4 ms·

Well, it reminds me of Star Citizen for sure -- in that it's a pretty-looking interface but overburdened with unacceptably long loading times, laggy and unrespo

Well, it reminds me of Star Citizen for sure -- in that it's a pretty-looking interface but overburdened with unacceptably long loading times, laggy and unresponsive feedback in the UI, and motion blur on all the things to the point of being unusable. Every few months I look into where SC is at, and am not surprised to see more flash and surface-level polish, more extra features no one was asking for, and yet core gameplay/interactions that make me cringe when trying to interact with them. Why is SC this way?

r00fus 8y ago
Maybe core gameplay/interaction modifications are the hard, unglamorous stuff?
- existencebox 8y ago
  Some context; as someone who pledged in 2012. I'd hope the OP doesn't come off as dismissive to the "hard unglamorous" stuff, since I see this as a separate issue. For me at least, the problem is largely that in the last 6 years, we've gotten PILES of UX revisions, all of which favor form over function to a laughable degree. This map, while pretty, is fractionally as useful as a flattened stretchy-grid-auto-layouted hairball. It lacks basic features like being able to _zoom out to actually see the whole volume without rotating_, let alone functionality in companion apps to competitor games[0], not to mention that to render the UX my significantly overpowered dev box is chugging away quite hard. Meanwhile, the core gameplay systems have, by many fans perceptions, degraded in quality, and prior deliverable dates have been slipped to levels that would get me fired in my position. Again, I don't want to sell short the difficulty of the engine work they're trying to do, and frankly I should probably keep separate my grievances about deadline-meeting (although that certainly throws salt on the metaphorical wound). But to my eyes this is in the same vein as the complaints I see about other web products, "you have something good, polish but then don't fix what aint broke", while echoing a trope Star Citizen inflicted on itself from its very first "Iron Man" HUD design.[1] (reviled for being piles of overdesigned spinny widgets, and very little functionality). [0]http://evemaps.dotlan.net http://evemaps.dotlan.net [1]http://i.imgur.com/4gMaYpu.gif http://i.imgur.com/4gMaYpu.gif
  - empath75 8y ago
    It’s pretty obvious that they never intend to release a game at this point.
    - wavefunction 8y ago
      I... disagree?
    - DoofusOfDeath 8y ago
      I completely sympathize with where I think you're coming from, but the conversation will be more interesting if we avoid hyperbole.
    - star-castle 8y ago
      They've already released "a game". The ultimate failure will come in the form an announcement: it's done! tadaaa! click here to purchase! But the SC as imagined by the 1000th "what money is still coming in? promise something! promise more!" new stretch goal, that will never be released.
      - ehnto 8y ago
        They have said in an interview that they intend every dollar pledged to go into development, so in some ways what you are saying makes sense. They do have an actual roadmap now though so that's promising. Also SQ42 will come out at some point between now and the Star Citizens launch so they will have a hype cycle they need to release at the right time for.
    - ehnto 8y ago
      That must be why they hired 500 people and keep spending all their money on development instead of fancy holidays.
  - sgift 8y ago
    > This map, while pretty, is fractionally as useful as a flattened stretchy-grid-auto-layouted hairball. It lacks basic features like being able to _zoom out to actually see the whole volume without rotating_, l I can zoom out and see the whole volume just fine. Don't select a specific system, use the mouse wheel. It works exactly as I expect a star map to work and it looks beautiful. > Meanwhile, the core gameplay systems have, by many fans perceptions, degraded in quality, and prior deliverable dates have been slipped to levels that would get me fired in my position. I really have my doubts that the people who cry the loudest are really "fans" or even pledged. There are real problems (e.g. the deliverable date thing, which they now reigned in a bit by doing a new feature release every three month), but many of the so called criticisms are just crying wolf or repeating old accusations which don't even fit anymore (see one of the posts below which states that they add stretch goal after stretch goal with new money ... there hasn't been a new stretch goal for a long time and they made clear that there won't be. All new money goes to existing targets)
ohyes 8y ago
It seemed pretty slick/responsive to me, I've never played the Star Citizen game however so I can't tell how useful it is.
- wavefunction 8y ago
  At the moment it is not very useful in game as they are just now reaching the point where they will start introducing multi-system mechanics. However it does provide some vision for where the game developers would like to go for the restive SC backer population so there is some value in that
arcaster 8y ago
Runs perfectly smooth for me in chrome at 1440 x what ever 31" is in pixels...
- letsgetphysITal 8y ago
  Likely 3440 if ultrawide 21:9.
  - arcaster 8y ago
    You've got it!
shmerl 8y ago
Runs very well for me (Firefox 61, Linux x86_64, AMD Vega 56 / Mesa, GPU load ~30%).
zamalek 8y ago
Runs fine on my machine. Are you using an integrated GPU?
kevingadd 8y ago
Over a minute to load on gigabit fiber. Jeez.
- sgift 8y ago
  The problem is certainly not the connection then. What's behind that Fiber? Pentium 60 Mhz? Works fine here - far less than gigabit fiber, FF Nightly.
ehnto 8y ago
In the actual game, the FPS kills their otherwise really fun UI. I finally got to play it at 40 FPS or more recently and it makes an insane difference to how it all feels. It doesn't feel clunky or broken when it's running properly. You also start to understand some of their choices when you play for a while and feel the built in pacing of the game. It's not a flashy fast paced space call of duty. Every interaction is more drawn out, and forces you to be a bit more patient and thoughtful. I also have to point out that it runs smoothly for me and many others, but it is an alpha game that's supposed to be cutting edge in a few years time when it releases. Expecting it to run well everywhere has been one of the huge drawbacks of open development as they have ended up doing a few performance passes that really didn't need to be done yet. It's not meant to be a released game. It also loads in less than 40 seconds for me now as they implemented level streaming.
- ponyous 8y ago
  You are making it sound good... I can't imagine playing any FPS at 40FPS. And 40sec of load time on an SSD? That's a lot if you ask me. Fortnite loads in <5secs, CS:GO also in <5secs. Just few days ago I installed Quake Champions and the game needs 30+secs to load and it's really frustrating, considering matches are quite fast + their menu forces you to look at all achievements and all the crap I don't care about. Waiting is horrible. It's great hat they are making improvements, but as another commenter said it seems like they haven't polished core gameplay enough -at least not enough for me to care.
  - wlesieutre 8y ago
    One thing to note about Star Citizen is that you load into the universe once and that's it. Assuming no crashes (it'll happen someday) you can play for hours across multiple space stations and planets without another loading screen.
    - ponyous 8y ago
      That's a good point about loading times. I haven't played it yet and was just assuming it needs a load screen from system to system.

r00fus 8y ago

Maybe core gameplay/interaction modifications are the hard, unglamorous stuff?

existencebox 8y ago
Some context; as someone who pledged in 2012. I'd hope the OP doesn't come off as dismissive to the "hard unglamorous" stuff, since I see this as a separate issue. For me at least, the problem is largely that in the last 6 years, we've gotten PILES of UX revisions, all of which favor form over function to a laughable degree. This map, while pretty, is fractionally as useful as a flattened stretchy-grid-auto-layouted hairball. It lacks basic features like being able to _zoom out to actually see the whole volume without rotating_, let alone functionality in companion apps to competitor games[0], not to mention that to render the UX my significantly overpowered dev box is chugging away quite hard. Meanwhile, the core gameplay systems have, by many fans perceptions, degraded in quality, and prior deliverable dates have been slipped to levels that would get me fired in my position. Again, I don't want to sell short the difficulty of the engine work they're trying to do, and frankly I should probably keep separate my grievances about deadline-meeting (although that certainly throws salt on the metaphorical wound). But to my eyes this is in the same vein as the complaints I see about other web products, "you have something good, polish but then don't fix what aint broke", while echoing a trope Star Citizen inflicted on itself from its very first "Iron Man" HUD design.[1] (reviled for being piles of overdesigned spinny widgets, and very little functionality). [0]http://evemaps.dotlan.net http://evemaps.dotlan.net [1]http://i.imgur.com/4gMaYpu.gif http://i.imgur.com/4gMaYpu.gif
- empath75 8y ago
  It’s pretty obvious that they never intend to release a game at this point.
  - wavefunction 8y ago
    I... disagree?
  - DoofusOfDeath 8y ago
    I completely sympathize with where I think you're coming from, but the conversation will be more interesting if we avoid hyperbole.
  - star-castle 8y ago
    They've already released "a game". The ultimate failure will come in the form an announcement: it's done! tadaaa! click here to purchase! But the SC as imagined by the 1000th "what money is still coming in? promise something! promise more!" new stretch goal, that will never be released.
    - ehnto 8y ago
      They have said in an interview that they intend every dollar pledged to go into development, so in some ways what you are saying makes sense. They do have an actual roadmap now though so that's promising. Also SQ42 will come out at some point between now and the Star Citizens launch so they will have a hype cycle they need to release at the right time for.
  - ehnto 8y ago
    That must be why they hired 500 people and keep spending all their money on development instead of fancy holidays.
- sgift 8y ago
  > This map, while pretty, is fractionally as useful as a flattened stretchy-grid-auto-layouted hairball. It lacks basic features like being able to _zoom out to actually see the whole volume without rotating_, l I can zoom out and see the whole volume just fine. Don't select a specific system, use the mouse wheel. It works exactly as I expect a star map to work and it looks beautiful. > Meanwhile, the core gameplay systems have, by many fans perceptions, degraded in quality, and prior deliverable dates have been slipped to levels that would get me fired in my position. I really have my doubts that the people who cry the loudest are really "fans" or even pledged. There are real problems (e.g. the deliverable date thing, which they now reigned in a bit by doing a new feature release every three month), but many of the so called criticisms are just crying wolf or repeating old accusations which don't even fit anymore (see one of the posts below which states that they add stretch goal after stretch goal with new money ... there hasn't been a new stretch goal for a long time and they made clear that there won't be. All new money goes to existing targets)

ohyes 8y ago

It seemed pretty slick/responsive to me, I've never played the Star Citizen game however so I can't tell how useful it is.

wavefunction 8y ago
At the moment it is not very useful in game as they are just now reaching the point where they will start introducing multi-system mechanics. However it does provide some vision for where the game developers would like to go for the restive SC backer population so there is some value in that

arcaster 8y ago

Runs perfectly smooth for me in chrome at 1440 x what ever 31" is in pixels...

letsgetphysITal 8y ago
Likely 3440 if ultrawide 21:9.
- arcaster 8y ago
  You've got it!

shmerl 8y ago

Runs very well for me (Firefox 61, Linux x86_64, AMD Vega 56 / Mesa, GPU load ~30%).

zamalek 8y ago

Runs fine on my machine. Are you using an integrated GPU?

kevingadd 8y ago

Over a minute to load on gigabit fiber. Jeez.

sgift 8y ago
The problem is certainly not the connection then. What's behind that Fiber? Pentium 60 Mhz? Works fine here - far less than gigabit fiber, FF Nightly.

ehnto 8y ago

In the actual game, the FPS kills their otherwise really fun UI. I finally got to play it at 40 FPS or more recently and it makes an insane difference to how it all feels. It doesn't feel clunky or broken when it's running properly. You also start to understand some of their choices when you play for a while and feel the built in pacing of the game. It's not a flashy fast paced space call of duty. Every interaction is more drawn out, and forces you to be a bit more patient and thoughtful. I also have to point out that it runs smoothly for me and many others, but it is an alpha game that's supposed to be cutting edge in a few years time when it releases. Expecting it to run well everywhere has been one of the huge drawbacks of open development as they have ended up doing a few performance passes that really didn't need to be done yet. It's not meant to be a released game. It also loads in less than 40 seconds for me now as they implemented level streaming.

ponyous 8y ago
You are making it sound good... I can't imagine playing any FPS at 40FPS. And 40sec of load time on an SSD? That's a lot if you ask me. Fortnite loads in <5secs, CS:GO also in <5secs. Just few days ago I installed Quake Champions and the game needs 30+secs to load and it's really frustrating, considering matches are quite fast + their menu forces you to look at all achievements and all the crap I don't care about. Waiting is horrible. It's great hat they are making improvements, but as another commenter said it seems like they haven't polished core gameplay enough -at least not enough for me to care.
- wlesieutre 8y ago
  One thing to note about Star Citizen is that you load into the universe once and that's it. Assuming no crashes (it'll happen someday) you can play for hours across multiple space stations and planets without another loading screen.
  - ponyous 8y ago
    That's a good point about loading times. I haven't played it yet and was just assuming it needs a load screen from system to system.