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I wonder if China will be forced to encourage immigration. Illegal immigration is apparently already growing rapidly. Companies can’t find workers anymore so t

I wonder if China will be forced to encourage immigration. Illegal immigration is apparently already growing rapidly. Companies can’t find workers anymore so they start smuggling in people to do the job At some point this illegal stream will become so large that one has to consider legalization.

toomuchtodo 8y ago
Automation will always be a superior option to immigration. You own the tech you develop, and you don’t have to be comfortable with your nation’s culture changing due to mass immigration. Japan is starting to crack a bit on this front (allowing immigrants in), but China has the resources to see such a policy succeed. It also behooves them to develop these technologies as part of their China 2025 campaign.
- gambiting 8y ago
  What's cheaper - a Burger-Flip'O-Tron for a million dollars + an expensive maintenance contract, or a $500/month migrant worker who you can replace for any reason whatsoever and find another one happy to take their job? Remember that in those countries labour is incredibly cheap and no, automation is not a superior option to immigration.
  - lamarpye 8y ago
    It's cheaper for your made-up model. I can make up one where it is more expensive.
  - toomuchtodo 8y ago
    Migrants who don’t want to assimilate into your culture are far more expensive than the labor costs you’re saving.
    - shard972 8y ago
      Very true, especially now when successful integration rates seems to be plummeting as we see 3rd generation immigrants reverting back to the anti-social behaviours that exist in the countries they come from. Also when you consider migrants are much more likely to send money back home, you have to ask what about the costs of having workers who don't then spend that money in your own economy? How can you have these multiplication effects if the money being made isn't even re-injected?
      - matheusmoreira 8y ago
        > 3rd generation immigrants reverting back to the anti-social behaviours that exist in the countries they come from. Can you expand on this?
        shard972 8y ago
        It's something that is not easy to find information on due to the sensitive nature of the subject. But with just a bit of google, you can find things like this: https://www.thelocal.fr/20160109/immigrants-struggling-to-integrate-in-france https://www.thelocal.fr/20160109/immigrants-struggling-to-in... The article there seems to be saying even with 2nd generation immigrants from africa are reporting less integration as they feel more isolated from the identity than their parents and find themselves worse off economically. So if this is the case, I don't see any reasons why the 3rd generation and onwards would suddenly bounce back from their isolated and relatively poor positions on their own without more intervention from the host nation. Combine that with new waves of immigration, why wouldn't you see some of these 3rd generation ethnic africans find new identity in the africans that have just showed up?
  - shard972 8y ago
    > What's cheaper - a Burger-Flip'O-Tron for a million dollars + an expensive maintenance contract, or a $500/month migrant worker who you can replace for any reason whatsoever and find another one happy to take their job? What is cheaper, hiring a plumber to fix your shower for $200 or getting your slave you pay with rations fix it? Maybe we should just bring slavery back, so much cheaper.
analyst74 8y ago
China actually is in the process of establishing immigration agency and relevant laws/policies to encourage immigration. https://www.scmp.com/news/china/policies-politics/article/2137058/new-immigration-bureau-set-handle-growing-number https://www.scmp.com/news/china/policies-politics/article/21...
- seanmcdirmid 8y ago
  That has always been true for the last 10 years at least, at least they’ve been talking about it. When it actually happens will be notable however.
ospider 8y ago
As far as the history shows, China has never been an immigration country, unless the home of immigrates were conquered by China.

toomuchtodo 8y ago

Automation will always be a superior option to immigration. You own the tech you develop, and you don’t have to be comfortable with your nation’s culture changing due to mass immigration. Japan is starting to crack a bit on this front (allowing immigrants in), but China has the resources to see such a policy succeed. It also behooves them to develop these technologies as part of their China 2025 campaign.

gambiting 8y ago
What's cheaper - a Burger-Flip'O-Tron for a million dollars + an expensive maintenance contract, or a $500/month migrant worker who you can replace for any reason whatsoever and find another one happy to take their job? Remember that in those countries labour is incredibly cheap and no, automation is not a superior option to immigration.
- lamarpye 8y ago
  It's cheaper for your made-up model. I can make up one where it is more expensive.
- toomuchtodo 8y ago
  Migrants who don’t want to assimilate into your culture are far more expensive than the labor costs you’re saving.
  - shard972 8y ago
    Very true, especially now when successful integration rates seems to be plummeting as we see 3rd generation immigrants reverting back to the anti-social behaviours that exist in the countries they come from. Also when you consider migrants are much more likely to send money back home, you have to ask what about the costs of having workers who don't then spend that money in your own economy? How can you have these multiplication effects if the money being made isn't even re-injected?
    - matheusmoreira 8y ago
      > 3rd generation immigrants reverting back to the anti-social behaviours that exist in the countries they come from. Can you expand on this?
      - shard972 8y ago
        It's something that is not easy to find information on due to the sensitive nature of the subject. But with just a bit of google, you can find things like this: https://www.thelocal.fr/20160109/immigrants-struggling-to-integrate-in-france https://www.thelocal.fr/20160109/immigrants-struggling-to-in... The article there seems to be saying even with 2nd generation immigrants from africa are reporting less integration as they feel more isolated from the identity than their parents and find themselves worse off economically. So if this is the case, I don't see any reasons why the 3rd generation and onwards would suddenly bounce back from their isolated and relatively poor positions on their own without more intervention from the host nation. Combine that with new waves of immigration, why wouldn't you see some of these 3rd generation ethnic africans find new identity in the africans that have just showed up?
- shard972 8y ago
  > What's cheaper - a Burger-Flip'O-Tron for a million dollars + an expensive maintenance contract, or a $500/month migrant worker who you can replace for any reason whatsoever and find another one happy to take their job? What is cheaper, hiring a plumber to fix your shower for $200 or getting your slave you pay with rations fix it? Maybe we should just bring slavery back, so much cheaper.

analyst74 8y ago

China actually is in the process of establishing immigration agency and relevant laws/policies to encourage immigration. https://www.scmp.com/news/china/policies-politics/article/2137058/new-immigration-bureau-set-handle-growing-number https://www.scmp.com/news/china/policies-politics/article/21...

seanmcdirmid 8y ago
That has always been true for the last 10 years at least, at least they’ve been talking about it. When it actually happens will be notable however.

ospider 8y ago

As far as the history shows, China has never been an immigration country, unless the home of immigrates were conquered by China.