free, most of their developer APIs like google reverse geocoding completely free for modest traffic, realtime traffic updates completely free, office products completely free, etc. What did Microsoft give me? Locked down ecosystem, a subpar OS, expensive office products, and a paid-for vendor specific development ecosystem that is frequently becoming just a copier of the emergent industry trends, and a feigned attempt to embrace open source (capture market share) with cringeworthy bumperstickers displaying "Microsoft Hearts Open Source"

mtgx 8y ago

It's not different at all. It's just that on mobile the "frog" has been sufficiently boiled before this happened. Didn't Google deny something like this very recently saying it was an "error" (Facebook's favorite excuse, too), though?

bitL 8y ago
"Judgement error" I guess. But with phones after destruction of privacy-minded Nokia there was basically no alternative, and they executed marketing flawlessly, having both geeks and normies desiring their phones, stuffed with tracking.

TeMPOraL 8y ago

Let's not also forget the pretty much forced upgrade from Windows 8 to Windows 10. That really registered; I even saw my non-tech family members notice how the system tries to trick them into upgrade; this really made people curious about the purpose of "telemetry" in the system ("they wouldn't be forcing us to upgrade if they weren't making money off spying on us").

beenBoutIT 8y ago
No one chooses to use Windows, Windows is a disease. Parents spread it to their kids and schools force it upon their students.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  People choose Windows to get office work done. In a sense, this is forced by everyone else using Windows too, but this kind of "forcing" is common everywhere in life.
  - beenBoutIT 8y ago
    A lot of kids get forced into Windows through their schools.
- jevgeni 8y ago
  I chose Windows as a development and creative machine. Visual Studio and .Net are great for what I do.