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Here's a thought: regulation like this is, along with the heavy-handed ideology that lead to it, is the reason why the EU is still lagging regarding technical i

by ng12 8y ago

Here's a thought: regulation like this is, along with the heavy-handed ideology that lead to it, is the reason why the EU is still lagging regarding technical innovation. I think this attitude is the primary reason Silicon Valley took hold in the USA and that the EU has nothing comparable. If the EU wants to legislate itself out of the future they're more than welcome to do so -- and I applaud every site who makes the tough decision to stonewall EU users.

Barrin92 8y ago
I'm not onboard with the idea that Silicon Valley holds a monopoly on technical innovation. Getting people to click on ads on smartphones doesn't capture the entire scope of technology. Europe's economy is roughly as large as that of the United States. Many world-leading companies from the car industry, to chemicals, to biotech reside in Europe. The US holds one dominating advantage in one subset of technology. Consumer-facing internet tech. While a lot of people employed in this field commentate on this website, it's a marginal part of the tech industry, and it's not worth sacrificing privacy for, Europe does not need Silicon Valley to produce high-value products. And if adtech is supposed to be the definition of the future, rather than genomics, complex manufacturing and the life sciences than I'm okay with us skipping that part. There are business models that don't rely on sacrificing the attention and privacy of consumers.
- lajhsdfkl 8y ago
  >The US holds one dominating advantage in one subset of technology. Consumer-facing internet tech. While a lot of people employed in this field commentate on this website, it's a marginal part of the tech industry, and it's not worth sacrificing privacy for, Europe does not need Silicon Valley to produce high-value products. > it's a marginal part of the tech industry Hilarious
- ng12 8y ago
  That's exactly my point. The EU is built for entrenched institutions. There is no entrepreneurial spirit -- and that's why there's N-number of self driving car companies in the US and zero(?) in the EU, for example.
  - Barrin92 8y ago
    All (or most?) of the big European car manufacturers in Europe provide and actively research self-driving technology. Volkswagen's research budget is five times as large (iirc correctly) as Tesla's. You are succumbing to a lot of stereotypes here, which I might add is fuelled by a cargo cult tendency within Silicon Valley.
    - pilsetnieks 8y ago
      No, you see, if it's not a startup, it cannot be innovative.
      - wlll 8y ago
        You think you're being funny, but it took silicon valley to invent a machine to press juice of proprietary only bags of pre-chopped fruit, so I think you look rather foolish now!
    - ng12 8y ago
      But they're all providing that technology to American firms who are implementing the technology rather than developing it at home. See what I'm driving at?
      - lovich 8y ago
        So they do some research and then let some american companies that can't even imagine why you'd create safety regulations do the practical testing which kills American citizens instead of European ones when the inevitable mistakes happen. Then they get access to the technology through partnerships. This sounds like a win-win for the EU companies
        deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
        dahdum 8y ago
        Indeed, it’s a win for the American economy too, when the IP is owned by American companies and the majority of profits go there.
- zerostar07 8y ago
  > Getting people to click on ads on smartphones Clicking on ads is how they fund AI research. Not all tech is equally profitable but you need all kinds. Meanwhile EU is still debating whether it's worth getting into the AI game.
Spooky23 8y ago
Is it? Visit Germany sometime. Drive through the countryside. Most parts of the US look like a hollowed out shell by comparison.
- JoshMnem 8y ago
  > Drive through the countryside. Most parts of the US look like a hollowed out shell by comparison. In what way do you mean? Wind power?
  - _delirium 8y ago
    Basic housing is the thing that stands out most for me. I'm originally an American, and now live in a rural area in Europe. Rural parts of the more affluent Western European countries aren't advanced per se, but they're, I dunno, reasonably modern. Decent housing and decent internet access. The U.S. countryside is just incredibly backward in this weirdly visible way by comparison. Entire swaths of countryside, especially in the southern US, but not exclusively there, are full of a mix of trailer parks on the one hand, and questionably habitable shacks with missing wallboards and plastic-tarp roof patches on the other (parts of Louisiana are seriously shocking). And good luck getting broadband.
    - JoshMnem 8y ago
      I used to live in Europe and have also lived in many parts of the US. Just trying to understand, since I didn't notice much visible difference other than wind power. I'm from a rural area in the US, and it was a great place. I haven't spent much time in rural areas of the south though.
  - Spooky23 8y ago
    Small and especially medium business is vaporized. Textiles? Gone Light industrial? Gone Regional banks? Dying Local banks? Dead Small retail? Dead Dairy agriculture? Dying Family agriculture? Dead I grew up in a small town. 20 operating farms circa 1990. 2 today. 3 agricultural/equipment dealers, today 0. 5 small/medium manufacturers... 1 today, because of a military contract. School enrollment? -25%. I watched the beginning of decline when I was in high school. There is no anchor businesses that sustain local economies, and no access to capital. Without government spending, either indirect or direct transfer payments, a shockingly high number of US localities would be in a state of complete implosion.
realusername 8y ago
GDPR only has an effect starting from yesterday, I highly doubt it had a retroactive effect up to the early 2000's to wipe out EU startups, that point is moot.
tingol 8y ago
Here's a thought: You don't know what you're talking about and I applaud the EU for protecting me against people like you.

by ng12 8y ago

Barrin92 8y ago

I'm not onboard with the idea that Silicon Valley holds a monopoly on technical innovation. Getting people to click on ads on smartphones doesn't capture the entire scope of technology. Europe's economy is roughly as large as that of the United States. Many world-leading companies from the car industry, to chemicals, to biotech reside in Europe. The US holds one dominating advantage in one subset of technology. Consumer-facing internet tech. While a lot of people employed in this field commentate on this website, it's a marginal part of the tech industry, and it's not worth sacrificing privacy for, Europe does not need Silicon Valley to produce high-value products. And if adtech is supposed to be the definition of the future, rather than genomics, complex manufacturing and the life sciences than I'm okay with us skipping that part. There are business models that don't rely on sacrificing the attention and privacy of consumers.

lajhsdfkl 8y ago
>The US holds one dominating advantage in one subset of technology. Consumer-facing internet tech. While a lot of people employed in this field commentate on this website, it's a marginal part of the tech industry, and it's not worth sacrificing privacy for, Europe does not need Silicon Valley to produce high-value products. > it's a marginal part of the tech industry Hilarious
ng12 8y ago
That's exactly my point. The EU is built for entrenched institutions. There is no entrepreneurial spirit -- and that's why there's N-number of self driving car companies in the US and zero(?) in the EU, for example.
- Barrin92 8y ago
  All (or most?) of the big European car manufacturers in Europe provide and actively research self-driving technology. Volkswagen's research budget is five times as large (iirc correctly) as Tesla's. You are succumbing to a lot of stereotypes here, which I might add is fuelled by a cargo cult tendency within Silicon Valley.
  - pilsetnieks 8y ago
    No, you see, if it's not a startup, it cannot be innovative.
    - wlll 8y ago
      You think you're being funny, but it took silicon valley to invent a machine to press juice of proprietary only bags of pre-chopped fruit, so I think you look rather foolish now!
  - ng12 8y ago
    But they're all providing that technology to American firms who are implementing the technology rather than developing it at home. See what I'm driving at?
    - lovich 8y ago
      So they do some research and then let some american companies that can't even imagine why you'd create safety regulations do the practical testing which kills American citizens instead of European ones when the inevitable mistakes happen. Then they get access to the technology through partnerships. This sounds like a win-win for the EU companies
      - deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
      - dahdum 8y ago
        Indeed, it’s a win for the American economy too, when the IP is owned by American companies and the majority of profits go there.
zerostar07 8y ago
> Getting people to click on ads on smartphones Clicking on ads is how they fund AI research. Not all tech is equally profitable but you need all kinds. Meanwhile EU is still debating whether it's worth getting into the AI game.

Spooky23 8y ago

Is it? Visit Germany sometime. Drive through the countryside. Most parts of the US look like a hollowed out shell by comparison.

JoshMnem 8y ago
> Drive through the countryside. Most parts of the US look like a hollowed out shell by comparison. In what way do you mean? Wind power?
- _delirium 8y ago
  Basic housing is the thing that stands out most for me. I'm originally an American, and now live in a rural area in Europe. Rural parts of the more affluent Western European countries aren't advanced per se, but they're, I dunno, reasonably modern. Decent housing and decent internet access. The U.S. countryside is just incredibly backward in this weirdly visible way by comparison. Entire swaths of countryside, especially in the southern US, but not exclusively there, are full of a mix of trailer parks on the one hand, and questionably habitable shacks with missing wallboards and plastic-tarp roof patches on the other (parts of Louisiana are seriously shocking). And good luck getting broadband.
  - JoshMnem 8y ago
    I used to live in Europe and have also lived in many parts of the US. Just trying to understand, since I didn't notice much visible difference other than wind power. I'm from a rural area in the US, and it was a great place. I haven't spent much time in rural areas of the south though.
- Spooky23 8y ago
  Small and especially medium business is vaporized. Textiles? Gone Light industrial? Gone Regional banks? Dying Local banks? Dead Small retail? Dead Dairy agriculture? Dying Family agriculture? Dead I grew up in a small town. 20 operating farms circa 1990. 2 today. 3 agricultural/equipment dealers, today 0. 5 small/medium manufacturers... 1 today, because of a military contract. School enrollment? -25%. I watched the beginning of decline when I was in high school. There is no anchor businesses that sustain local economies, and no access to capital. Without government spending, either indirect or direct transfer payments, a shockingly high number of US localities would be in a state of complete implosion.

realusername 8y ago

GDPR only has an effect starting from yesterday, I highly doubt it had a retroactive effect up to the early 2000's to wipe out EU startups, that point is moot.

tingol 8y ago

Here's a thought: You don't know what you're talking about and I applaud the EU for protecting me against people like you.