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Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented? In natural conditions, I'd expect peopl

Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented? In natural conditions, I'd expect people who sweat more to actually be more comfortable with natural airflow causing evaporative cooling. Unfortunately, in modern well sealed buildings with little air flow, this adaptation would be counterproductive. It sounds like this building was an experiment aimed at rediscovering what a natural air flow would feel like in an office environment. I love my AC, personally, but I'd still be curious to see what 78 feels like in that building, it might not be so bad. I do enjoy working outside on the patio when it's warm out with a nice cool breeze.

electrograv 8y ago
> Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented? Absolutely, unquestionably, YES! (Certainly for some people). Those sufficiently uncomfortable would migrate to climates better suited to their physiology, if their physiology didn’t adapt to the environment; for example, my ancestors were from extreme cold environments, and I am without a doubt FAR more comfortable in 50 degree F weather in a T shirt than I am in 70 degree weather. And to me with the right clothing, everything down to and even below freezing is quite pleasant. Prior to much modern technology, just surviving and staying alive as a human was a miserable, painful experience. We have it so, so good today, compared to our ancestors just a hundred years ago, let alone thousands. Virtually every measure of human suffering (extreme poverty, starvation, sickness, death, etc) is dramatically lowering with each generation. It is a wonderful thing that modern advancements allows us to be comfortable, which then further frees our minds to pursue even greater and more wonderful endeavors.
irrational 8y ago
> Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented? Isn't that like asking "Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable using the outhouse in the middle of winter before indoor plumbing was invented?" Uh, yeah. Life before AC, indoor plumbing, electricity, refrigeration, etc. sucked hard.
- tangentspace 8y ago
  I lived in a cabin in Fairbanks, Alaska with no indoor plumbing and an outhouse. My wife is from Siberia and her house didn't have plumbing until the 90's. Going to the outhouse at 50 below in the middle of the night wasn't terribly uncomfortable, because I put on a jacket and gloves. A bit inconvenient, but not terrible. Neither me or my wife feel like that lifestyle "sucked hard", although it certainly had challenges. Now we have a nice house in an affluent suburb and have plenty of luxuries, yet this lifestyle also has its challenges. Whether or not it sucks seems largely a matter of mindset and perspective.
  - toomuchtodo 8y ago
    A car not starting in slightly below freezing weather is a challenge. You’ll be hard pressed to find someone in the developed world who doesn’t think going to an outhouse at 50 below isn’t “sucking hard”. Without speaking for others, there isn’t any scenario I’d consider where running water and flush toilets aren’t available and within where I reside.
    - tangentspace 8y ago
      Having my car not start in Fairbanks was much, much more challenging than the outhouse. It took a lot of vigilance to make sure the battery stayed warm enough to hold a charge. I had to install heaters on my battery, engine, and transmission and remember to plug them in every single time I stopped the engine. If there was not a place to plug in, we left the car idling. If the car died, we were risking injury or even death from frostbite or hypothermia. That was a very serious challenge to have to deal with on a daily basis. The outhouse, on the other hand, was almost zero maintenance. The only cleaning I had to do was occasional sweeping. It was nicely made from cedar wood with plenty of natural ventilation (no door), it never smelt terrible or felt disgusting. It takes a lot of work and money to make an indoor bathroom stay as nice as my outhouse was naturally. I agree that you will find very many people in the developed world who think that going to an outhouse at 50 below would probably suck hard, but relatively few of them have first-hand experience so that's a hypothetical situation for them. In Alaska you can certainly find plenty of people who voluntarily live this way. Not out of poverty or being a total recluse, but because the negative parts simply don't turn out to be as bad as it might seem before you've tried it, and the positive experiences associated with living closer to nature are deeply rewarding.
syshum 8y ago
Do I care if "people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented?"... No, No I do not. We have AC now, lets use it I do not have the desire to Sweat all day every day in my office while I am attempting to use a computer or do my work I do not have the desire to have my body be cooled by "natural airflow causing evaporative cooling" caused by my profuse uncomfortable and unsightly sweating over everything I do not have the this desire, what I have a desire for is Air Conditioning, a modern convenience that human invented so we would no longer need to use "natural airflow causing evaporative cooling"
- tangentspace 8y ago
  So do you just stay inside all day because of AC? I blast the AC all day long at the office, in the car, and at home, but on the weekend I feel like getting out! I like going for a hike, or on a bike ride, or going swimming. Yeah, I sweat, then a breeze hits and it feels awesome. This evaporative cooling business isn't total bullshit.
  - expounded 8y ago
    Not the person you asked but yes, yes I do. For me anything above 21 C (~70 F) and sunny is uncomfortable miserable for me. I am serious. Everybody seems to enjoy the sunlight and talk about how depressed they get in the winters when it’s dark but I have the exact 100% opposite. During the summers I can’t go outside. Like, it’s not physically impossible and I can tolerate going outside long enough to walk to the store and so on, but the thought of “enjoying my time outside in the warm summer sun” elucidates the same thoughts that you’d get if I asked you to stick your hand inside a garbage disposal. I’m not even being hyperbolic right now. The thought of being outside when it’s sunny and 21+ degrees seriously shuts me down entirely. I’m basically depressed all summer and spring because of the sun, because of the temperature. I’m depressed because it means I cant go outside and enjoy the things I enjoy in the fall and winter: going on long bike rides, trail running, hiking and camping, etc. For whatever reason, the moment the bright sun shines in my face or the first bead of sweat beads up on my body I just 100% shut down. Nothing is fun anymore. Nothing is enjoyable anymore. I’ve spoken with several therapists to try to get some help with this and nothing people say or tell me has helped. It doesn’t help that everybody things I’m just being a big baby either. But come fall and winter, I f-king love live. I love waking up before the sun rises and getting in a nice 30 minute run in the dark. I love getting into work when it’s dark and leaving work when it’s dark. I love walking around town or visiting nearby cities (Europe) in the winter because I’m not sweating the entire time. I love feeling the super cold wind hit me as I’m cycling long 20+ km rides. In the spring and summer I love being outside on the days when it’s overcast, gray, raining aka “depressing weather.” It doesn’t bother me at all. I love looking outside my office windows or my living room window and seeing gray clouds all day every day. In the winters I can wear T-shirt’s down to ~5 C, and I can wear just a hoodie and jeans down to the negatives as long as I have gloves. I would love it if I could stand being in the sun, being in the warmth, but I can’t and I’ve tried. Like a lot of people have wrote: you can always wear more clothes. You can always light the place up. You can always use an umbrella. What can I do when it’s unbearbly hot and sunny and I’m already wearing shorts and a T-shirt? Absolutely nothing.
seanmcdirmid 8y ago
Yes, of course. If you want to experience that, just go and work in China where many offices in the north lack AC and many in the south lack heat. Your productivity will simply plummet in either case (you can’t code very well with freezing fingers or sweaty arms). I think in the ost they just took the oroductivit hit in stride (well, white collar work wasn’t as common).
phil21 8y ago
> Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented? Yes, absolutely. I grew up without AC and now I jokingly tell my fiance my entire career has been motivated to ensure I maintain access to AC the rest of my life. I grew up in a very cold place (MN) compared to most - the cold didn't matter much to me. I'm a t-shirt in 40 degree weather sort of guy. The hot summer months were absolute utter hell though, even with fans and sleeping in the basement/etc. To this day I think this had a huge effect on my sleeping patterns and thus other health problems later on in life. I do think one of the elephants in the room is the obesity issue. I certainly have noticed I get a lot hotter with 40lbs extra on me. When the average American is overweight I'm sure this has moved the "herd preference temperature" down a couple degrees the past few decades.

electrograv 8y ago

> Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented? Absolutely, unquestionably, YES! (Certainly for some people). Those sufficiently uncomfortable would migrate to climates better suited to their physiology, if their physiology didn’t adapt to the environment; for example, my ancestors were from extreme cold environments, and I am without a doubt FAR more comfortable in 50 degree F weather in a T shirt than I am in 70 degree weather. And to me with the right clothing, everything down to and even below freezing is quite pleasant. Prior to much modern technology, just surviving and staying alive as a human was a miserable, painful experience. We have it so, so good today, compared to our ancestors just a hundred years ago, let alone thousands. Virtually every measure of human suffering (extreme poverty, starvation, sickness, death, etc) is dramatically lowering with each generation. It is a wonderful thing that modern advancements allows us to be comfortable, which then further frees our minds to pursue even greater and more wonderful endeavors.

irrational 8y ago

> Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented? Isn't that like asking "Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable using the outhouse in the middle of winter before indoor plumbing was invented?" Uh, yeah. Life before AC, indoor plumbing, electricity, refrigeration, etc. sucked hard.

tangentspace 8y ago
I lived in a cabin in Fairbanks, Alaska with no indoor plumbing and an outhouse. My wife is from Siberia and her house didn't have plumbing until the 90's. Going to the outhouse at 50 below in the middle of the night wasn't terribly uncomfortable, because I put on a jacket and gloves. A bit inconvenient, but not terrible. Neither me or my wife feel like that lifestyle "sucked hard", although it certainly had challenges. Now we have a nice house in an affluent suburb and have plenty of luxuries, yet this lifestyle also has its challenges. Whether or not it sucks seems largely a matter of mindset and perspective.
- toomuchtodo 8y ago
  A car not starting in slightly below freezing weather is a challenge. You’ll be hard pressed to find someone in the developed world who doesn’t think going to an outhouse at 50 below isn’t “sucking hard”. Without speaking for others, there isn’t any scenario I’d consider where running water and flush toilets aren’t available and within where I reside.
  - tangentspace 8y ago
    Having my car not start in Fairbanks was much, much more challenging than the outhouse. It took a lot of vigilance to make sure the battery stayed warm enough to hold a charge. I had to install heaters on my battery, engine, and transmission and remember to plug them in every single time I stopped the engine. If there was not a place to plug in, we left the car idling. If the car died, we were risking injury or even death from frostbite or hypothermia. That was a very serious challenge to have to deal with on a daily basis. The outhouse, on the other hand, was almost zero maintenance. The only cleaning I had to do was occasional sweeping. It was nicely made from cedar wood with plenty of natural ventilation (no door), it never smelt terrible or felt disgusting. It takes a lot of work and money to make an indoor bathroom stay as nice as my outhouse was naturally. I agree that you will find very many people in the developed world who think that going to an outhouse at 50 below would probably suck hard, but relatively few of them have first-hand experience so that's a hypothetical situation for them. In Alaska you can certainly find plenty of people who voluntarily live this way. Not out of poverty or being a total recluse, but because the negative parts simply don't turn out to be as bad as it might seem before you've tried it, and the positive experiences associated with living closer to nature are deeply rewarding.

syshum 8y ago

Do I care if "people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented?"... No, No I do not. We have AC now, lets use it I do not have the desire to Sweat all day every day in my office while I am attempting to use a computer or do my work I do not have the desire to have my body be cooled by "natural airflow causing evaporative cooling" caused by my profuse uncomfortable and unsightly sweating over everything I do not have the this desire, what I have a desire for is Air Conditioning, a modern convenience that human invented so we would no longer need to use "natural airflow causing evaporative cooling"

tangentspace 8y ago
So do you just stay inside all day because of AC? I blast the AC all day long at the office, in the car, and at home, but on the weekend I feel like getting out! I like going for a hike, or on a bike ride, or going swimming. Yeah, I sweat, then a breeze hits and it feels awesome. This evaporative cooling business isn't total bullshit.
- expounded 8y ago
  Not the person you asked but yes, yes I do. For me anything above 21 C (~70 F) and sunny is uncomfortable miserable for me. I am serious. Everybody seems to enjoy the sunlight and talk about how depressed they get in the winters when it’s dark but I have the exact 100% opposite. During the summers I can’t go outside. Like, it’s not physically impossible and I can tolerate going outside long enough to walk to the store and so on, but the thought of “enjoying my time outside in the warm summer sun” elucidates the same thoughts that you’d get if I asked you to stick your hand inside a garbage disposal. I’m not even being hyperbolic right now. The thought of being outside when it’s sunny and 21+ degrees seriously shuts me down entirely. I’m basically depressed all summer and spring because of the sun, because of the temperature. I’m depressed because it means I cant go outside and enjoy the things I enjoy in the fall and winter: going on long bike rides, trail running, hiking and camping, etc. For whatever reason, the moment the bright sun shines in my face or the first bead of sweat beads up on my body I just 100% shut down. Nothing is fun anymore. Nothing is enjoyable anymore. I’ve spoken with several therapists to try to get some help with this and nothing people say or tell me has helped. It doesn’t help that everybody things I’m just being a big baby either. But come fall and winter, I f-king love live. I love waking up before the sun rises and getting in a nice 30 minute run in the dark. I love getting into work when it’s dark and leaving work when it’s dark. I love walking around town or visiting nearby cities (Europe) in the winter because I’m not sweating the entire time. I love feeling the super cold wind hit me as I’m cycling long 20+ km rides. In the spring and summer I love being outside on the days when it’s overcast, gray, raining aka “depressing weather.” It doesn’t bother me at all. I love looking outside my office windows or my living room window and seeing gray clouds all day every day. In the winters I can wear T-shirt’s down to ~5 C, and I can wear just a hoodie and jeans down to the negatives as long as I have gloves. I would love it if I could stand being in the sun, being in the warmth, but I can’t and I’ve tried. Like a lot of people have wrote: you can always wear more clothes. You can always light the place up. You can always use an umbrella. What can I do when it’s unbearbly hot and sunny and I’m already wearing shorts and a T-shirt? Absolutely nothing.

seanmcdirmid 8y ago

Yes, of course. If you want to experience that, just go and work in China where many offices in the north lack AC and many in the south lack heat. Your productivity will simply plummet in either case (you can’t code very well with freezing fingers or sweaty arms). I think in the ost they just took the oroductivit hit in stride (well, white collar work wasn’t as common).

phil21 8y ago

> Do you think people were terribly uncomfortable at ambient temperatures due to their physiology before AC was invented? Yes, absolutely. I grew up without AC and now I jokingly tell my fiance my entire career has been motivated to ensure I maintain access to AC the rest of my life. I grew up in a very cold place (MN) compared to most - the cold didn't matter much to me. I'm a t-shirt in 40 degree weather sort of guy. The hot summer months were absolute utter hell though, even with fans and sleeping in the basement/etc. To this day I think this had a huge effect on my sleeping patterns and thus other health problems later on in life. I do think one of the elephants in the room is the obesity issue. I certainly have noticed I get a lot hotter with 40lbs extra on me. When the average American is overweight I'm sure this has moved the "herd preference temperature" down a couple degrees the past few decades.