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This sounds like a complete lack of training. I imagine the astronauts on a real mission to mars would be instructed to keep hands clear of any live-front elect

This sounds like a complete lack of training. I imagine the astronauts on a real mission to mars would be instructed to keep hands clear of any live-front electrical gear during such operations.

petre 8y ago
Electrical gear should be properly insulated and staff operating on live electrical equipment should wear appropriate protection gear. Moreso on Mars than on Earth.
- walrus01 8y ago
  At the voltages and amperages this size of small off grid pv system is, all you would ever need is insulated gloves and 1000V rated insulated electricians tools. We're not talking about arc flash suits here.
  - petre 8y ago
    Right. You only need stuff readily available at any hardware store. But somehow a crew member managed to electrocute himself and whoever set up the habitat wiring managed to do a lousy job with the circuit breaker panel insulation. I can't really blame that woman for leaving the experiment.
    - walrus01 8y ago
      Yes. I could go buy the necessary tools to build a much better pv system right now from home depot, Platt and graybar. This is all commodity off grid photovoltaic stuff and then ordinary 120v distribution on the AC load side. Nothing special or NASA about it. Maybe they have some current shunts in place or ammeters monitoring load data, same as a residential "Sense" install.
      - lopmotr 8y ago
        Whenever someone does a bad job, there are others who could have done it better, but you couldn't have done that person's entire job better because you weren't available and didn't apply and probably weren't qualified for all their other roles. I think the real problem is that Hawaii apparently has loose electrical safety regulations. Where I live, you're not allowed to wire your own fuse box. It might even be a criminal offence, but no homeowner would ever do that. If there are exposed live wires, then some electrician is responsible for that failure.
    - neurotech1 8y ago
      Lisa Stojanovski is a friend. I fully respect her decision to leave, and don't blame her one bit for leaving when concerns were not taken seriously. Does anyone remember STS-107 Columbia accident? That tragedy showed what was wrong with NASA safety culture.
      - walrus01 8y ago
        Would be more amusing if they stayed, and OSHA inspectors and the local Hawaiian county's electrical code inspectors drove up there and knocked on the door.
        duxup 8y ago
        The other participants concerns with continuing the mission probabbly would involve them pretending the OSHA inspectors were Martians.... because you wouldn't want to risk the study or anything!
Johnny555 8y ago
It's hard to train someone not to do something that they already know they shouldn't do. Everyone knows they shouldn't touch bare wires, but unless you work with electrical circuits regularly, it's hard to develop the practices that keep you from accidentally brushing against an exposed wire. And cutting over to the emergency generator is something that happens rarely. It's unconscionable that they didn't have NEC compliant covers over all exposed wiring. And they shouldn't even be flipping breakers (unless interlocked) to transfer power, they should just be flipping a transfer switch. If they really need to get to the wiring to fix something, it only takes a minute with a screwdriver to take off the cover.
- tomatotomato37 8y ago
  >Everyone knows they shouldn't touch bare wires, but unless you work with electrical circuits regularly, it's hard to develop the practices that keep you from accidentally brushing against an exposed wire. Eh, I'd say even with experience it's hard to drill in, because someone with experience has probably brushed up against something running supposedly lethal voltage once in their life, and walked away with only a startle and a tingly arm, breeding complacency
- walrus01 8y ago
  Set up right they should not have even needed to flip a transfer switch. The generator would be feeding a large ac to dc battery charger, which charges the same battery bank which is connected to the pv charge controller. You can parallel the outputs of an ac-to-dc battery charger and a pv charge controller together onto the same battery bus, with appropriate DC breakers in place. Simply start the generator and the battery bank begins receeiving charge. There are pv charge controllers (Schneider electric) which support generator auto start based on a low voltage threshold.
- emilfihlman 8y ago
  I mean this is harsh but how dump are the people you work with if this is how you see people? Not touching a wire is easy to do. If you can't do that perhaps you shouldn't be participating.

This sounds like a complete lack of training. I imagine the astronauts on a real mission to mars would be instructed to keep hands clear of any live-front electrical gear during such operations.

petre 8y ago

Electrical gear should be properly insulated and staff operating on live electrical equipment should wear appropriate protection gear. Moreso on Mars than on Earth.

walrus01 8y ago
At the voltages and amperages this size of small off grid pv system is, all you would ever need is insulated gloves and 1000V rated insulated electricians tools. We're not talking about arc flash suits here.
- petre 8y ago
  Right. You only need stuff readily available at any hardware store. But somehow a crew member managed to electrocute himself and whoever set up the habitat wiring managed to do a lousy job with the circuit breaker panel insulation. I can't really blame that woman for leaving the experiment.
  - walrus01 8y ago
    Yes. I could go buy the necessary tools to build a much better pv system right now from home depot, Platt and graybar. This is all commodity off grid photovoltaic stuff and then ordinary 120v distribution on the AC load side. Nothing special or NASA about it. Maybe they have some current shunts in place or ammeters monitoring load data, same as a residential "Sense" install.
    - lopmotr 8y ago
      Whenever someone does a bad job, there are others who could have done it better, but you couldn't have done that person's entire job better because you weren't available and didn't apply and probably weren't qualified for all their other roles. I think the real problem is that Hawaii apparently has loose electrical safety regulations. Where I live, you're not allowed to wire your own fuse box. It might even be a criminal offence, but no homeowner would ever do that. If there are exposed live wires, then some electrician is responsible for that failure.
  - neurotech1 8y ago
    Lisa Stojanovski is a friend. I fully respect her decision to leave, and don't blame her one bit for leaving when concerns were not taken seriously. Does anyone remember STS-107 Columbia accident? That tragedy showed what was wrong with NASA safety culture.
    - walrus01 8y ago
      Would be more amusing if they stayed, and OSHA inspectors and the local Hawaiian county's electrical code inspectors drove up there and knocked on the door.
      - duxup 8y ago
        The other participants concerns with continuing the mission probabbly would involve them pretending the OSHA inspectors were Martians.... because you wouldn't want to risk the study or anything!

Johnny555 8y ago

It's hard to train someone not to do something that they already know they shouldn't do. Everyone knows they shouldn't touch bare wires, but unless you work with electrical circuits regularly, it's hard to develop the practices that keep you from accidentally brushing against an exposed wire. And cutting over to the emergency generator is something that happens rarely. It's unconscionable that they didn't have NEC compliant covers over all exposed wiring. And they shouldn't even be flipping breakers (unless interlocked) to transfer power, they should just be flipping a transfer switch. If they really need to get to the wiring to fix something, it only takes a minute with a screwdriver to take off the cover.

tomatotomato37 8y ago
>Everyone knows they shouldn't touch bare wires, but unless you work with electrical circuits regularly, it's hard to develop the practices that keep you from accidentally brushing against an exposed wire. Eh, I'd say even with experience it's hard to drill in, because someone with experience has probably brushed up against something running supposedly lethal voltage once in their life, and walked away with only a startle and a tingly arm, breeding complacency
walrus01 8y ago
Set up right they should not have even needed to flip a transfer switch. The generator would be feeding a large ac to dc battery charger, which charges the same battery bank which is connected to the pv charge controller. You can parallel the outputs of an ac-to-dc battery charger and a pv charge controller together onto the same battery bus, with appropriate DC breakers in place. Simply start the generator and the battery bank begins receeiving charge. There are pv charge controllers (Schneider electric) which support generator auto start based on a low voltage threshold.
emilfihlman 8y ago
I mean this is harsh but how dump are the people you work with if this is how you see people? Not touching a wire is easy to do. If you can't do that perhaps you shouldn't be participating.