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Some examples of what I consider timeless (and good) UI on the internet: * Hacker News (duh) * c2 wiki * Wikipedia (it changes, but thankfully not radically)

Some examples of what I consider timeless (and good) UI on the internet: * Hacker News (duh) * c2 wiki * Wikipedia (it changes, but thankfully not radically) I would have added Reddit, but alas. Seeing how they plan to change to that... other thing makes me really sad. Anything else?

tzahola 8y ago
IETF RFCs
- ainar-g 8y ago
  Oh, that's a good one. Also W3C documents.
  - DonHopkins 8y ago
    TPS Reports.
- detaro 8y ago
  "Timeless" in the sense of "unchanged for a long time", but IMHO not as "unchanged because they are still great". They are optimized for different times, and needlessly bad to consume today.
bauerd 8y ago
* Google search (esp. the non-JS version) * GitHub * ia.net and some of their work * dict.cc
hawski 8y ago
But haven't c2 wiki changed for a slightly worse? Don't get me wrong - it's still better than most. It's now client side rendered. Also there was a short time after it introduced this change, when it looked far more wonky. It's not a coincidence that all those pages could as good work with minimal CSS. That's why I would like to see a pure HTML cross-platform web browser. With nice proportional fonts and good support for media. It could even try to do some more complex typesetting. So links/lynx and other console browser do not cut it. Dillo AFAIK is no longer developed and it's not available on mobile. Side rant: I hate the recent trend with adding those obnoxious position:fixed or sticky bars at the top. All this fight to reduce browser chrome (from which Chrome takes it's name) has given web-designers more space to waste. It's horrible when one has: a wide-screen monitor, a small monitor, not full-screen window, a smartphone, a smartphone with a virtual keyboard visible. So pretty much always... On this hypothetical HTML-only browser it wouldn't obscure the content. Just as all those newsletter, cookies and GDPR consent overlays.
- ainar-g 8y ago
  >That's why I would like to see a pure HTML cross-platform web browser. With nice proportional fonts and good support for media. I assume you are not using Firefox? Then you should, because it has Reader View mode, which removes all the JS BS, but leaves the text and the figures in. Not sure about <audio> and <video>, but it's a real blessing. I don't know how Chrome people go without it. More info here: https://blog.mozilla.org/firefox/reader-view/ https://blog.mozilla.org/firefox/reader-view/.
  - hawski 8y ago
    Firefox is close. But. I would like a permanent reader mode. There is an extension like this [0], however it does not yet work on Android, per author. Also I like the idea of a small, simple and lightning fast package. It would just work and would have a miniscule attack surface. At least comparing with all other browsers. [0] https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/automatic-reader-view/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/automatic-rea...
    - dredmorbius 8y ago
      FYWD; https://ello.co/dredmorbius/post/ubkidr7yuc7azg9hdnl7lq https://ello.co/dredmorbius/post/ubkidr7yuc7azg9hdnl7lq
matchagaucho 8y ago
The CamelCase of c2 was efficient for the writer. Not so much for the reader.
jdietrich 8y ago
Hacker News is a miserable experience on mobile. Even on desktop, the upvote/downvote buttons are needlessly small and give no confirmation; I often find myself clicking "unvote" because I wasn't sure if I upvoted or downvoted.
- DanBC 8y ago
  I agree with you. Partly this is because mobile browser vendors have made some really annoying decisions (zoom doesn't reflow text). But an upvote gives you an [unvote] button, a downvote gives you an [undown] button.
- Pulcinella 8y ago
  Don’t forget how Code snippets require lots of horizontal scrolling on mobile. It’s bad but understandable when it’s actual code, but it’s just aweful when someone is using code formatting to represent a quote.
  - marcosdumay 8y ago
    > It’s bad but understandable when it’s actual code My 80 column terminal does not need horizontal scrolling on wide code. Why does my browser need it?
- Bekwnn 8y ago
  The materialistic hn app is what I've been using for a while (and right now, actually). But i also saw several other readers for the site. Worth looking into one of them if you look at posts on the go a lot.
DonHopkins 8y ago
suck.com craigslist.com
wool_gather 8y ago
Stack Overflow/Exchange is pretty good...the UI doesn't get in the way of doing things. Unfortunately, they have also been making moves away from the content being the most important thing.
- pvg 8y ago
  The SO UI for participants (rather than people looking for an existing answer) is mediocre-ish to weak. They seem to be a thoughtful lot so I imagine some of it is deliberate but that itself points to more fundamental design problems - making things annoying is better at annoying people than it is at discouraging certain types of user activity.
zargon 8y ago
mcmaster.com is on my shortlist of timeless designs.
Redoubts 8y ago
Not gonna lie, I find them all pretty bad. Their styles seem optimized for the coder, not the user.
TeMPOraL 8y ago
c2 before they rolled out their new ridiculous client-side rendering design, yes. Otherwise, I agree with you. Timeless design is one that exposes the nature of the tool and helps use it to achieve its purpose, with no superfluous elements added.

tzahola 8y ago

IETF RFCs

ainar-g 8y ago
Oh, that's a good one. Also W3C documents.
- DonHopkins 8y ago
  TPS Reports.
detaro 8y ago
"Timeless" in the sense of "unchanged for a long time", but IMHO not as "unchanged because they are still great". They are optimized for different times, and needlessly bad to consume today.

bauerd 8y ago

* Google search (esp. the non-JS version) * GitHub * ia.net and some of their work * dict.cc

hawski 8y ago

But haven't c2 wiki changed for a slightly worse? Don't get me wrong - it's still better than most. It's now client side rendered. Also there was a short time after it introduced this change, when it looked far more wonky. It's not a coincidence that all those pages could as good work with minimal CSS. That's why I would like to see a pure HTML cross-platform web browser. With nice proportional fonts and good support for media. It could even try to do some more complex typesetting. So links/lynx and other console browser do not cut it. Dillo AFAIK is no longer developed and it's not available on mobile. Side rant: I hate the recent trend with adding those obnoxious position:fixed or sticky bars at the top. All this fight to reduce browser chrome (from which Chrome takes it's name) has given web-designers more space to waste. It's horrible when one has: a wide-screen monitor, a small monitor, not full-screen window, a smartphone, a smartphone with a virtual keyboard visible. So pretty much always... On this hypothetical HTML-only browser it wouldn't obscure the content. Just as all those newsletter, cookies and GDPR consent overlays.

ainar-g 8y ago
>That's why I would like to see a pure HTML cross-platform web browser. With nice proportional fonts and good support for media. I assume you are not using Firefox? Then you should, because it has Reader View mode, which removes all the JS BS, but leaves the text and the figures in. Not sure about <audio> and <video>, but it's a real blessing. I don't know how Chrome people go without it. More info here: https://blog.mozilla.org/firefox/reader-view/ https://blog.mozilla.org/firefox/reader-view/.
- hawski 8y ago
  Firefox is close. But. I would like a permanent reader mode. There is an extension like this [0], however it does not yet work on Android, per author. Also I like the idea of a small, simple and lightning fast package. It would just work and would have a miniscule attack surface. At least comparing with all other browsers. [0] https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/automatic-reader-view/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/automatic-rea...
  - dredmorbius 8y ago
    FYWD; https://ello.co/dredmorbius/post/ubkidr7yuc7azg9hdnl7lq https://ello.co/dredmorbius/post/ubkidr7yuc7azg9hdnl7lq

matchagaucho 8y ago

The CamelCase of c2 was efficient for the writer. Not so much for the reader.

jdietrich 8y ago

Hacker News is a miserable experience on mobile. Even on desktop, the upvote/downvote buttons are needlessly small and give no confirmation; I often find myself clicking "unvote" because I wasn't sure if I upvoted or downvoted.

DanBC 8y ago
I agree with you. Partly this is because mobile browser vendors have made some really annoying decisions (zoom doesn't reflow text). But an upvote gives you an [unvote] button, a downvote gives you an [undown] button.
Pulcinella 8y ago
Don’t forget how Code snippets require lots of horizontal scrolling on mobile. It’s bad but understandable when it’s actual code, but it’s just aweful when someone is using code formatting to represent a quote.
- marcosdumay 8y ago
  > It’s bad but understandable when it’s actual code My 80 column terminal does not need horizontal scrolling on wide code. Why does my browser need it?
Bekwnn 8y ago
The materialistic hn app is what I've been using for a while (and right now, actually). But i also saw several other readers for the site. Worth looking into one of them if you look at posts on the go a lot.

DonHopkins 8y ago

suck.com craigslist.com

wool_gather 8y ago

Stack Overflow/Exchange is pretty good...the UI doesn't get in the way of doing things. Unfortunately, they have also been making moves away from the content being the most important thing.

pvg 8y ago
The SO UI for participants (rather than people looking for an existing answer) is mediocre-ish to weak. They seem to be a thoughtful lot so I imagine some of it is deliberate but that itself points to more fundamental design problems - making things annoying is better at annoying people than it is at discouraging certain types of user activity.

zargon 8y ago

mcmaster.com is on my shortlist of timeless designs.

Redoubts 8y ago

Not gonna lie, I find them all pretty bad. Their styles seem optimized for the coder, not the user.

TeMPOraL 8y ago

c2 before they rolled out their new ridiculous client-side rendering design, yes. Otherwise, I agree with you. Timeless design is one that exposes the nature of the tool and helps use it to achieve its purpose, with no superfluous elements added.