5 ms·

They aren’t moving to “the Cloud” as in AWS or Azure, they’re just moving to bigger/faster/better Gov-owned data center(s). Business as usual.

luma 8y ago
More specifically, an NSA owned and operated datacenter. They are offering access to other intelligence community services, so technically that would be "cloud", but in this case it's NSA's own "cloud".
- blattimwind 8y ago
  The usage of "cloud" is now so broad that basically Hacker News is a cloud, because I can log into it.
  - api 8y ago
    Peer to peer networking is being rebranded as "fog" because its cloud brought down to encompass everything. So now your laptop, phone, fridge, and toilet are the cloud too.
    - giancarlostoro 8y ago
      Fridge and Toilet would fall more under IoT I would think no?
      - ethbro 8y ago
        IoT definitely exists in the fog.
      - mrjudgejoebrown 8y ago
        Internet of Turds in the case of the toilet.
      - labster 8y ago
        Toilets and refrigerators have always been connected to a series of tubes.
        hhh 8y ago
        The prior being the brown-net, and the latter the bluenet.
  - sslayer 8y ago
    The "cloud" in my humble opinion, is just a rebranding of the 1970's mainframe. Everyone sharing resources - just more across multiple systems that 1. So instead of mainframe or cloud, the proper term should really be - Multiframe
  - andor 8y ago
    Things should be seen in context. People here are trying to understand The Cloud as a technical term. They then see contradictions left and right because everything seems to be The Cloud now. It's definitely not a precise technical term anymore, but I'm pretty sure that the organizations switching expect some concrete benefits. Often, switching to "a cloud" simply means using a managed service. Either managed by another company/agency, or by another team in the same company/agency. That means it's not necessarily a technical decision, it's more about making their employees productive. The important thing to realize here for hackers is that not everybody has the same tech skills and needs. As opposed to the (more flexible) hardware in the basement server room, "The Cloud" is bought as a product for a specific purpose. The benefit to end-users is that they can concentrate on their core business, whatever that might be: - Cloud CRM customers can concentrate on CRM stuff. They don't have to worry about hardware, server administration, etc. - Application developers using a PaaS can concentrate on their app. The PaaS handles the lower levels: it keeps the app running, load balances traffic, keeps the app responsive (e.g. by scaling up number of app instances). - Operators of a PaaS can rely on a managed infrastructure layer. Not having to have in-house experts can be an advantage for companies/agencies that have difficulties attracting the right talent. And even for experts, working on the highest possible abstraction level, e.g. using a PaaS or "serverless" when writing an app, can improve efficiency a lot. Depending on the type of service, there are a few other benefits that people expect from "The Cloud", such as elasticity. Self-service and instant availability of resources to end-users is a big one for bureaucratic environments. My team needs a database. I can create one myself through The Cloud, and I don't have to go trough "the official channels" for a permit and then ask a DBA to actually do the work. The Cloud can work around old processes because it comes with risk management built-in. My team can have a resource limit, up to which we can flexibly book any resources we need. Auditing is also built-in. Operators of The Cloud can easily monitor resource usage across teams.
  - PhasmaFelis 8y ago
    I've yet to see a single instance of "the cloud/in the cloud" that couldn't be replaced with "the internet/on the internet" and still mean essentially the same thing.
blitmap 8y ago
I would find it hilarious if they put these data centers on foreign soil so information can't be legally retrieved in some circumstances.
- jonhohle 8y ago
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Eyes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Eyes
- acct1771 8y ago
  Yeah, funniest thing ever.
- Ice_cream_suit 8y ago
  Funny? I would describe it as tragic and scandalous. It is also potentially subversive because of the consequent ability it gives intelligence agencies to suborn their political masters. For an existence proof, look at the troubles that the orange man is having with his intelligence agencies. Even worse, it is already happening. "Five Eyes act as a "supra-national intelligence organisation that doesn't answer to the known laws of its own countries". Documents leaked by in 2013 revealed that the Five Eyes have been spying on one another's citizens and sharing the collected information with each other in order to circumvent restrictive domestic regulations on surveillance of citizens."
  - jonhendry18 8y ago
    "For an existence proof, look at the troubles that the orange man is having with his intelligence agencies." Troubles for which I, for one, am eternally grateful.

luma 8y ago

More specifically, an NSA owned and operated datacenter. They are offering access to other intelligence community services, so technically that would be "cloud", but in this case it's NSA's own "cloud".

blattimwind 8y ago
The usage of "cloud" is now so broad that basically Hacker News is a cloud, because I can log into it.
- api 8y ago
  Peer to peer networking is being rebranded as "fog" because its cloud brought down to encompass everything. So now your laptop, phone, fridge, and toilet are the cloud too.
  - giancarlostoro 8y ago
    Fridge and Toilet would fall more under IoT I would think no?
    - ethbro 8y ago
      IoT definitely exists in the fog.
    - mrjudgejoebrown 8y ago
      Internet of Turds in the case of the toilet.
    - labster 8y ago
      Toilets and refrigerators have always been connected to a series of tubes.
      - hhh 8y ago
        The prior being the brown-net, and the latter the bluenet.
- sslayer 8y ago
  The "cloud" in my humble opinion, is just a rebranding of the 1970's mainframe. Everyone sharing resources - just more across multiple systems that 1. So instead of mainframe or cloud, the proper term should really be - Multiframe
- andor 8y ago
  Things should be seen in context. People here are trying to understand The Cloud as a technical term. They then see contradictions left and right because everything seems to be The Cloud now. It's definitely not a precise technical term anymore, but I'm pretty sure that the organizations switching expect some concrete benefits. Often, switching to "a cloud" simply means using a managed service. Either managed by another company/agency, or by another team in the same company/agency. That means it's not necessarily a technical decision, it's more about making their employees productive. The important thing to realize here for hackers is that not everybody has the same tech skills and needs. As opposed to the (more flexible) hardware in the basement server room, "The Cloud" is bought as a product for a specific purpose. The benefit to end-users is that they can concentrate on their core business, whatever that might be: - Cloud CRM customers can concentrate on CRM stuff. They don't have to worry about hardware, server administration, etc. - Application developers using a PaaS can concentrate on their app. The PaaS handles the lower levels: it keeps the app running, load balances traffic, keeps the app responsive (e.g. by scaling up number of app instances). - Operators of a PaaS can rely on a managed infrastructure layer. Not having to have in-house experts can be an advantage for companies/agencies that have difficulties attracting the right talent. And even for experts, working on the highest possible abstraction level, e.g. using a PaaS or "serverless" when writing an app, can improve efficiency a lot. Depending on the type of service, there are a few other benefits that people expect from "The Cloud", such as elasticity. Self-service and instant availability of resources to end-users is a big one for bureaucratic environments. My team needs a database. I can create one myself through The Cloud, and I don't have to go trough "the official channels" for a permit and then ask a DBA to actually do the work. The Cloud can work around old processes because it comes with risk management built-in. My team can have a resource limit, up to which we can flexibly book any resources we need. Auditing is also built-in. Operators of The Cloud can easily monitor resource usage across teams.
- PhasmaFelis 8y ago
  I've yet to see a single instance of "the cloud/in the cloud" that couldn't be replaced with "the internet/on the internet" and still mean essentially the same thing.

blitmap 8y ago

I would find it hilarious if they put these data centers on foreign soil so information can't be legally retrieved in some circumstances.

jonhohle 8y ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Eyes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Eyes
acct1771 8y ago
Yeah, funniest thing ever.
Ice_cream_suit 8y ago
Funny? I would describe it as tragic and scandalous. It is also potentially subversive because of the consequent ability it gives intelligence agencies to suborn their political masters. For an existence proof, look at the troubles that the orange man is having with his intelligence agencies. Even worse, it is already happening. "Five Eyes act as a "supra-national intelligence organisation that doesn't answer to the known laws of its own countries". Documents leaked by in 2013 revealed that the Five Eyes have been spying on one another's citizens and sharing the collected information with each other in order to circumvent restrictive domestic regulations on surveillance of citizens."
- jonhendry18 8y ago
  "For an existence proof, look at the troubles that the orange man is having with his intelligence agencies." Troubles for which I, for one, am eternally grateful.