4 ms·

FiveThirtyEight is an American operation with, I imagine, overwhelmingly American readership. To Americans, the sport is called "soccer". Why be purposefully co

FiveThirtyEight is an American operation with, I imagine, overwhelmingly American readership. To Americans, the sport is called "soccer". Why be purposefully confusing, given that to just about the entire country, "football" means American football?

orf 8y ago
The 2014 world cup reached 3.2 billion people. I don't really care if you have a small regional sport with less than 5% of that viewership that just happens to have a name clash, it would be nice to call football by its proper name. Again, it's petty, but I'm English and it's a pet peeve of mine.
- bane 8y ago
  How would we distinguish between the two then? One is almost universally popular here and the other is pretty much ignored entirely. In what universe would what you propose make even the slightest bit of sense?
  - Shorel 8y ago
    Your use of the word 'universally' is, IMO, part of the issue. Your country is not the world or the universe, even if everyday language indicates that. Language use seems to affect subconscious behavior, even if not intended. Anyway, my point is, you have been manipulated through your language.
    - bane 8y ago
      You are absolutely correct, from now on I will call soccer "Chuk-ku" because that's what it's called somewhere else.
- marcoperaza 8y ago
  Why should people in the US care what people elsewhere like to watch or what they call it?
- pault 8y ago
  But the word "soccer" is an English invention. It's not like Americans just made it up to annoy cranky Brits.
  - pbhjpbhj 8y ago
    Cranky Brits _think_ that "soccer" is a USA-ism, and so they hate it by analogy with parts of British-English that are eroded by constant exposure to USA media/culture. Someone in /r/BritishProblems called a zebra crossing a "crosswalk" the other day and as an en-gb native I couldn't help but be scandalised! ;o)
- eeeuo 8y ago
  I find this to be a pretty obnoxious point of contention. Soccer is an English term invented in the 19th century. It spread to a number of Anglosphere countries in a similar manner to all sorts of words from 19th century England. It is currently used in Canada, the US, Ireland[1], South Africa, Australia, New Zealand etc. The idea that soccer is an "Americanism" simultaneously requires you to believe that (a) that only Americans use the term and (b) that Americans are ignorant of the rest of the world. The reality, of course, is that these countries are using a term that has existed for over a century and is a borrowed word from England. Each of these countries have a prominent sport containing the word football(various rugby codes, american football, gaelic sports), and therefore it was convenient to retain the term soccer. This, of course, does not jive very well with lazy anti-Americanism however, which generally seems to be the point of the exercise. [1] I know, I know.
  - orf 8y ago
    I appreciate your analysis but reject that it's 'lazy anti-americanism'. I've never heard anyone from Ireland use that term, and I've known a lot of people from there and have visited a few times. Same for South Africa, but I have never travelled there. The core point is that while there are regional differences none of those countries have anywhere near the same level of media influence as America, so yes, it is an Americanism like it or not. And when writing an article literally about Football for an international audience published on the internet then just call it by its name not the regional one used locally. It seems lazy not to. Anyway it's just a pet peeve of mine (and plenty of others), it doesn't have to be logical.
    - eeeuo 8y ago
      Take your pick of a prominent Irish or South African news website and go to the Sport section, they will almost always list the sport as "Soccer". The vast majority of takes on the Internet about the word soccer are lazy anti-Americanism. I accept that it's just a pet peeve for you, but I was addressing the general discourse on the term. With regards to 538 using the term soccer, it is explicitly an American website. 538 is the number of electors in the US electoral college. The majority of readers are American, therefore it seems reasonable to use the term soccer. You could argue that they should just use the term football and have the reader infer from context which sport it is, but then we wouldn't be having this discussion if you thought that was an acceptable solution :P
Buldak 8y ago
My sense is that the other motive to insist on "football" is the perception of American chauvinism. If a different country had their own name for the sport, I don't think you'd see people complain that they were being parochial or ignorant by using it.

orf 8y ago

The 2014 world cup reached 3.2 billion people. I don't really care if you have a small regional sport with less than 5% of that viewership that just happens to have a name clash, it would be nice to call football by its proper name. Again, it's petty, but I'm English and it's a pet peeve of mine.

bane 8y ago
How would we distinguish between the two then? One is almost universally popular here and the other is pretty much ignored entirely. In what universe would what you propose make even the slightest bit of sense?
- Shorel 8y ago
  Your use of the word 'universally' is, IMO, part of the issue. Your country is not the world or the universe, even if everyday language indicates that. Language use seems to affect subconscious behavior, even if not intended. Anyway, my point is, you have been manipulated through your language.
  - bane 8y ago
    You are absolutely correct, from now on I will call soccer "Chuk-ku" because that's what it's called somewhere else.
marcoperaza 8y ago
Why should people in the US care what people elsewhere like to watch or what they call it?
pault 8y ago
But the word "soccer" is an English invention. It's not like Americans just made it up to annoy cranky Brits.
- pbhjpbhj 8y ago
  Cranky Brits _think_ that "soccer" is a USA-ism, and so they hate it by analogy with parts of British-English that are eroded by constant exposure to USA media/culture. Someone in /r/BritishProblems called a zebra crossing a "crosswalk" the other day and as an en-gb native I couldn't help but be scandalised! ;o)
eeeuo 8y ago
I find this to be a pretty obnoxious point of contention. Soccer is an English term invented in the 19th century. It spread to a number of Anglosphere countries in a similar manner to all sorts of words from 19th century England. It is currently used in Canada, the US, Ireland[1], South Africa, Australia, New Zealand etc. The idea that soccer is an "Americanism" simultaneously requires you to believe that (a) that only Americans use the term and (b) that Americans are ignorant of the rest of the world. The reality, of course, is that these countries are using a term that has existed for over a century and is a borrowed word from England. Each of these countries have a prominent sport containing the word football(various rugby codes, american football, gaelic sports), and therefore it was convenient to retain the term soccer. This, of course, does not jive very well with lazy anti-Americanism however, which generally seems to be the point of the exercise. [1] I know, I know.
- orf 8y ago
  I appreciate your analysis but reject that it's 'lazy anti-americanism'. I've never heard anyone from Ireland use that term, and I've known a lot of people from there and have visited a few times. Same for South Africa, but I have never travelled there. The core point is that while there are regional differences none of those countries have anywhere near the same level of media influence as America, so yes, it is an Americanism like it or not. And when writing an article literally about Football for an international audience published on the internet then just call it by its name not the regional one used locally. It seems lazy not to. Anyway it's just a pet peeve of mine (and plenty of others), it doesn't have to be logical.
  - eeeuo 8y ago
    Take your pick of a prominent Irish or South African news website and go to the Sport section, they will almost always list the sport as "Soccer". The vast majority of takes on the Internet about the word soccer are lazy anti-Americanism. I accept that it's just a pet peeve for you, but I was addressing the general discourse on the term. With regards to 538 using the term soccer, it is explicitly an American website. 538 is the number of electors in the US electoral college. The majority of readers are American, therefore it seems reasonable to use the term soccer. You could argue that they should just use the term football and have the reader infer from context which sport it is, but then we wouldn't be having this discussion if you thought that was an acceptable solution :P

Buldak 8y ago

My sense is that the other motive to insist on "football" is the perception of American chauvinism. If a different country had their own name for the sport, I don't think you'd see people complain that they were being parochial or ignorant by using it.