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From a non US citizens point of view, getting spied on by the giant uncle Sam or by Xi's China makes less and less difference if the current trends keep on : US
by poutrathor 8y ago
From a non US citizens point of view, getting spied on by the giant uncle Sam or by Xi's China makes less and less difference if the current trends keep on : USA retracting on nationalistic beliefs while China keeps opening up.
- tanilama 8y agoBlackmail by Xi or by Trump, it is now a choice to make. Can't imagine this like 2 years ago. Funny time to live indeed.
- realusername 8y ago> USA retracting on nationalistic beliefs while China keeps opening up. I don't see how China is opening up, the situation is even worse than 10 years ago, we used to have an oligarchy of the CCP, now we have a proper dictator instead. People hoped that China would open up while modernising, so far it has not worked at all.
- javajosh 8y agoTaking the devils advocate position, the intuition is that a) lots of money (and lots of middle class money, in particular) combined with b) western culture (movies, games, software) will "open up" China. Of course, I think this is a silly idea. One proof is how the west seems to be closing up - which implies that money and culture is not such a strong force for "opening up". The thing about China that must change is the nature of power, which remains firmly in the hands of the Communist Party, which is independent of the elected leader. As long as they retain real power, China degenerates into a nation ruled by people not a nation ruled by law. No, the force that makes a nation "open up" is a culture that invites dissenting voices, and speaks up, loudly, when dissent is stifled anywhere, at home or abroad. We can say, at least until recently, that one of our most unique and valuable qualities was this extreme position on dissent, to not just tolerate it, but encourage it. To open up peacefully, the Communist Party must itself open up to dissent, encourage it within itself, and allow a new, opposition party to establish itself. But I digress.
- oblio 8y agoYou don't need a middle class, you 2-3 generations of middle class. The former dirt farmer turned CEO or medic won't speak up. Poverty and penury are etched into his brain. The kids used to have enough all their love will be the ones rebelling. The alternative is that everyone starves and you get revolutions, but fewer and fewer people are starving in China and thus the government is legitimized.
- glenndebacker 8y ago"People hoped that China would open up while modernising, so far it has not worked at all." The same can be said of the US these days. It seems to go backwards for some strange reason.
- tonyedgecombe 8y agoThe US is still Democratic, you may not like Trump but enough people did.
- na85 8y agoThe US is an oligarchy.
- adventured 8y agoIf the US were an oligarchy, Trump would have never been elected. The most powerful people in the US were nearly universally against his election, including the most powerful billionaires, politicians, media and political families - on both sides of the aisle.
- Retric 8y agoUSA holds elections, but the system has been gamed enough to convince most people that their votes don't matter. That's dangerous over the long term. Democracy is more about the will of the population than highly technical rules.
- tonyedgecombe 8y agohighly technical rules Like the number of voters? I can't help feeling these complaints wouldn't have been made if the result was different. I don't like Trump but it seems he did win.
- extra88 8y ago> Like the number of voters? 3 million more voters voted for Clinton but Trump won because of the Electoral College.