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My girlfriend runs an independent video rental store. I've been thinking of ways to implement a streaming service for our extensive collection of physical DVDs

My girlfriend runs an independent video rental store. I've been thinking of ways to implement a streaming service for our extensive collection of physical DVDs from the store to customers in the local area, perhaps to a proprietary TV box. I have the skills to do this. Does anybody here know if this has ever been done, or is legal? I'm in BC, Canada.

mjevans 8y ago
You /really/ need to talk to a copyright lawyer in your country about this. I am almost positive it'll run against SOME stupid copyright law even if you do an ethnically correct thing similar to having a human insert a disk in to a real video playback device and streaming the output to a merely a single very long distance connected display device.
- mikekchar 8y ago
  I'm not a lawyer, but the Canadian copyright act is actually quite readable: http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-42/ http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-42/ As a programmer, I'm someone who depends on copyright for my living, so I always thought it was a good idea to understand what it says. While, the advice to get a lawyer is a good one, I think it's actually pretty clear that it is not legal. It falls pretty clearly under "(f) in the case of any literary, dramatic, musical or artistic work, to communicate the work to the public by telecommunication". You would have to get a license -- and that's the difficult-to-the-point-of-impossible bit.
  - Dylan16807 8y ago
    It's not at all clear that it's 'to the public', when it's only being sent to the renter. But that won't stop you from getting charged anyway.
    - mikekchar 8y ago
      Feel free to consult a lawyer, but there are 2 parties to which the copyright act refers: the public and researchers. The definition of researchers is given in the act. The public is everybody else -- you, the renter, anyone else that isn't a researcher. The way it works is that the act outlines all of the circumstances in which copying could be infringing. It then defines infringement in section 2. In section 2 it says that it is not infringement if you have an agreement with the copyright holder (i.e. a license). You may be thinking that "the public" infers a large group of people. This is not correct. The copyright act doesn't distinguish between numbers of people except in very specific circumstances (private copying with respect to audio recordings of music is an example). There used to be a section dealing with "making available", but it seems to have been removed (I haven't lived in Canada for a decade, so I haven't kept up with the copyright act). Generally speaking, copyright infringement is a civil matter, but commercial copyright infringement is a criminal matter so it is doubly important to get a good legal opinion before venturing into that territory. But, like I said, the act is quite clear IMHO. If you disagree, then feel free to get a legal opinion (which mine is not). I would literally be shocked if any lawyer told you that it was legal, though.
      - Dylan16807 8y ago
        Does that mean two people watching a movie together are breaking that law?
        Paperweight 8y ago
        There's all kinds of exceptions and things in there, plus a copyright board that makes decisions. Notable is 29.22 Reproduction for private purposes is allowed if 29.22 (1) (a) the individual legally obtained the copy of the work or other subject-matter from which the reproduction is made, other than by borrowing it or renting it, and owns or is authorized to use the medium or device on which it is reproduced; So it seems that both the DVD and player must be legally owned by the person watching the movie. That means they must have the right to come in and walk away with the DVD and player at any time, just as if they had them in a data center. Seems reasonable. Just buy them back when they're done. Note that Zediva didn't do this. Their DVDs and DVD players weren't actually owned by the customers, just rented, nor were customers allowed into the data center to repossess them. The US also didn't have the same private reproduction provision as in the Canadian Copyright Act does.
ljf 8y ago
https://www.wired.com/2011/08/zediva-shuts-down/ https://www.wired.com/2011/08/zediva-shuts-down/ - Zediva tried that previously and it didn't end too well for them. Was and OK service but tech wise it was a bit clunky and not as good as netflix.
- Paperweight 8y ago
  Except Netflix has a couple hundred movies available where we have about 10,000.
jstarfish 8y ago
Technical execution is the easy part, but legally speaking, you might fare much better by just offering to physically deliver movies on demand.
- Pete_D 8y ago
  Reminds me of a promotion I saw a few years ago where some pizza chain had paired up with a video rental place. You ordered a DVD with your pizza and they were delivered together.
  - Paperweight 8y ago
    Our store did that a few years ago, too. Skip the Dishes is widely available in our town now, and we're surrounded by restaurants, but I haven't asked them if they'll deliver DVDs yet.
- Paperweight 8y ago
  Yeah, you're probably right. I'm thinking of making Canada's only mail-order DVD/BR website. Netflix bought Zip.ca but then they shut down mail orders. We don't even have Redbox anymore. It's sad that there are a lot of great movies you can't legally stream online in Canada - can't even torrent them - but we have them on DVD in high quality.

mjevans 8y ago

You /really/ need to talk to a copyright lawyer in your country about this. I am almost positive it'll run against SOME stupid copyright law even if you do an ethnically correct thing similar to having a human insert a disk in to a real video playback device and streaming the output to a merely a single very long distance connected display device.

mikekchar 8y ago
I'm not a lawyer, but the Canadian copyright act is actually quite readable: http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-42/ http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-42/ As a programmer, I'm someone who depends on copyright for my living, so I always thought it was a good idea to understand what it says. While, the advice to get a lawyer is a good one, I think it's actually pretty clear that it is not legal. It falls pretty clearly under "(f) in the case of any literary, dramatic, musical or artistic work, to communicate the work to the public by telecommunication". You would have to get a license -- and that's the difficult-to-the-point-of-impossible bit.
- Dylan16807 8y ago
  It's not at all clear that it's 'to the public', when it's only being sent to the renter. But that won't stop you from getting charged anyway.
  - mikekchar 8y ago
    Feel free to consult a lawyer, but there are 2 parties to which the copyright act refers: the public and researchers. The definition of researchers is given in the act. The public is everybody else -- you, the renter, anyone else that isn't a researcher. The way it works is that the act outlines all of the circumstances in which copying could be infringing. It then defines infringement in section 2. In section 2 it says that it is not infringement if you have an agreement with the copyright holder (i.e. a license). You may be thinking that "the public" infers a large group of people. This is not correct. The copyright act doesn't distinguish between numbers of people except in very specific circumstances (private copying with respect to audio recordings of music is an example). There used to be a section dealing with "making available", but it seems to have been removed (I haven't lived in Canada for a decade, so I haven't kept up with the copyright act). Generally speaking, copyright infringement is a civil matter, but commercial copyright infringement is a criminal matter so it is doubly important to get a good legal opinion before venturing into that territory. But, like I said, the act is quite clear IMHO. If you disagree, then feel free to get a legal opinion (which mine is not). I would literally be shocked if any lawyer told you that it was legal, though.
    - Dylan16807 8y ago
      Does that mean two people watching a movie together are breaking that law?
      - Paperweight 8y ago
        There's all kinds of exceptions and things in there, plus a copyright board that makes decisions. Notable is 29.22 Reproduction for private purposes is allowed if 29.22 (1) (a) the individual legally obtained the copy of the work or other subject-matter from which the reproduction is made, other than by borrowing it or renting it, and owns or is authorized to use the medium or device on which it is reproduced; So it seems that both the DVD and player must be legally owned by the person watching the movie. That means they must have the right to come in and walk away with the DVD and player at any time, just as if they had them in a data center. Seems reasonable. Just buy them back when they're done. Note that Zediva didn't do this. Their DVDs and DVD players weren't actually owned by the customers, just rented, nor were customers allowed into the data center to repossess them. The US also didn't have the same private reproduction provision as in the Canadian Copyright Act does.

ljf 8y ago

https://www.wired.com/2011/08/zediva-shuts-down/ https://www.wired.com/2011/08/zediva-shuts-down/ - Zediva tried that previously and it didn't end too well for them. Was and OK service but tech wise it was a bit clunky and not as good as netflix.

Paperweight 8y ago
Except Netflix has a couple hundred movies available where we have about 10,000.

jstarfish 8y ago

Technical execution is the easy part, but legally speaking, you might fare much better by just offering to physically deliver movies on demand.

Pete_D 8y ago
Reminds me of a promotion I saw a few years ago where some pizza chain had paired up with a video rental place. You ordered a DVD with your pizza and they were delivered together.
- Paperweight 8y ago
  Our store did that a few years ago, too. Skip the Dishes is widely available in our town now, and we're surrounded by restaurants, but I haven't asked them if they'll deliver DVDs yet.
Paperweight 8y ago
Yeah, you're probably right. I'm thinking of making Canada's only mail-order DVD/BR website. Netflix bought Zip.ca but then they shut down mail orders. We don't even have Redbox anymore. It's sad that there are a lot of great movies you can't legally stream online in Canada - can't even torrent them - but we have them on DVD in high quality.