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Anecdote time... Tokyo train stations kinda suck. Coming from a few weeks in Malaysia and Singapore, it was interesting to see just how little and how poorly t

Anecdote time... Tokyo train stations kinda suck. Coming from a few weeks in Malaysia and Singapore, it was interesting to see just how little and how poorly translated English is there. (They speak Japanese and not English, but lets be honest about it being the lingua franca) It was VERY DIFFICULT to figure out how their train colors worked, how Orange gets to Blue (it's a connect, but a couple blocks away). That Ginza station (iirc, might be wrong) has at least two names. Also, that none of the machines take cards! We were 11 yen short - about $0.10 for a ticket to the airport, and while the very nice workers were happy to explain where a few blocks away the ATM was, it would have been great if someone just threw a coin at us to get us to go away, different culture, I suppose had I asked someone would have given it to us, but I feel like in the USA it would have just been offered. Japan was a lot like NYC, the subway there is also more confusing than places like DC or Taipei.

bamboozled 8y ago
I found it very easy and each time I’ve asked for assistance I’ve received it. The stations are always manned with several staff so help is always available. On the Tokyo subway all trains and maps, signage and in cabin screens provide English labelling. What more do you need ? Edit: I have to add, the fact the trains a almost perfectly ontime, with little wait between services, always designed to meet capacity, are In great condition and spotless, I really don’t see how it “sucks”. In fact what more do you want out of a Subway?
- dahdum 8y ago
  There's a small learning curve but they do a great job on signage and maps. I kinda feel bad asking for assistance in Japan. Most of the times I needed help they went way beyond my expectations to assist.
ng12 8y ago
> They speak Japanese and not English, but lets be honest about it being the lingua franca If you go to Seoul they don't even have Romanized names for the train stations. Everything's in Hangul. For a massive system built primarily for Japanese speakers it's really pretty accessible. > Japan was a lot like NYC, the subway there is also more confusing than places like DC or Taipei. I mean, DC and Taipei are much smaller systems than NYC and (especially) Tokyo. There's also geographical concerns -- Tokyo is just huge and NYC is very oddly shaped. DC, Taipei, Boston, Chicago, etc are very radial which makes them easy to figure out.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- azernik 8y ago
  In addition, in a country as big and insular (literally and figuratively) as Japan, catering to foreigners is less of a concern.
  - thousandautumns 8y ago
    Except they absolutely cater to foreigners. Even living in the countryside of Hokkaido, all of the train stations had everything in Japanese and English.
- SECProto 8y ago
  > If you go to Seoul they don't even have Romanized names for the train stations. Everything's in Hangul. For a massive system built primarily for Japanese speakers it's really pretty accessible. I'm not sure when you were last in Seoul, but this was not the case when I was there recently. Perhaps they worked on it for the Olympics? Most signs (and I think every navigational sign) I saw in the metro stations was quadrilingual - Hangul, English, Chinese, and Japanese. The station names themselves were written in Hangul and English (not sure about Japanese/Chinese characters). I tried to find any news articles or background about this but I couldn't. I have much more difficulty navigating the metro in Tokyo than I did in Seoul, and I can read a good bit of Japanese and no Korean.
  - ajdlinux 8y ago
    Certainly was not the case when I was in Seoul in 2014 - even PA announcements on the train were in English.
kalleboo 8y ago
I'm visiting London right now, and compared to here, Tokyo train stations are amazing for signage. There are always super clear, easy to spot signage for where transfers & exits are, what exits they are and what landmarks they lead to, where elevators or escalators are, etc. Electric signs starting at the entrances (before the gates even) for what trains are arriving at what platforms and when. In London navigational signs are either completely missing or white signs on white tile backdrops so they blend in and are hard to spot (aside from the generic "Way Out" exit signs that don't specify out to where, will I have an escalator/elevator, etc). Electric signs are sparse (maybe one after the gates and one or two only at the ends of the platform) Tokyo is complicated by the fact that it's actually 10+ different systems run by different, mostly private, companies (JR trains like Yamanote, Tokyo Metro trains, keio, toei, keikyu, keisei, yurikamome, etc etc) so I'm always impressed by how integrated they manage to make it seem. It sucks that Japan is mostly a cash society, but Apple Pay Suica on iPhone 8 and up helps a lot :) Singapore does have an amazing subway though, completely world-class.
- jessaustin 8y ago
  It sucks that Japan is mostly a cash society... There are a range of opinions on this topic. I vastly prefer cash no matter what nation I'm in, and am extremely annoyed when it's not a possibility. Japan and its cash just works. Most situations in other nations that do not admit cash pretend that they function acceptably, but we don't have to look hard to see cracks in the facade.
  - SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
    No thanks. I did not find it convienient having US, Malaysian, Singapore, and Japanese coins in my pocket. I like having a single card that has an always current exchange rate with no fees, and in fact pays back 1.5%.
- bigger_cheese 8y ago
  I agree I thought subway in Singapore was amazing last time I visited. What I really liked was the way the carriage always stopped at the same fixed point on platform and they had designated areas for people to stand when embarking. It made the whole process of getting on and off the train much more organised. Here in Australia trains are no where near that disciplined about where on platform they stop. Carriage doors can be anywhere so basically as soon as train pulls into station everyone on platform surges towards nearest door. I was in London in January I found the underground there very confusing. I was doing the typical tourist sight seeing thing and was trying to get from Tower of London to the British Museum I knew the stations were on different lines I knew I had to get to the Piccadilly line but there was a lack of detail as to where to change trains. There were voice announcements on trains themselves "Change here for xxx line" but signage was pretty poor.
rpearl 8y ago
I really had no trouble navigating Tokyo stations and I don't speak a word of Japanese besides すみません (excuse me/sorry to bother), so I'm quite surprised to see this comment! Google maps and other transit apps are really good in Tokyo, paying with suica/pasmo makes things quite smooth--just keep it topped up habitually when you go to a convenience store--and I didn't really have the trouble you seem to have had with color/line navigation... I was definitely a bit flustered by the busy-ness but never really had a problem getting on the correct platform.
- GordonS 8y ago
  Not only do I not speak any Japanese, but I'm colour blind, and don't have any kind of subway or metro at home - and I had no issue navigating around Tokyo or Kyoto stations. And in Tokyo, on multiple occasions there was even an excessively helpful English-speaking Japanese stewardess that insisted on helping us from A to B.
  - Fins 8y ago
    Same here (well, I can manage a few basic phrases in Japanese, but that's about it). Navigating Japan's rail system was very easy. Well, unless you enter turnstiles at the station and then try to exit right from the same station, that seems to confuse SUICA a lot and you have to go through the manual lane...
    - ajdlinux 8y ago
      Last time I was in Japan (a couple of months ago) I learned that at some stations they actually sell a station-access-only ticket (~JPY200 for a few hours IIRC) for people who want to go in to meet someone or to use the shops.
      - Fins 8y ago
        Ah, nice. Might be something new, unless I missed in 2 years ago when I was there last time.
jlg23 8y ago
I have never been to Japan myself but those of my friends who were all had nothing but praise for the train system. WRT the lack of English: In most parts of of South America you won't find anyone who speaks English. Same for North Africa. One can be annoyed or just see the humourous aspects and put the car into the "car parking park" (seen in Morocco) before having a "vegetarian in bread" (seen in Berlin). ;)
- contingencies 8y ago
  A friend and I found ourselves stranded in rural Japan when the train system shut down for days due to high winds. Seems to me lots of foreigners tend to visit big cities and tourist centers only then walk away wowed, frankly the infrastructure is more heterogeneous than this set realise.
nlawalker 8y ago
Just another anecdote alongside the others. Maybe I got lucky but I found the amount of written and spoken English in Japan, especially in the metropolitan areas, to be perfectly adequate. As for actually getting around, it's just a matter of having the right tools. I'm mostly sharing this for the benefit of anyone thinking of going to Japan. - The landscape of transit cards is confusing, and while many of them are still accepted in various places, the existence of such a wide variety is mostly a legacy thing as far as I could tell. I had a Suica card and it worked virtually everywhere I went in Japan, though I didn't venture off the beaten path. - The Japan Rail Pass, while not having any functional use, did make things cheaper. - A rented wifi hotspot is an absolute no-brainer. If you travel to Japan, just get one. You can pick it up at the post office in the airport and drop it back at the same place in a prepaid envelope when you depart. - The Hyperdia smartphone app is fantasic. You can pretty much get yourself between any two points in Japan with it, and once you've used it a couple times and understand some of the icons it's easy to tell when you need a separate pass or need to walk between platforms or nearby stations.
- paulific 8y ago
  The variety in transit cards is mostly due to the variety of operators who use different systems. Japan Rail has Suica, Tokyo Subway lines use Passmo. Some regional operators have their own ones. As you say you can mostly use them interchangeably, probably because it is less trouble for everybody that way.
- twblalock 8y ago
  > - The landscape of transit cards is confusing, and while many of them are still accepted in various places, the existence of such a wide variety is mostly a legacy thing as far as I could tell. I had a Suica card and it worked virtually everywhere I went in Japan, though I didn't venture off the beaten path. I think this is correct. I first went to Japan in 2008, and the cards you had actually mattered. I went again last year, and I used a Suica all over the country without problems -- it was a Suica I bought in 2008, and it still worked and had money on it after sitting in a drawer for 9 years. It seems like all of these cards equivalent now, at least for tourists -- for people who live there, I think there are some differences in the kinds of monthly passes you can get for each card.
mikekchar 8y ago
I have some sympathy with this comment (although like other commenters I don't quite agree). I think some of this disconnect is cultural (or what you're used to). The most important thing to understand about Japanese trains is that there a many train companies. If you don't realise that, then you can easily get confused about the need to go to a completely different building across the road to get a transfer. Many stylised maps don't make it clear and I've been confused before. I'm guessing that the blue in your example is the Keisei line. As for cards, Japan is still very much a cash based culture. Although you can use credit cards in most places now, if you had come 10 or 15 years ago you might have been astounded that you practically could not survive without carrying cash. Even now, if you go out to where I live (in the countryside), I don't think there is a single store that accepts credit cards. It used to be that the ATMs were only open during banking hours (what's the point in an ATM if it's only open when there is a teller available? ;-) ). I got into the habit of that time of carrying about $1000 all the time. Hell, the gas man would pass me on the street randomly, hand me my bill and expect that I would pay him on the spot. Different culture :-) Anyway, I hope your trip was enjoyable otherwise. One more quick tip: If you come again and end up in a station without romaji train maps, you can corner one of the station attendants and they will find a way to help you somehow (also probably won't speak English, but I've seen them being very inventive).
- timr 8y ago
  "Hell, the gas man would pass me on the street randomly, hand me my bill and expect that I would pay him on the spot. Different culture :-)" That's weird. I mean, Japan is still cash-centric, but at least you can take your pile of cash to the combini to pay the utility bill. :-D Was it one of those kerosene guys in the little muscial trucks?
  - mikekchar 8y ago
    No. Normal gas company. But my gas company at the time was a super small one (just the local area), so I think they didn't have a sophisticated billing system. I'm with the regional gas company now and it's normal billing system.
angelsl 8y ago
You can't really compare to Singapore. English is our primary language.
- SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
  It had nothing to do with the language, the subway system was laid out logically in SG. Not like NYC or Tokyo. I appreciated the English language though, made the trip very easy. I don’t like the surveillance aspects (WAY too many cameras) but it’s a really beautiful place.
mercurysmessage 8y ago
The signage is quite good, and if you know the names of one or two lines it is quite simple. Also, get a sim, and just type your destinations into google, maps will do it for you.

bamboozled 8y ago

I found it very easy and each time I’ve asked for assistance I’ve received it. The stations are always manned with several staff so help is always available. On the Tokyo subway all trains and maps, signage and in cabin screens provide English labelling. What more do you need ? Edit: I have to add, the fact the trains a almost perfectly ontime, with little wait between services, always designed to meet capacity, are In great condition and spotless, I really don’t see how it “sucks”. In fact what more do you want out of a Subway?

dahdum 8y ago
There's a small learning curve but they do a great job on signage and maps. I kinda feel bad asking for assistance in Japan. Most of the times I needed help they went way beyond my expectations to assist.

ng12 8y ago

> They speak Japanese and not English, but lets be honest about it being the lingua franca If you go to Seoul they don't even have Romanized names for the train stations. Everything's in Hangul. For a massive system built primarily for Japanese speakers it's really pretty accessible. > Japan was a lot like NYC, the subway there is also more confusing than places like DC or Taipei. I mean, DC and Taipei are much smaller systems than NYC and (especially) Tokyo. There's also geographical concerns -- Tokyo is just huge and NYC is very oddly shaped. DC, Taipei, Boston, Chicago, etc are very radial which makes them easy to figure out.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
azernik 8y ago
In addition, in a country as big and insular (literally and figuratively) as Japan, catering to foreigners is less of a concern.
- thousandautumns 8y ago
  Except they absolutely cater to foreigners. Even living in the countryside of Hokkaido, all of the train stations had everything in Japanese and English.
SECProto 8y ago
> If you go to Seoul they don't even have Romanized names for the train stations. Everything's in Hangul. For a massive system built primarily for Japanese speakers it's really pretty accessible. I'm not sure when you were last in Seoul, but this was not the case when I was there recently. Perhaps they worked on it for the Olympics? Most signs (and I think every navigational sign) I saw in the metro stations was quadrilingual - Hangul, English, Chinese, and Japanese. The station names themselves were written in Hangul and English (not sure about Japanese/Chinese characters). I tried to find any news articles or background about this but I couldn't. I have much more difficulty navigating the metro in Tokyo than I did in Seoul, and I can read a good bit of Japanese and no Korean.
- ajdlinux 8y ago
  Certainly was not the case when I was in Seoul in 2014 - even PA announcements on the train were in English.

kalleboo 8y ago

I'm visiting London right now, and compared to here, Tokyo train stations are amazing for signage. There are always super clear, easy to spot signage for where transfers & exits are, what exits they are and what landmarks they lead to, where elevators or escalators are, etc. Electric signs starting at the entrances (before the gates even) for what trains are arriving at what platforms and when. In London navigational signs are either completely missing or white signs on white tile backdrops so they blend in and are hard to spot (aside from the generic "Way Out" exit signs that don't specify out to where, will I have an escalator/elevator, etc). Electric signs are sparse (maybe one after the gates and one or two only at the ends of the platform) Tokyo is complicated by the fact that it's actually 10+ different systems run by different, mostly private, companies (JR trains like Yamanote, Tokyo Metro trains, keio, toei, keikyu, keisei, yurikamome, etc etc) so I'm always impressed by how integrated they manage to make it seem. It sucks that Japan is mostly a cash society, but Apple Pay Suica on iPhone 8 and up helps a lot :) Singapore does have an amazing subway though, completely world-class.

jessaustin 8y ago
It sucks that Japan is mostly a cash society... There are a range of opinions on this topic. I vastly prefer cash no matter what nation I'm in, and am extremely annoyed when it's not a possibility. Japan and its cash just works. Most situations in other nations that do not admit cash pretend that they function acceptably, but we don't have to look hard to see cracks in the facade.
- SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
  No thanks. I did not find it convienient having US, Malaysian, Singapore, and Japanese coins in my pocket. I like having a single card that has an always current exchange rate with no fees, and in fact pays back 1.5%.
bigger_cheese 8y ago
I agree I thought subway in Singapore was amazing last time I visited. What I really liked was the way the carriage always stopped at the same fixed point on platform and they had designated areas for people to stand when embarking. It made the whole process of getting on and off the train much more organised. Here in Australia trains are no where near that disciplined about where on platform they stop. Carriage doors can be anywhere so basically as soon as train pulls into station everyone on platform surges towards nearest door. I was in London in January I found the underground there very confusing. I was doing the typical tourist sight seeing thing and was trying to get from Tower of London to the British Museum I knew the stations were on different lines I knew I had to get to the Piccadilly line but there was a lack of detail as to where to change trains. There were voice announcements on trains themselves "Change here for xxx line" but signage was pretty poor.

rpearl 8y ago

I really had no trouble navigating Tokyo stations and I don't speak a word of Japanese besides すみません (excuse me/sorry to bother), so I'm quite surprised to see this comment! Google maps and other transit apps are really good in Tokyo, paying with suica/pasmo makes things quite smooth--just keep it topped up habitually when you go to a convenience store--and I didn't really have the trouble you seem to have had with color/line navigation... I was definitely a bit flustered by the busy-ness but never really had a problem getting on the correct platform.

GordonS 8y ago
Not only do I not speak any Japanese, but I'm colour blind, and don't have any kind of subway or metro at home - and I had no issue navigating around Tokyo or Kyoto stations. And in Tokyo, on multiple occasions there was even an excessively helpful English-speaking Japanese stewardess that insisted on helping us from A to B.
- Fins 8y ago
  Same here (well, I can manage a few basic phrases in Japanese, but that's about it). Navigating Japan's rail system was very easy. Well, unless you enter turnstiles at the station and then try to exit right from the same station, that seems to confuse SUICA a lot and you have to go through the manual lane...
  - ajdlinux 8y ago
    Last time I was in Japan (a couple of months ago) I learned that at some stations they actually sell a station-access-only ticket (~JPY200 for a few hours IIRC) for people who want to go in to meet someone or to use the shops.
    - Fins 8y ago
      Ah, nice. Might be something new, unless I missed in 2 years ago when I was there last time.

jlg23 8y ago

I have never been to Japan myself but those of my friends who were all had nothing but praise for the train system. WRT the lack of English: In most parts of of South America you won't find anyone who speaks English. Same for North Africa. One can be annoyed or just see the humourous aspects and put the car into the "car parking park" (seen in Morocco) before having a "vegetarian in bread" (seen in Berlin). ;)

contingencies 8y ago
A friend and I found ourselves stranded in rural Japan when the train system shut down for days due to high winds. Seems to me lots of foreigners tend to visit big cities and tourist centers only then walk away wowed, frankly the infrastructure is more heterogeneous than this set realise.

nlawalker 8y ago

Just another anecdote alongside the others. Maybe I got lucky but I found the amount of written and spoken English in Japan, especially in the metropolitan areas, to be perfectly adequate. As for actually getting around, it's just a matter of having the right tools. I'm mostly sharing this for the benefit of anyone thinking of going to Japan. - The landscape of transit cards is confusing, and while many of them are still accepted in various places, the existence of such a wide variety is mostly a legacy thing as far as I could tell. I had a Suica card and it worked virtually everywhere I went in Japan, though I didn't venture off the beaten path. - The Japan Rail Pass, while not having any functional use, did make things cheaper. - A rented wifi hotspot is an absolute no-brainer. If you travel to Japan, just get one. You can pick it up at the post office in the airport and drop it back at the same place in a prepaid envelope when you depart. - The Hyperdia smartphone app is fantasic. You can pretty much get yourself between any two points in Japan with it, and once you've used it a couple times and understand some of the icons it's easy to tell when you need a separate pass or need to walk between platforms or nearby stations.

paulific 8y ago
The variety in transit cards is mostly due to the variety of operators who use different systems. Japan Rail has Suica, Tokyo Subway lines use Passmo. Some regional operators have their own ones. As you say you can mostly use them interchangeably, probably because it is less trouble for everybody that way.
twblalock 8y ago
> - The landscape of transit cards is confusing, and while many of them are still accepted in various places, the existence of such a wide variety is mostly a legacy thing as far as I could tell. I had a Suica card and it worked virtually everywhere I went in Japan, though I didn't venture off the beaten path. I think this is correct. I first went to Japan in 2008, and the cards you had actually mattered. I went again last year, and I used a Suica all over the country without problems -- it was a Suica I bought in 2008, and it still worked and had money on it after sitting in a drawer for 9 years. It seems like all of these cards equivalent now, at least for tourists -- for people who live there, I think there are some differences in the kinds of monthly passes you can get for each card.

mikekchar 8y ago

I have some sympathy with this comment (although like other commenters I don't quite agree). I think some of this disconnect is cultural (or what you're used to). The most important thing to understand about Japanese trains is that there a many train companies. If you don't realise that, then you can easily get confused about the need to go to a completely different building across the road to get a transfer. Many stylised maps don't make it clear and I've been confused before. I'm guessing that the blue in your example is the Keisei line. As for cards, Japan is still very much a cash based culture. Although you can use credit cards in most places now, if you had come 10 or 15 years ago you might have been astounded that you practically could not survive without carrying cash. Even now, if you go out to where I live (in the countryside), I don't think there is a single store that accepts credit cards. It used to be that the ATMs were only open during banking hours (what's the point in an ATM if it's only open when there is a teller available? ;-) ). I got into the habit of that time of carrying about $1000 all the time. Hell, the gas man would pass me on the street randomly, hand me my bill and expect that I would pay him on the spot. Different culture :-) Anyway, I hope your trip was enjoyable otherwise. One more quick tip: If you come again and end up in a station without romaji train maps, you can corner one of the station attendants and they will find a way to help you somehow (also probably won't speak English, but I've seen them being very inventive).

timr 8y ago
"Hell, the gas man would pass me on the street randomly, hand me my bill and expect that I would pay him on the spot. Different culture :-)" That's weird. I mean, Japan is still cash-centric, but at least you can take your pile of cash to the combini to pay the utility bill. :-D Was it one of those kerosene guys in the little muscial trucks?
- mikekchar 8y ago
  No. Normal gas company. But my gas company at the time was a super small one (just the local area), so I think they didn't have a sophisticated billing system. I'm with the regional gas company now and it's normal billing system.

angelsl 8y ago

You can't really compare to Singapore. English is our primary language.

SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
It had nothing to do with the language, the subway system was laid out logically in SG. Not like NYC or Tokyo. I appreciated the English language though, made the trip very easy. I don’t like the surveillance aspects (WAY too many cameras) but it’s a really beautiful place.

mercurysmessage 8y ago

The signage is quite good, and if you know the names of one or two lines it is quite simple. Also, get a sim, and just type your destinations into google, maps will do it for you.