4 ms·

This is a fairly big abstraction, but we live in a world system that's based on discounting unseen externalities; sweeping the hurt under the rug, so to speak.

This is a fairly big abstraction, but we live in a world system that's based on discounting unseen externalities; sweeping the hurt under the rug, so to speak. The world-system started with the theft of the American continent and perpetual genocide of the natives, continued with the mass industrialized kidnapping from Africa, and persists today in a cyberpunk, abstracted form that some call "capitalism." There isn't any real name for what we have, the name will come from the next world system, if there is one, a world system where the collective genius of humanity will be free from the constraints of nation, money, gender......

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
immad 8y ago
This is ridiculous. We live in a generally improving world with declining global poverty, declining child mortality, declining war etc etc. There are still tons of problems but I don’t think such a pessimistic outlook is useful to solving them. We should look for concrete political and technological solutions.
- rcMgD2BwE72F 8y ago
  >We live in a generally improving world (...) I thin you're unknowingly validating OP thesis. All the improvements you mention are directly affecting mankind. But at what costs did we get these immediate improvements? What are the externalities? At some points, they will have direct, dire consequences on human life. You're probably aware of climate change already (we talk a lot about this, but it's getting worse), but our focus will switch to ecological collapse. "We will see mass extinctions that undermine human well-being". https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-03891-1 https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-03891-1 Here in Europe, we've already lost 30% of birds' populations, and 80% of insects in 30 years. The loss is accelerating fast. Now, is it possible that the effects of climate change and loss of biodiversity can exceed the improvements you've mentioned initially? Can you discard this hypothesis?
lopmotr 8y ago
The Arab slave trade took more slaves from Africa than the American slave trade. Maybe it's really the Muslims that are the cause of Philippine overfishing? Still doesn't make much sense!
- bshepard 8y ago
  Every single history I've read about slavery indicates that the middle passage was orders of magnitude larger and more intense than pre-modern slave systems. To the first comment: our world is changing. We are leaving the world system that was created around 1500. That said, we're still inside of it, and so social practices as manifestly illogical and inane as concentration camps ("prisons"), national borders, and the burning of carbon continue.
  - lopmotr 8y ago
    Most of them didn't go to America but it looks like the order of magnitude was about the same for both ~10's of millions. The Arabs castrated their male slaves so they didn't leave a black population for us to notice like America and Sth America have.
- dang 8y ago
  Please don't break the site guidelines by bringing extraneous flamebait into an already divisive thread. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: looks like we've had to warn you about this repeatedly in the past. Eventually we ban accounts that won't stop doing it, so will you please stop?

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

immad 8y ago

This is ridiculous. We live in a generally improving world with declining global poverty, declining child mortality, declining war etc etc. There are still tons of problems but I don’t think such a pessimistic outlook is useful to solving them. We should look for concrete political and technological solutions.

rcMgD2BwE72F 8y ago
>We live in a generally improving world (...) I thin you're unknowingly validating OP thesis. All the improvements you mention are directly affecting mankind. But at what costs did we get these immediate improvements? What are the externalities? At some points, they will have direct, dire consequences on human life. You're probably aware of climate change already (we talk a lot about this, but it's getting worse), but our focus will switch to ecological collapse. "We will see mass extinctions that undermine human well-being". https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-03891-1 https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-03891-1 Here in Europe, we've already lost 30% of birds' populations, and 80% of insects in 30 years. The loss is accelerating fast. Now, is it possible that the effects of climate change and loss of biodiversity can exceed the improvements you've mentioned initially? Can you discard this hypothesis?

lopmotr 8y ago

The Arab slave trade took more slaves from Africa than the American slave trade. Maybe it's really the Muslims that are the cause of Philippine overfishing? Still doesn't make much sense!

bshepard 8y ago
Every single history I've read about slavery indicates that the middle passage was orders of magnitude larger and more intense than pre-modern slave systems. To the first comment: our world is changing. We are leaving the world system that was created around 1500. That said, we're still inside of it, and so social practices as manifestly illogical and inane as concentration camps ("prisons"), national borders, and the burning of carbon continue.
- lopmotr 8y ago
  Most of them didn't go to America but it looks like the order of magnitude was about the same for both ~10's of millions. The Arabs castrated their male slaves so they didn't leave a black population for us to notice like America and Sth America have.
dang 8y ago
Please don't break the site guidelines by bringing extraneous flamebait into an already divisive thread. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: looks like we've had to warn you about this repeatedly in the past. Eventually we ban accounts that won't stop doing it, so will you please stop?