6 ms·

My Mac Mini

24 points by ashu 18y ago

ssharp 18y ago
Pretty common complaints about the actual OS for people who are used to windows. You just have to get used to the idea that windows float and that it's not really designed to have windows maximized. I was pretty used to the interface after a month or so, I started in late 2003, so Panther was out by then and Expose helped out a lot. I have to disagree with running 2 monitors, I've done it for a couple years now and have never had any usability issues. However, the Apple store comments are pretty much dead-on. I'd rather just order online or go to a reseller then deal with the Apple Store.
- abstractbill 18y ago
  it's not really designed to have windows maximized I've heard this line before - people say it as if something disastrous would happen if Apple gave in and made the green '+' a maximize button... so far nothing's coming to mind. (btw, I haven't used windows for anything other than testing IE for about 9 years, and I still hate Apple's choice regarding the 'zoom' button).
  - TheWama 18y ago
    The disastrous thing is that it would be less useful to have a maximized window be 10x the size of its contents. For example, IMO the behavior of safari on maximize is just beautiful, because it's tailored to the specific website you're viewing. If the application is a window into your data, why make that window bigger than necessary, thus obscuring your desktop, or some other window behind it? That may not be disastrous, but I think its intent makes sense. Without further explanation, I end up suspecting that when he writes: "it almost never does what you’d want or expect it to," the emphasis is on his expectations as a Windows user, not on what he would prefer, all things being equal. [and for the record, I'm speaking as an Ubuntu user, who has never owned a mac]
    - abstractbill 18y ago
      I want to obscure my desktop, and all the other windows. Why would I want that stuff in my peripheral vision when I'm busy working?
      - demallien 18y ago
        In which case you simply hit Cmd-Shift-H (or select 'Hide Others' in the app menu), which hides all but the active application... Personally though, I generally just use Spaces to have different screens containing only applications that I want to use together. So I'll have a programming doc open in Preview, next to my XCode project window. Or I'll have a web browser open with Textmate if I'm doing something with Rails. That way you only have the apps that you are interested in on screen in any given 'space'. Next quibble?
        menloparkbum 18y ago
        Cmd-Shift-H actually sends you "home" if that option is available. Opt-Shift-H hides others. The lame thing about hide others is there isn't a built in key command to show all.
        demallien 18y ago
        Lol, actually we're both wrong. It's Opt-Cmd-H... At least it is when using French keyboards...
        menloparkbum 18y ago
        whoops... yeah, that's it.
        abstractbill 18y ago
        This is what my desktop looks like for more than 90% of the time: http://abstractnonsense.com/desktop.png http://abstractnonsense.com/desktop.png If emacs wasn't taking up the whole screen, I'd have a scrollbar running down the middle of the screen, which would be really visually distracting. I used virtual desktops a lot back when I used Linux for my desktop os. They're great, and I'm sure I'll use them again when I upgrade from Tiger. But, for me at least, they're no substitute for maximization.
rms 18y ago
Matt, I think you should try Ubuntu for comparison purposes.
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  I probably will soon.
- PStamatiou 18y ago
  i keep thinking you're richard stallman ;-) .. was the username intended as such?
  - rms 18y ago
    It was intended to be funny and ironic, I'm definitely not trying to impersonate the great rms. It originated as an abbreviation for "rupert murdoch sucks."
petercooper 18y ago
I thought this post was satire until about 75% of the way down.. That said, his point about installing programs is spot on for people from the Windows world. It makes sense in a UNIX-y way, but it's totally counterintuitive if you've come from Windows. I found it odd the first time, then grew to love it.
- ashu 18y ago
  Ubuntu/Debian which is more UNIX-y than MacOS in some ways has none of this. Software installation and uninstallation is a breeze. In my 2 months of experience with the Mac, I have found that the Mac is very appealing when it's new. It's beautiful, but sometimes it feels like Steve Jobs prefers form over function a bit too much.
- goofygrin 18y ago
  How in the hell do you think that dragging files to an "Applications" folder is unix-y? Ubuntu: Synaptic or "sudo apt-get install xyz" Fedora: "yum install xyz" Certainly don't see any goofy dragging app files around here.
  - mrtron 18y ago
    Oh dear god. Using a package manager or manually grabbing the files and building it IS basically like dragging files to an Applications folder. You have all your files for an app in one known spot. That's all there is (excluding environment variables). What is non-unixy is installing a bunch of garbage into a registry (did I mention I hate registries?).
    - goofygrin 18y ago
      No, using a package manager where you select the app you want is NOT like dragging and dropping executables into some magic location on the filesystem.
  - petercooper 18y ago
    Package management is modern UNIX-y. I'm talking about the process where you download a single file that contains an application (a disk image or a tarball, say) then perform a process to install the app (dragging or "./configure && make && install"). These OS X / UNIX techniques compared to Windows' "download an EXECUTABLE that does all the installation for you" is like night and day.
ivank 18y ago
I still use Windows, but run an Ubuntu VM in it for all web development. You get the real Windows, the real Linux, everyone wins. Microsoft's investment in fonts really shows - it's my #1 reason for sticking with the OS.
- icey 18y ago
  You can install the Microsoft core fonts in Ubuntu. I think the package is called msttcorefonts; but if that doesn't work for you, it's in Synaptic.
menloparkbum 18y ago
Genius Bar is lame. Never had a problem with dual monitors aside from the fact that now the adaptor isn't bundled, and the DVI cable they will try to sell you first at the Mac Store uses a pin layout that no monitor or cable sold actually uses. The maximize button is indeed bizarre. I just maximized safari and it made the window 2/3 the size I had it and shifted it to the left hand corner of the screen. Then I "maximized" iTunes and it sent it into mini mode. Maximizing iChat seems to switch the buddy window from a skinny column to a wider, but shorter rectangle. Not sure why installing problems is so hard, my grandma and 11 year old cousins have no problems with this. However, every die hard windows switcher can't seem to figure it out. Fonts are a matter of taste and Windows users have none. But that's OK! MySpace is the #1 social network, NASCAR is the #1 sport in America and Bill Gates is the richest dude around. Taste doesn't really matter as much as people who have it would like to think...
- ph0rque 18y ago
  > ...Bill Gates is the richest dude around... Don't mean to nitpick, but he's currently #3, actually (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_billionaires http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_billionaires).
  - mattmaroon 18y ago
    Also NASCAR isn't number 1 by most metrics. Revenue, attendance, TV audience. It's second or worst by any meaningful measurement. That line is bandied about frequently but has no real truth to it.
    - menloparkbum 18y ago
      I dunno about that. The biggest baseball stadium in the US has about the same seating as the smallest NASCAR track. The biggest nascar track has five times as much seating. (250K @ Indy vs. 50K at Coor's field) It has to be #1 for attendance and at least number 2 for TV audience.
      - mattmaroon 18y ago
aneesh 18y ago
Sage advice from a high school friend: "If you can use Windows, you can use Linux. If you can't, get a Mac. While you won't be able to use it either, at least it'll look pretty."
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  The first sentence is very incorrect. My 50 yr old aunt can use Windows. I tried installing Myth TV on a Red Hat distro and had to call for help.
  - jrockway 18y ago
    It sounds like you're either incompetent or just unwilling to learn.
    - mattmaroon 18y ago
      I did learn. That doesn't mean most people could figure it out on their own. It's very complicated to install programs on most Linux distros. Any non-programmer would give up in frustration.
      - jrockway 18y ago
        I was mostly referring to your dislike for the "copy apps to the Applications folder" on OS X. It's not that hard; in fact I think it's one of the nicest parts of OS X. (and I'm not a Mac user, BTW.) As for Linux... I posted something like this earlier; if you can't learn to use your software, then you're going to have to pay someone to write easier-to-use software. You act like it's the end of the world that software you didn't pay for doesn't work exactly like you want.
        mattmaroon 18y ago
        It's not hard to install applications on a Mac once you know how. It's just very counterintuitive, and a little tedious. I don't think there's anything wrong with Linux being hard to use for the average Joe, and I certainly wasn't complaining about it. You're totally missing the point. The original quote was "If you can use Windows, you can use Linux." For 99%+ of the population this is untrue. Any moron can get around Windows with no prior instructions. They might not be editing the registry, but they'll be able to download and install programs. Not so with any Linux distro I've ever seen (haven't used Ubuntu yet).
alex_c 18y ago
dual monitors (which, by the way, you shouldn’t even bother attempting on a Mac. My cofounder has to close the lid when he hooks his MBP up to a monitor). Funny, my cofounder's MBP works just fine with a second monitor. The window maximizing thing is probably my biggest single annoyance when using a Mac. I've noticed that some people hate maximizing windows, and prefer having them smaller and overlapping, I guess to be able to see the contents and make switching between them easier. I'm the opposite, I need my windows maximized - I don't ever want to deal with moving or resizing them, alt-tab or the taskbar work just fine for me. I guess Macs work great for the first group of people, but not for me.
- jimbokun 18y ago
  "The window maximizing thing is probably my biggest single annoyance when using a Mac." I can't tell which people understand the philosophy of window maximizing on the Mac and don't like it, and who finds the behavior just random, so let me explain: The Mac UI assumes the point of maximizing a window is to see all of its content at once, so enlarging past the size at which all content is visible at once is unnecessary. This can be nice, once you understand what it's doing and are used to it. If you understand this and still don't like it, that is your prerogative, too, of course.
  - alex_c 18y ago
    That does seem consistent with what I've seen, though I hadn't consciously realized it. I still have trouble seeing how this philosophy can work for something like Word or even Firefox, where the content reorganizes itself to fit the window - I could swear Macs don't always make a window full-screen in these scenarios. And you can still move a "maximized" window, which is also annoying. I'll keep this in mind next time and see if it helps me.
ashu 18y ago
Window maximising: I use some Quicksilver scripts from http://jon.smajda.com/blog/2007/06/30/keyboard-control-for-mac-os-x-windows/ http://jon.smajda.com/blog/2007/06/30/keyboard-control-for-m... The fact that you can use keyboard shortcuts makes this even better.
axod 18y ago
"First you download a dmg file which, when clicked, creates a virtual drive. On the virtual drive is the program, which you then have to drag into your Applications folder. Then you have to unmount the virtual drive and delete the dmg file from your desktop" "There’s no way that anyone could guess this procedure" You are kidding right? My wife guessed this. My 9 year old can do this. It's brain dead simple, and makes perfect sense - you can see what stuff is there before you install. You can read a readme sometimes before installing. I think it helps when trying something new, to have an open mind. Instead of just saying "eugh! this is different. It must be bad"
- mrtron 18y ago
  sarcasm ahead I have no idea how you delete applications on a Mac either. You have to go to Applications and delete that folder you copied to your Applications directory? It is much better having an 'uninstaller' that does a half-assed job at removing things from the registry and cleaning up files. Matt I realize trolling can feel good on the short term but people will give you more respect in the long run if you are sincere.
  - mattmaroon 18y ago
    Anyone who disagrees with you must be trolling.
    - axod 18y ago
      "There's no way anyone could guess this procedure" How is that not an obvious troll statement. Either you're just incredibly bad at operating computers, or you wanted to get a reaction from people and start a fight.
      - mattmaroon 18y ago
        It's a simple statement of the counterintuitiveness. That was my point. Macs are not intuitive.
axod 18y ago
"and what the hell is a keychain?" Obviously if you don't know what it is, it must be bad! Don't find out what it is, just assume it's bad :/ What the hell is a 'registry'? :P
- Xichekolas 18y ago
  What the hell is a 'world file'? Op, gentoo got the best of me.
  - PStamatiou 18y ago
    emerge world!
    - Xichekolas 18y ago
      pssh... emerge -uND world
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  Not bad, but if I have to think about it or Google it, it's counterintuitive. Windows just saves your passwords in the app if you tell it to. On OSX, they save them in a keychain and require me to put in my keychain password every time. This doesn't save me any typing.
  - LPTS 18y ago
    No, but it does let you just remember one password you change regularly while allowing you to have different complex passwords at each site. So it allows you to have better security for lower costs. The point isn't to save you typing, its to let you have better security for the same typing. (You can put a password on boot and wake from sleep and turn the password off your keychain, too, if you prefer not to type it every time, at a cost of having your passwords exposed if you leave it on and someone steals a minute on your computer.)
  - axod 18y ago
    Perhaps that's why mac is just a tad more secure. Would you rather a unified system for managing your passwords, or just have applications store them in plaintext files? When I switched to mac I was actually pretty impressed that such a thing existed. Call me a cynic, but I think you decided you hated macs way way before you ever tried one.
hs 18y ago
on maximize & dual monitor why do you have to put extra efforts when you can just use tiled wm (i use dwm and dmenu) ? maximizing comes automatic don't two monitors kill your focus flow? maybe you are more productive (result from research by monitor manuf - doing repetitive stuff) the real danger is you'll be less creative
timcederman 18y ago
Very typical response - slightly angrier, but overall the same experience I had. I am surprised Matt didn't notice the slicker look and feel, and far better responsiveness of OS X. I am continually surprised at what my Mini can manage with 512mb of RAM compared to my M1330 running Vista with 3GB.
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  I'm not seeing that. I click just about any application to load and the little icon bounces at the bottom for just as long as it takes to open Word on my Vista machine (2gb RAM).
m0nty 18y ago
'A girl with some sort of mullethawk and a tattoo creeping up her neck asked me if I needed help and I almost said “no, but you do.”' You know, that seems a pretty hostile way to (almost) talk to a stranger. Maybe it's a cultural thing ...
- m0nty 18y ago
  Note to self: must remember to do more group-think.
jpeterson 18y ago
OK, this guy obviously went into this experience not wanting to like the mac. First of all, installation is a no-brainer. Once you click a link for an app, Safari downloads and automounts the dmg, leaving you with the simple task of dragging it into the application folder. How is dragging a new application into a folder called "Applications" counterintuitive? Second, I've used many macs and I've never had a single problem with the dual-screen setup. This issue was something environmental in your case, I believe.
- jimbokun 18y ago
  "How is dragging a new application into a folder called "Applications" counterintuitive?" I think the larger point is, if that is the biggest usability barrier in adopting an entirely different operating system, the Mac UI people are doing something right.
rob 18y ago
App/package management on OS X is pretty bad, especially since there's no automated way to uninstall stuff. Yes, I know that you drag the app to the trash, but there's usually preference files, caches, folders in 'Application Support', etc, that get left behind unless you use a program such as AppZapper to get rid of them. Something like that should be built into OS X. Although I've only used it on a server (and not a desktop), Debian/Ubuntu's aptitude/apt-get package system is probably the easiest thing I've ever used. It's awesome.
- nertzy 18y ago
  AppZapper comes highly recommended: http://appzapper.com/ http://appzapper.com/
jacabado 18y ago
"Everybody serious about doing software should make their own hardware." Steve Jobs That might no longer be true as PPC died, but anybody serious about doing software should experiment Mac OS and the application ecosystem around it. What surprised me the most was the fit between the Apple market and some applications that have no equivalent in Windows/Unix. For me Scrivener was a dream I had. There's a lot to be said, and it's really interesting to compare the platforms, but not in reply to a post of a smart guy who finds counterintuitive to install in Mac OS. Hey Matt you don't have to live with applications that have 20+ buttons in the first 2 rows of the interface. And I also think u can keep the controversy tone of your posts without being dumb. You were in a great path.
icey 18y ago
What's hilarious to me is that the headline under "My Mac Mini" is "Tech World, I Am Your Master". Master, indeed.

24 points by ashu 18y ago

Pretty common complaints about the actual OS for people who are used to windows. You just have to get used to the idea that windows float and that it's not really designed to have windows maximized. I was pretty used to the interface after a month or so, I started in late 2003, so Panther was out by then and Expose helped out a lot. I have to disagree with running 2 monitors, I've done it for a couple years now and have never had any usability issues. However, the Apple store comments are pretty much dead-on. I'd rather just order online or go to a reseller then deal with the Apple Store.

abstractbill 18y ago
it's not really designed to have windows maximized I've heard this line before - people say it as if something disastrous would happen if Apple gave in and made the green '+' a maximize button... so far nothing's coming to mind. (btw, I haven't used windows for anything other than testing IE for about 9 years, and I still hate Apple's choice regarding the 'zoom' button).
- TheWama 18y ago
  The disastrous thing is that it would be less useful to have a maximized window be 10x the size of its contents. For example, IMO the behavior of safari on maximize is just beautiful, because it's tailored to the specific website you're viewing. If the application is a window into your data, why make that window bigger than necessary, thus obscuring your desktop, or some other window behind it? That may not be disastrous, but I think its intent makes sense. Without further explanation, I end up suspecting that when he writes: "it almost never does what you’d want or expect it to," the emphasis is on his expectations as a Windows user, not on what he would prefer, all things being equal. [and for the record, I'm speaking as an Ubuntu user, who has never owned a mac]
  - abstractbill 18y ago
    I want to obscure my desktop, and all the other windows. Why would I want that stuff in my peripheral vision when I'm busy working?
    - demallien 18y ago
      In which case you simply hit Cmd-Shift-H (or select 'Hide Others' in the app menu), which hides all but the active application... Personally though, I generally just use Spaces to have different screens containing only applications that I want to use together. So I'll have a programming doc open in Preview, next to my XCode project window. Or I'll have a web browser open with Textmate if I'm doing something with Rails. That way you only have the apps that you are interested in on screen in any given 'space'. Next quibble?
      - menloparkbum 18y ago
        Cmd-Shift-H actually sends you "home" if that option is available. Opt-Shift-H hides others. The lame thing about hide others is there isn't a built in key command to show all.
        demallien 18y ago
        Lol, actually we're both wrong. It's Opt-Cmd-H... At least it is when using French keyboards...
        menloparkbum 18y ago
        whoops... yeah, that's it.
      - abstractbill 18y ago
        This is what my desktop looks like for more than 90% of the time: http://abstractnonsense.com/desktop.png http://abstractnonsense.com/desktop.png If emacs wasn't taking up the whole screen, I'd have a scrollbar running down the middle of the screen, which would be really visually distracting. I used virtual desktops a lot back when I used Linux for my desktop os. They're great, and I'm sure I'll use them again when I upgrade from Tiger. But, for me at least, they're no substitute for maximization.

rms 18y ago

Matt, I think you should try Ubuntu for comparison purposes.

mattmaroon 18y ago
I probably will soon.
PStamatiou 18y ago
i keep thinking you're richard stallman ;-) .. was the username intended as such?
- rms 18y ago
  It was intended to be funny and ironic, I'm definitely not trying to impersonate the great rms. It originated as an abbreviation for "rupert murdoch sucks."

petercooper 18y ago

I thought this post was satire until about 75% of the way down.. That said, his point about installing programs is spot on for people from the Windows world. It makes sense in a UNIX-y way, but it's totally counterintuitive if you've come from Windows. I found it odd the first time, then grew to love it.

ashu 18y ago
Ubuntu/Debian which is more UNIX-y than MacOS in some ways has none of this. Software installation and uninstallation is a breeze. In my 2 months of experience with the Mac, I have found that the Mac is very appealing when it's new. It's beautiful, but sometimes it feels like Steve Jobs prefers form over function a bit too much.
goofygrin 18y ago
How in the hell do you think that dragging files to an "Applications" folder is unix-y? Ubuntu: Synaptic or "sudo apt-get install xyz" Fedora: "yum install xyz" Certainly don't see any goofy dragging app files around here.
- mrtron 18y ago
  Oh dear god. Using a package manager or manually grabbing the files and building it IS basically like dragging files to an Applications folder. You have all your files for an app in one known spot. That's all there is (excluding environment variables). What is non-unixy is installing a bunch of garbage into a registry (did I mention I hate registries?).
  - goofygrin 18y ago
    No, using a package manager where you select the app you want is NOT like dragging and dropping executables into some magic location on the filesystem.
- petercooper 18y ago
  Package management is modern UNIX-y. I'm talking about the process where you download a single file that contains an application (a disk image or a tarball, say) then perform a process to install the app (dragging or "./configure && make && install"). These OS X / UNIX techniques compared to Windows' "download an EXECUTABLE that does all the installation for you" is like night and day.

ivank 18y ago

I still use Windows, but run an Ubuntu VM in it for all web development. You get the real Windows, the real Linux, everyone wins. Microsoft's investment in fonts really shows - it's my #1 reason for sticking with the OS.

icey 18y ago
You can install the Microsoft core fonts in Ubuntu. I think the package is called msttcorefonts; but if that doesn't work for you, it's in Synaptic.

menloparkbum 18y ago

Genius Bar is lame. Never had a problem with dual monitors aside from the fact that now the adaptor isn't bundled, and the DVI cable they will try to sell you first at the Mac Store uses a pin layout that no monitor or cable sold actually uses. The maximize button is indeed bizarre. I just maximized safari and it made the window 2/3 the size I had it and shifted it to the left hand corner of the screen. Then I "maximized" iTunes and it sent it into mini mode. Maximizing iChat seems to switch the buddy window from a skinny column to a wider, but shorter rectangle. Not sure why installing problems is so hard, my grandma and 11 year old cousins have no problems with this. However, every die hard windows switcher can't seem to figure it out. Fonts are a matter of taste and Windows users have none. But that's OK! MySpace is the #1 social network, NASCAR is the #1 sport in America and Bill Gates is the richest dude around. Taste doesn't really matter as much as people who have it would like to think...

ph0rque 18y ago
> ...Bill Gates is the richest dude around... Don't mean to nitpick, but he's currently #3, actually (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_billionaires http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_billionaires).
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  Also NASCAR isn't number 1 by most metrics. Revenue, attendance, TV audience. It's second or worst by any meaningful measurement. That line is bandied about frequently but has no real truth to it.
  - menloparkbum 18y ago
    I dunno about that. The biggest baseball stadium in the US has about the same seating as the smallest NASCAR track. The biggest nascar track has five times as much seating. (250K @ Indy vs. 50K at Coor's field) It has to be #1 for attendance and at least number 2 for TV audience.
    - mattmaroon 18y ago

aneesh 18y ago

Sage advice from a high school friend: "If you can use Windows, you can use Linux. If you can't, get a Mac. While you won't be able to use it either, at least it'll look pretty."

mattmaroon 18y ago
The first sentence is very incorrect. My 50 yr old aunt can use Windows. I tried installing Myth TV on a Red Hat distro and had to call for help.
- jrockway 18y ago
  It sounds like you're either incompetent or just unwilling to learn.
  - mattmaroon 18y ago
    I did learn. That doesn't mean most people could figure it out on their own. It's very complicated to install programs on most Linux distros. Any non-programmer would give up in frustration.
    - jrockway 18y ago
      I was mostly referring to your dislike for the "copy apps to the Applications folder" on OS X. It's not that hard; in fact I think it's one of the nicest parts of OS X. (and I'm not a Mac user, BTW.) As for Linux... I posted something like this earlier; if you can't learn to use your software, then you're going to have to pay someone to write easier-to-use software. You act like it's the end of the world that software you didn't pay for doesn't work exactly like you want.
      - mattmaroon 18y ago
        It's not hard to install applications on a Mac once you know how. It's just very counterintuitive, and a little tedious. I don't think there's anything wrong with Linux being hard to use for the average Joe, and I certainly wasn't complaining about it. You're totally missing the point. The original quote was "If you can use Windows, you can use Linux." For 99%+ of the population this is untrue. Any moron can get around Windows with no prior instructions. They might not be editing the registry, but they'll be able to download and install programs. Not so with any Linux distro I've ever seen (haven't used Ubuntu yet).

alex_c 18y ago

dual monitors (which, by the way, you shouldn’t even bother attempting on a Mac. My cofounder has to close the lid when he hooks his MBP up to a monitor). Funny, my cofounder's MBP works just fine with a second monitor. The window maximizing thing is probably my biggest single annoyance when using a Mac. I've noticed that some people hate maximizing windows, and prefer having them smaller and overlapping, I guess to be able to see the contents and make switching between them easier. I'm the opposite, I need my windows maximized - I don't ever want to deal with moving or resizing them, alt-tab or the taskbar work just fine for me. I guess Macs work great for the first group of people, but not for me.

jimbokun 18y ago
"The window maximizing thing is probably my biggest single annoyance when using a Mac." I can't tell which people understand the philosophy of window maximizing on the Mac and don't like it, and who finds the behavior just random, so let me explain: The Mac UI assumes the point of maximizing a window is to see all of its content at once, so enlarging past the size at which all content is visible at once is unnecessary. This can be nice, once you understand what it's doing and are used to it. If you understand this and still don't like it, that is your prerogative, too, of course.
- alex_c 18y ago
  That does seem consistent with what I've seen, though I hadn't consciously realized it. I still have trouble seeing how this philosophy can work for something like Word or even Firefox, where the content reorganizes itself to fit the window - I could swear Macs don't always make a window full-screen in these scenarios. And you can still move a "maximized" window, which is also annoying. I'll keep this in mind next time and see if it helps me.

ashu 18y ago

Window maximising: I use some Quicksilver scripts from http://jon.smajda.com/blog/2007/06/30/keyboard-control-for-mac-os-x-windows/ http://jon.smajda.com/blog/2007/06/30/keyboard-control-for-m... The fact that you can use keyboard shortcuts makes this even better.

axod 18y ago

"First you download a dmg file which, when clicked, creates a virtual drive. On the virtual drive is the program, which you then have to drag into your Applications folder. Then you have to unmount the virtual drive and delete the dmg file from your desktop" "There’s no way that anyone could guess this procedure" You are kidding right? My wife guessed this. My 9 year old can do this. It's brain dead simple, and makes perfect sense - you can see what stuff is there before you install. You can read a readme sometimes before installing. I think it helps when trying something new, to have an open mind. Instead of just saying "eugh! this is different. It must be bad"

mrtron 18y ago
sarcasm ahead I have no idea how you delete applications on a Mac either. You have to go to Applications and delete that folder you copied to your Applications directory? It is much better having an 'uninstaller' that does a half-assed job at removing things from the registry and cleaning up files. Matt I realize trolling can feel good on the short term but people will give you more respect in the long run if you are sincere.
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  Anyone who disagrees with you must be trolling.
  - axod 18y ago
    "There's no way anyone could guess this procedure" How is that not an obvious troll statement. Either you're just incredibly bad at operating computers, or you wanted to get a reaction from people and start a fight.
    - mattmaroon 18y ago
      It's a simple statement of the counterintuitiveness. That was my point. Macs are not intuitive.

axod 18y ago

"and what the hell is a keychain?" Obviously if you don't know what it is, it must be bad! Don't find out what it is, just assume it's bad :/ What the hell is a 'registry'? :P

Xichekolas 18y ago
What the hell is a 'world file'? Op, gentoo got the best of me.
- PStamatiou 18y ago
  emerge world!
  - Xichekolas 18y ago
    pssh... emerge -uND world
mattmaroon 18y ago
Not bad, but if I have to think about it or Google it, it's counterintuitive. Windows just saves your passwords in the app if you tell it to. On OSX, they save them in a keychain and require me to put in my keychain password every time. This doesn't save me any typing.
- LPTS 18y ago
  No, but it does let you just remember one password you change regularly while allowing you to have different complex passwords at each site. So it allows you to have better security for lower costs. The point isn't to save you typing, its to let you have better security for the same typing. (You can put a password on boot and wake from sleep and turn the password off your keychain, too, if you prefer not to type it every time, at a cost of having your passwords exposed if you leave it on and someone steals a minute on your computer.)
- axod 18y ago
  Perhaps that's why mac is just a tad more secure. Would you rather a unified system for managing your passwords, or just have applications store them in plaintext files? When I switched to mac I was actually pretty impressed that such a thing existed. Call me a cynic, but I think you decided you hated macs way way before you ever tried one.

hs 18y ago

on maximize & dual monitor why do you have to put extra efforts when you can just use tiled wm (i use dwm and dmenu) ? maximizing comes automatic don't two monitors kill your focus flow? maybe you are more productive (result from research by monitor manuf - doing repetitive stuff) the real danger is you'll be less creative

timcederman 18y ago

Very typical response - slightly angrier, but overall the same experience I had. I am surprised Matt didn't notice the slicker look and feel, and far better responsiveness of OS X. I am continually surprised at what my Mini can manage with 512mb of RAM compared to my M1330 running Vista with 3GB.

mattmaroon 18y ago
I'm not seeing that. I click just about any application to load and the little icon bounces at the bottom for just as long as it takes to open Word on my Vista machine (2gb RAM).

m0nty 18y ago

'A girl with some sort of mullethawk and a tattoo creeping up her neck asked me if I needed help and I almost said “no, but you do.”' You know, that seems a pretty hostile way to (almost) talk to a stranger. Maybe it's a cultural thing ...

m0nty 18y ago
Note to self: must remember to do more group-think.

jpeterson 18y ago

OK, this guy obviously went into this experience not wanting to like the mac. First of all, installation is a no-brainer. Once you click a link for an app, Safari downloads and automounts the dmg, leaving you with the simple task of dragging it into the application folder. How is dragging a new application into a folder called "Applications" counterintuitive? Second, I've used many macs and I've never had a single problem with the dual-screen setup. This issue was something environmental in your case, I believe.

jimbokun 18y ago
"How is dragging a new application into a folder called "Applications" counterintuitive?" I think the larger point is, if that is the biggest usability barrier in adopting an entirely different operating system, the Mac UI people are doing something right.

rob 18y ago

App/package management on OS X is pretty bad, especially since there's no automated way to uninstall stuff. Yes, I know that you drag the app to the trash, but there's usually preference files, caches, folders in 'Application Support', etc, that get left behind unless you use a program such as AppZapper to get rid of them. Something like that should be built into OS X. Although I've only used it on a server (and not a desktop), Debian/Ubuntu's aptitude/apt-get package system is probably the easiest thing I've ever used. It's awesome.

nertzy 18y ago
AppZapper comes highly recommended: http://appzapper.com/ http://appzapper.com/

jacabado 18y ago

"Everybody serious about doing software should make their own hardware." Steve Jobs That might no longer be true as PPC died, but anybody serious about doing software should experiment Mac OS and the application ecosystem around it. What surprised me the most was the fit between the Apple market and some applications that have no equivalent in Windows/Unix. For me Scrivener was a dream I had. There's a lot to be said, and it's really interesting to compare the platforms, but not in reply to a post of a smart guy who finds counterintuitive to install in Mac OS. Hey Matt you don't have to live with applications that have 20+ buttons in the first 2 rows of the interface. And I also think u can keep the controversy tone of your posts without being dumb. You were in a great path.

icey 18y ago

What's hilarious to me is that the headline under "My Mac Mini" is "Tech World, I Am Your Master". Master, indeed.