4 ms·

Well the vast majority of these kids would prefer to stay in the US. Clearly the solution to prevent them from taking their knowledge back to their home countr

Well the vast majority of these kids would prefer to stay in the US. Clearly the solution to prevent them from taking their knowledge back to their home countries is to denigrate them politically and make it harder and more inconvenient for them to live and work here.

exelius 8y ago
I would not agree with this. I went to an elite business school and my Chinese classmates all felt there was far more opportunity for them in China with an American education. They’re not stupid, they look at China and see an economy growing at 6-9% a year while the US is stuck at 1-2% and they know where the growth is for the medium-term. They also see a mature American economy that can be tough to crack even for native white citizens, so its not hard to see how their chances of long-term success are much higher in China than in the US.
- worldengineer 8y ago
  They are stupid, if they didn't know about China's fake gdp for the past several years. "U.S. GDP could top 4% in 2nd quarter, economists say" https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-gdp-could-top-4-in-2nd-quarter-economists-say-2018-05-31 https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-gdp-could-top-4-in-2nd-... "Baotou in China’s Inner Mongolia Autonomous Region revised its estimated fiscal revenue in 2017 lower by nearly 50% in an annual work report" https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-data/another-chinese-city-admits-fake-economic-data-idUSKBN1F60I1 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-data/anothe... "China fake data mask economic rebound" https://www.ft.com/content/a9889330-f51c-11e7-88f7-5465a6ce1a00 https://www.ft.com/content/a9889330-f51c-11e7-88f7-5465a6ce1...
  - exelius 8y ago
    Nobody can predict anything today, with president temper tantrum throwing weekly wrenches into the global economy. But over the last decade they would have been right; and keep in mind that even in China, most economic gains have been captured by the elite — which anyone educated in a top American university would be a part of almost by definition. Also weighing heavily on people are family and cultural conflict issues. But anecdotally I can say that the majority of Chinese students don’t want to stay in the US for a variety of reasons; and that many feel their prospects are at least as good in China as the US.
- kjeetgill 8y ago
  My experience matches the parent's. Of a good 70 classmates the only two who went back had trouble finding work here. I suspect your business school experience might differ from an engineering department. A substantial personality difference wouldn't surprise me.
- seanmcdirmid 8y ago
  Business school and liberal arts kids will mostly go back to China, STEM is very different.
  - intrasight 8y ago
    My Chinese STEP colleagues have or plan to go back. Too many cultural and political impediments to progress here now.
    - icantdrive55 8y ago
      Could you elaborate? What are the cultural, and political impediments for Chinese STEM graduates? I was under the impression that those days were over, unless you happen to be part of my lineage?
    - seanmcdirmid 8y ago
      Is that new? Because the trend has been very stabke for the past 10 years: fuerdai kids (with rich parents) who come to america to study major in liberal arts and business but will almost always go back because that is where their connections are. These are relatively new foreign students in the USA and constitute much of the recent boom. The more tradition Chinese students who have been coming here since the 1980s (and don’t have very rich parents) mostly pick STEM majors. On graduating, they would rather work for Google in Mountain View than Tencent in Shenzhen.
- malchow 8y ago
  More like US 4% and China 7%.
analyst74 8y ago
A lot of them would love to stay, trading better life/career prospect with the inconveniences of living in a foreign country which only partially accepts them. That's the old trade-off, and how America got the worlds' talent. But as lives in home countries get better, US would have to do more to make those immigrants feel like home. Or that trade-off would slowly stop making sense, and more people will go back to their home countries. This is not just happening with the Chinese.
allegedganon 8y ago
>Well the vast majority of these kids would prefer to stay in the US. I'm afraid you're making assumptions here. America is not where opportunity is these days, especially in the hardware manufacturing sector.
- selectodude 8y ago
  >America is not where opportunity is these days Yes, but the living standards in the United States are far higher. Sure you may never become a billionaire here like you can in China, but you can breathe the air and the traffic isn't that bad. The schools are better, the houses are bigger. China may get there, but I know where I'd rather be over the next 20-30 years. And they can always move back.
  - ageofwant 8y ago
    Not that far, and shrinking fast, depends on who and where you are in China, just like the US. Trump is fixing the air quality issue[1]. China has excellent high speed trains and very innovative and modern shopping malls and housing estates. Google around. Chinese primary and secondary schools are way better than American high schools. Chinese attend international universities to gain experience and network opportunities. They are not here to because here is better. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/10/05/climate/trump-environment-rules-reversed.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/10/05/climate/trump...
    - cataractum 8y ago
      > Chinese primary and secondary schools are way better than American high schools. Chinese attend international universities to gain experience and network opportunities. They are not here to because here is better. You heard of the (infamous) Gaokao? It's gruelling, and necessitates nothing but continuous study day in and day out to get into a decent Chinese university. If they could, a lot of Chinese would prefer to study in the US (or any other western country for that matter).
  - PakG1 8y ago
jonhendry18 8y ago
"Well the vast majority of these kids would prefer to stay in the US." For now.
__m 8y ago
That doesn't seem to be the current administration's goal. H-1B Visa, America's secret weapon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NK0Y9j_CGgM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NK0Y9j_CGgM

exelius 8y ago

I would not agree with this. I went to an elite business school and my Chinese classmates all felt there was far more opportunity for them in China with an American education. They’re not stupid, they look at China and see an economy growing at 6-9% a year while the US is stuck at 1-2% and they know where the growth is for the medium-term. They also see a mature American economy that can be tough to crack even for native white citizens, so its not hard to see how their chances of long-term success are much higher in China than in the US.

worldengineer 8y ago
They are stupid, if they didn't know about China's fake gdp for the past several years. "U.S. GDP could top 4% in 2nd quarter, economists say" https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-gdp-could-top-4-in-2nd-quarter-economists-say-2018-05-31 https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-gdp-could-top-4-in-2nd-... "Baotou in China’s Inner Mongolia Autonomous Region revised its estimated fiscal revenue in 2017 lower by nearly 50% in an annual work report" https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-data/another-chinese-city-admits-fake-economic-data-idUSKBN1F60I1 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-economy-data/anothe... "China fake data mask economic rebound" https://www.ft.com/content/a9889330-f51c-11e7-88f7-5465a6ce1a00 https://www.ft.com/content/a9889330-f51c-11e7-88f7-5465a6ce1...
- exelius 8y ago
  Nobody can predict anything today, with president temper tantrum throwing weekly wrenches into the global economy. But over the last decade they would have been right; and keep in mind that even in China, most economic gains have been captured by the elite — which anyone educated in a top American university would be a part of almost by definition. Also weighing heavily on people are family and cultural conflict issues. But anecdotally I can say that the majority of Chinese students don’t want to stay in the US for a variety of reasons; and that many feel their prospects are at least as good in China as the US.
kjeetgill 8y ago
My experience matches the parent's. Of a good 70 classmates the only two who went back had trouble finding work here. I suspect your business school experience might differ from an engineering department. A substantial personality difference wouldn't surprise me.
seanmcdirmid 8y ago
Business school and liberal arts kids will mostly go back to China, STEM is very different.
- intrasight 8y ago
  My Chinese STEP colleagues have or plan to go back. Too many cultural and political impediments to progress here now.
  - icantdrive55 8y ago
    Could you elaborate? What are the cultural, and political impediments for Chinese STEM graduates? I was under the impression that those days were over, unless you happen to be part of my lineage?
  - seanmcdirmid 8y ago
    Is that new? Because the trend has been very stabke for the past 10 years: fuerdai kids (with rich parents) who come to america to study major in liberal arts and business but will almost always go back because that is where their connections are. These are relatively new foreign students in the USA and constitute much of the recent boom. The more tradition Chinese students who have been coming here since the 1980s (and don’t have very rich parents) mostly pick STEM majors. On graduating, they would rather work for Google in Mountain View than Tencent in Shenzhen.
malchow 8y ago
More like US 4% and China 7%.

analyst74 8y ago

A lot of them would love to stay, trading better life/career prospect with the inconveniences of living in a foreign country which only partially accepts them. That's the old trade-off, and how America got the worlds' talent. But as lives in home countries get better, US would have to do more to make those immigrants feel like home. Or that trade-off would slowly stop making sense, and more people will go back to their home countries. This is not just happening with the Chinese.

allegedganon 8y ago

>Well the vast majority of these kids would prefer to stay in the US. I'm afraid you're making assumptions here. America is not where opportunity is these days, especially in the hardware manufacturing sector.

selectodude 8y ago
>America is not where opportunity is these days Yes, but the living standards in the United States are far higher. Sure you may never become a billionaire here like you can in China, but you can breathe the air and the traffic isn't that bad. The schools are better, the houses are bigger. China may get there, but I know where I'd rather be over the next 20-30 years. And they can always move back.
- ageofwant 8y ago
  Not that far, and shrinking fast, depends on who and where you are in China, just like the US. Trump is fixing the air quality issue[1]. China has excellent high speed trains and very innovative and modern shopping malls and housing estates. Google around. Chinese primary and secondary schools are way better than American high schools. Chinese attend international universities to gain experience and network opportunities. They are not here to because here is better. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/10/05/climate/trump-environment-rules-reversed.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/10/05/climate/trump...
  - cataractum 8y ago
    > Chinese primary and secondary schools are way better than American high schools. Chinese attend international universities to gain experience and network opportunities. They are not here to because here is better. You heard of the (infamous) Gaokao? It's gruelling, and necessitates nothing but continuous study day in and day out to get into a decent Chinese university. If they could, a lot of Chinese would prefer to study in the US (or any other western country for that matter).
- PakG1 8y ago

jonhendry18 8y ago

"Well the vast majority of these kids would prefer to stay in the US." For now.

__m 8y ago

That doesn't seem to be the current administration's goal. H-1B Visa, America's secret weapon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NK0Y9j_CGgM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NK0Y9j_CGgM