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I'm excited about this. This will boost VPN, Tor and other technologies that protect users from inane regulations. https://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.8

by VMG 8y ago

I'm excited about this. This will boost VPN, Tor and other technologies that protect users from inane regulations. https://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.805/articles/crypto/cypherpunks/may-crypto-manifesto.html https://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.805/articles/cryp...

outsidetheparty 8y ago
How do you figure? Doesn't matter if you're connecting via VPN or Tor if what you're connecting to has been scrubbed by these inane regulations. Unless you're expecting the whole internet to go all rebel pirate underground, which seems... implausible.
- VMG 8y ago
  I expect companies to migrate to saner regulatory environments and geofilter the EU. VPN/Tor will help circumvent this.
  - outsidetheparty 8y ago
    Hm. Saner regulatory environments seem to be pretty thin on the ground, lately. Not sure I share your optimism that a significant number of companies will be willing to abandon a major world market, or to depend on a nudge-nudge-wink-wink "bypass our geofence and we'll pretend we don't notice your EU billing address" kind of thing...
    - VMG 8y ago
      Luckily now we not only have crypto-communication, but also currency :)
merinowool 8y ago
It is very easy to block VPN, Tor and other technologies. These can be in fact criminalised the same way drugs are. Possession of a VPN on your device could give you a criminal record.
- glorkk 8y ago
  It is very easy to make unenforceable laws. Actually blocking VPNs would require something akin to the great firewall of China, which I don't see the EU building in the near future. Criminalizing something means nothing if the laws can't be enforced. Torrenting copyrighted works is a criminal act, and yet torrenting has never been easier after years of efforts to shut it down from all sides.
  - merinowool 8y ago
    They do worse - instead of just blocking the internet, they'll first inspect what is being uploaded to it.
- VMG 8y ago
  This will in turn make encrypted devices, plausible deniability setups and steganography more pervasive. The US lost the crypto wars, EU lost the piracy wars once, and they will lose again.
  - merinowool 8y ago
    In some countries you can do time for not disclosing passwords. In the UK it is 5 years.
    - VMG 8y ago
      Again, this is where plausible deniability setups kick in. Of course the EU can go full police state, but at that point I hope the regular citizens pushes back. The goal is to raise the cost of enforcement.
      - merinowool 8y ago
        Problem is that you cannot pretend you can't remember the password. So unless what you hide can give you more time than for not disclosing the password, then yes having things encrypted could help...
throwaway77384 8y ago
I am also excited about this. I believe there is a small chance that this will result in us getting a bit of the 'old internet' pre-eternal September back. I would love to go back to an internet that's harder to access, with a higher ratio of noobs to more experienced technology users. Everything was so much more fun back then. I have in fact begun to resent the internet over the last 10 years or so...and my usage has dropped to like one or two websites that could be called communities. This being one of them. The rest is now purely utilitarian. Online banking and courses.

by VMG 8y ago

outsidetheparty 8y ago

How do you figure? Doesn't matter if you're connecting via VPN or Tor if what you're connecting to has been scrubbed by these inane regulations. Unless you're expecting the whole internet to go all rebel pirate underground, which seems... implausible.

VMG 8y ago
I expect companies to migrate to saner regulatory environments and geofilter the EU. VPN/Tor will help circumvent this.
- outsidetheparty 8y ago
  Hm. Saner regulatory environments seem to be pretty thin on the ground, lately. Not sure I share your optimism that a significant number of companies will be willing to abandon a major world market, or to depend on a nudge-nudge-wink-wink "bypass our geofence and we'll pretend we don't notice your EU billing address" kind of thing...
  - VMG 8y ago
    Luckily now we not only have crypto-communication, but also currency :)

merinowool 8y ago

It is very easy to block VPN, Tor and other technologies. These can be in fact criminalised the same way drugs are. Possession of a VPN on your device could give you a criminal record.

glorkk 8y ago
It is very easy to make unenforceable laws. Actually blocking VPNs would require something akin to the great firewall of China, which I don't see the EU building in the near future. Criminalizing something means nothing if the laws can't be enforced. Torrenting copyrighted works is a criminal act, and yet torrenting has never been easier after years of efforts to shut it down from all sides.
- merinowool 8y ago
  They do worse - instead of just blocking the internet, they'll first inspect what is being uploaded to it.
VMG 8y ago
This will in turn make encrypted devices, plausible deniability setups and steganography more pervasive. The US lost the crypto wars, EU lost the piracy wars once, and they will lose again.
- merinowool 8y ago
  In some countries you can do time for not disclosing passwords. In the UK it is 5 years.
  - VMG 8y ago
    Again, this is where plausible deniability setups kick in. Of course the EU can go full police state, but at that point I hope the regular citizens pushes back. The goal is to raise the cost of enforcement.
    - merinowool 8y ago
      Problem is that you cannot pretend you can't remember the password. So unless what you hide can give you more time than for not disclosing the password, then yes having things encrypted could help...

throwaway77384 8y ago

I am also excited about this. I believe there is a small chance that this will result in us getting a bit of the 'old internet' pre-eternal September back. I would love to go back to an internet that's harder to access, with a higher ratio of noobs to more experienced technology users. Everything was so much more fun back then. I have in fact begun to resent the internet over the last 10 years or so...and my usage has dropped to like one or two websites that could be called communities. This being one of them. The rest is now purely utilitarian. Online banking and courses.