4 ms·

Brexit was pushed through while loads of people from the UK that could have voted were in France at matches for the Euros. why the downvotes?

Double_a_92 8y ago
That doesn't make sense though... Because the plan was NOT to brexit.
- monkeynotes 8y ago
  Whose plan? Cameron's plan for sure, but it's not all that far fetched to believe he was ill advised and manipulated by his party (a lot of Eurosceptics in the Tory party). Ever watched Yes Minister? I know it's satire, but it's more than believable.
  - jcranmer 8y ago
    The leading faces of the Brexit movement--people like Boris Johnston or Nigel Farage--were completely caught off-guard by the victory. Cameron's decision to resign immediately after the referendum loss also meant that the Brexit negotiations would be completely owned by the Brexiteers, as they ran out of people who could be blamed if/when things go south. What was desired by these leading anti-EU folks was not a victory, but a very close loss. They get to keep blaming the EU for every problem (useful, when the biggest gripe--immigration--was entirely under the control of the UK, not the EU). They get to demonstrate that they have too much support to be ignored, but they don't have the responsibility of actually enacting the agenda.
- pbhjpbhj 8y ago
  Whoever ensured the referendum was in the Tory election manifesto certainly was planning on Brexit happening. You don't pay millions in to Tory funds, employ MPs and give pensions to ex-MPs and not get your way.
barking 8y ago
Maybe david Cameron reckoned England football supporters would more likely to be pro-Brexit?
rezeroed 8y ago
With such laws as this, and giant cookie consent banners, I'm surprised Brexit wasn't/isn't more popular. Edit: apparently I'm not surprised. Or not allowed to be.
- chki 8y ago
  I didn't downvote you. But maybe other people have because of the huge difference between leaving a union of states and peoples (which has a lot of impact, e.g. freedom of movement and trade) and clicking on a banner which is slightly annoying at most.
  - marcus_holmes 8y ago
    I think HN is generally anti-Brexit, so the downvotes are likely to be expressing that opinion rather than any specific complaint about the post
    - digi_owl 8y ago
      > I think HN is generally anti-Brexit As best i can tell, you can draw clear EU sentiments based on age and education. Younger and better educated are largely pro-EU as they are in a position to seek employment within the euro-sphere virtually at will (and may had friends all over thanks to various EU education programs). Others have watched local industry either moving their activities abroad, or simply running a skeleton crew between contracts. And when a contract hits, most of the people working there may not even speak a language the locals understand. Yes that may sound like racism, and the extremists can score some cheap points on it, but for the most part the issue is one of livelihood. Where as previous generations could count on their industrial or service job to carry them through setting up a home and starting a family, now they can't. And they see the EU as the reason why by eroding their access to jobs.
- pjc50 8y ago
  The cookie consent banners were never really a requirement, more a band-aid for the advertising industry's continued surveillance. As we've seen with GDPR, not being in the EU wouldn't actually help much with this because almost all websites would still want to sell into (or even be run from) the EU.
tzahola 8y ago
Brexit wasn't "pushed through". Everyone was pretty confident that they'll stay in the EU.
- barking 8y ago
  And the way things are going it's looking like Britain will be brexiting in name only.
  - pjc50 8y ago
    That's the least worst option, but I'm still hoping that someone will join the dots and realise that giving up our vote and participation is a pointless idea and that we should just cancel it.
  - rusk 8y ago
    We can only hope. The alternatives are too dismal to contemplate.
    - joosteto 8y ago
      And if you do contemplate them, you'll be accused of participating in project fear.
      - rusk 8y ago
        Project fear didn't go far enough.
  - Arnt 8y ago
    You think so? AFAICT there isn't even such a proposal being negotiated, and it had better be ready for signing this year. BINO looks like it might fail through simple lack of time.
    - barking 8y ago
      It will all be decided only at the last moment as is the custom for this sort of thing! (I hope)
ptero 8y ago
> why the downvotes? I did not downvote you, but I think you are getting beaten because you brought up a potential hot topic (brexit) in a way that is unrelated to the discussion topic (copyright). The argument that parties could have been using similar tactics is IMO irrelevant even if true (and that is not clear to me either).

Double_a_92 8y ago

That doesn't make sense though... Because the plan was NOT to brexit.

monkeynotes 8y ago
Whose plan? Cameron's plan for sure, but it's not all that far fetched to believe he was ill advised and manipulated by his party (a lot of Eurosceptics in the Tory party). Ever watched Yes Minister? I know it's satire, but it's more than believable.
- jcranmer 8y ago
  The leading faces of the Brexit movement--people like Boris Johnston or Nigel Farage--were completely caught off-guard by the victory. Cameron's decision to resign immediately after the referendum loss also meant that the Brexit negotiations would be completely owned by the Brexiteers, as they ran out of people who could be blamed if/when things go south. What was desired by these leading anti-EU folks was not a victory, but a very close loss. They get to keep blaming the EU for every problem (useful, when the biggest gripe--immigration--was entirely under the control of the UK, not the EU). They get to demonstrate that they have too much support to be ignored, but they don't have the responsibility of actually enacting the agenda.
pbhjpbhj 8y ago
Whoever ensured the referendum was in the Tory election manifesto certainly was planning on Brexit happening. You don't pay millions in to Tory funds, employ MPs and give pensions to ex-MPs and not get your way.

barking 8y ago

Maybe david Cameron reckoned England football supporters would more likely to be pro-Brexit?

rezeroed 8y ago

With such laws as this, and giant cookie consent banners, I'm surprised Brexit wasn't/isn't more popular. Edit: apparently I'm not surprised. Or not allowed to be.

chki 8y ago
I didn't downvote you. But maybe other people have because of the huge difference between leaving a union of states and peoples (which has a lot of impact, e.g. freedom of movement and trade) and clicking on a banner which is slightly annoying at most.
- marcus_holmes 8y ago
  I think HN is generally anti-Brexit, so the downvotes are likely to be expressing that opinion rather than any specific complaint about the post
  - digi_owl 8y ago
    > I think HN is generally anti-Brexit As best i can tell, you can draw clear EU sentiments based on age and education. Younger and better educated are largely pro-EU as they are in a position to seek employment within the euro-sphere virtually at will (and may had friends all over thanks to various EU education programs). Others have watched local industry either moving their activities abroad, or simply running a skeleton crew between contracts. And when a contract hits, most of the people working there may not even speak a language the locals understand. Yes that may sound like racism, and the extremists can score some cheap points on it, but for the most part the issue is one of livelihood. Where as previous generations could count on their industrial or service job to carry them through setting up a home and starting a family, now they can't. And they see the EU as the reason why by eroding their access to jobs.
pjc50 8y ago
The cookie consent banners were never really a requirement, more a band-aid for the advertising industry's continued surveillance. As we've seen with GDPR, not being in the EU wouldn't actually help much with this because almost all websites would still want to sell into (or even be run from) the EU.

tzahola 8y ago

Brexit wasn't "pushed through". Everyone was pretty confident that they'll stay in the EU.

barking 8y ago
And the way things are going it's looking like Britain will be brexiting in name only.
- pjc50 8y ago
  That's the least worst option, but I'm still hoping that someone will join the dots and realise that giving up our vote and participation is a pointless idea and that we should just cancel it.
- rusk 8y ago
  We can only hope. The alternatives are too dismal to contemplate.
  - joosteto 8y ago
    And if you do contemplate them, you'll be accused of participating in project fear.
    - rusk 8y ago
      Project fear didn't go far enough.
- Arnt 8y ago
  You think so? AFAICT there isn't even such a proposal being negotiated, and it had better be ready for signing this year. BINO looks like it might fail through simple lack of time.
  - barking 8y ago
    It will all be decided only at the last moment as is the custom for this sort of thing! (I hope)

ptero 8y ago

> why the downvotes? I did not downvote you, but I think you are getting beaten because you brought up a potential hot topic (brexit) in a way that is unrelated to the discussion topic (copyright). The argument that parties could have been using similar tactics is IMO irrelevant even if true (and that is not clear to me either).