4 ms·

there are many true solutions, electron is not one of them though. >but don't pretend like they don't have tremendous benefits too. Javascript+html+css is not

there are many true solutions, electron is not one of them though. >but don't pretend like they don't have tremendous benefits too. Javascript+html+css is not a global optimum in the solution space of "making cross platform GUI apps", its just the best solution that exists right now (if you are afraid of C++), and that is too bad. We could have simpler, better performing ways if we bothered to do things that aren't web related more often.

chrisco255 8y ago
But time and money is a real constraint for projects. It's hard enough writing native Android, native iOS, and a web app to boot without also having to write native Mac, Linux, and Windows and dealing with all the cross platform UI quirks on Qt.
- royjacobs 8y ago
  The whole point of Qt is that you don't have cross-platform UI quirks.
  - chrisco255 8y ago
    You still have quirks. Qt helps for the bulk of the work, sure, but OSX, Windows, and Linux all have unique quirks that have to be dealt with.
    - pknopf 8y ago
      Any OS-quirks you experience with Qt are likely the nature of cross-development (path separators, toolbars, sys-trays), stuff that you'd likely experience with any framework. Qt's cross-platform support is amazing.
- EStudley 8y ago
  Wait, what? How are you going to write a native app with less quirks than Qt? VTK? That's a little disingenuous.
  - chrisco255 8y ago
    This is in reference to using Electron so you don't have to both write a web app and a native desktop app using Qt (in addition to native mobile, where performance issues are much more noticeable).
    - kbutler 8y ago
      ...and electron apps have no UI quirks and no performance issues on mobile.
- dekhn 8y ago
  Qt handles cross-platform better than any other framework.
MrP 8y ago
People being afraid of C++ is not as big a problem as people not being afraid of C++
jancsika 8y ago
> (if you are afraid of C++) Iterating front-end development with Javascript+html+css is simpler and quicker than doing the same with C++ because you don't have to recompile for each iteration. In some cases I don't even need to restart the app. Also, I have been able to debug in a few nasty cases by getting users to switch out a js/html file and restart the app. That's impossible to do with C++ given the same time/effort constraints. Those are just two fairly small but measurable examples. There are also drawbacks to having not chosen Qt for the front-end. But those data points and more were part of a rather complicated cost-benefit analysis of what was available to make a cross platform GUI app in a reasonable amount of time. I don't see what a search for a "true" toolkit has to do with such an analysis. I don't see what caricatures of one camp or another as unduly emotional has to do with such an analysis. What am I missing?
- sho_hn 8y ago
  You should do some Qt frontend development some time. A lot of is done in QML and doesn't need recompilation, and can be hot-reloaded at runtime. It's a false dichotomy, Qt offers these benefits to a great extend when used well.
- Too 8y ago
  Qt QML is javascript...

chrisco255 8y ago

But time and money is a real constraint for projects. It's hard enough writing native Android, native iOS, and a web app to boot without also having to write native Mac, Linux, and Windows and dealing with all the cross platform UI quirks on Qt.

royjacobs 8y ago
The whole point of Qt is that you don't have cross-platform UI quirks.
- chrisco255 8y ago
  You still have quirks. Qt helps for the bulk of the work, sure, but OSX, Windows, and Linux all have unique quirks that have to be dealt with.
  - pknopf 8y ago
    Any OS-quirks you experience with Qt are likely the nature of cross-development (path separators, toolbars, sys-trays), stuff that you'd likely experience with any framework. Qt's cross-platform support is amazing.
EStudley 8y ago
Wait, what? How are you going to write a native app with less quirks than Qt? VTK? That's a little disingenuous.
- chrisco255 8y ago
  This is in reference to using Electron so you don't have to both write a web app and a native desktop app using Qt (in addition to native mobile, where performance issues are much more noticeable).
  - kbutler 8y ago
    ...and electron apps have no UI quirks and no performance issues on mobile.
dekhn 8y ago
Qt handles cross-platform better than any other framework.

MrP 8y ago

People being afraid of C++ is not as big a problem as people not being afraid of C++

jancsika 8y ago

> (if you are afraid of C++) Iterating front-end development with Javascript+html+css is simpler and quicker than doing the same with C++ because you don't have to recompile for each iteration. In some cases I don't even need to restart the app. Also, I have been able to debug in a few nasty cases by getting users to switch out a js/html file and restart the app. That's impossible to do with C++ given the same time/effort constraints. Those are just two fairly small but measurable examples. There are also drawbacks to having not chosen Qt for the front-end. But those data points and more were part of a rather complicated cost-benefit analysis of what was available to make a cross platform GUI app in a reasonable amount of time. I don't see what a search for a "true" toolkit has to do with such an analysis. I don't see what caricatures of one camp or another as unduly emotional has to do with such an analysis. What am I missing?

sho_hn 8y ago
You should do some Qt frontend development some time. A lot of is done in QML and doesn't need recompilation, and can be hot-reloaded at runtime. It's a false dichotomy, Qt offers these benefits to a great extend when used well.
Too 8y ago
Qt QML is javascript...