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I don't understand the assertion that the US Gov't can't do anything to prevent the foreign governments from doing this... The FCC has broad powers to regulate

I don't understand the assertion that the US Gov't can't do anything to prevent the foreign governments from doing this... The FCC has broad powers to regulate the public airwaves. This technology clearly disturbes authorized and licensed utilizaton of the airwaves OUTSIDE of the bounds of the Embassies. FCC should have the power to prevent this.

adventured 8y ago
> I don't understand the assertion that the US Gov't can't do anything to prevent the foreign governments from doing this... There has been zero evidence presented so far that it is in fact foreign governments doing any of this. More likely it's the vast cabal of Federal agencies in the greater DC area all disregarding the law because nobody in the US Congress has the will to rein them in. And of course for all we know, the espionage may be entirely legal courtesy of some clandestine national security FISA sign-off. The US Government system is made up of dozens of extremely powerful agencies, and they are at war with each other at all times for power, information and budget. Sometimes that war is cold, sometimes it's warm. Simply put, they're all spying on each other and all aspects of the system that is meant to control them (while they attempt to control the system instead).
- spaceandthyme 8y ago
  Source?
- indiv0 8y ago
  I wouldn't go so far as to say that there's no federal agencies in the DC Stingray soup, but how can you say it's more likely to be federal agencies in DC of all places? If there was a single city in the US that foreign agencies would target, it would undoubtedly be DC. The abundance of embassies in the city make it a very easy target.
ballenf 8y ago
The situation discussed in the article was with regard to Stingray-type devices placed at foreign embassies which are considered foreign soil. The FCC doesn't regulate embassies any more than it regulates Beijing or Moscow. The Stingrays found on K Street (far from Embassy Row) and some bridges were more likely US government operations. So the question comes back to are there non-embassy, non-US government Stingrays deployed and how to find them.
- trendia 8y ago
  Honest question: If an embassy started blaring very loud music (or a siren), can the US do anything about it? Likewise, if they started emitting strong microwaves at people, can the US do anything about it? It seems like there must be some limitation to what you can do from the embassy to people outside of it.
  - adventured 8y ago
    The loud music would draw a political rebuke / protest response, and then after if it didn't cease, it would plausibly draw some kind of tit for tat response in the other nation. The US can expel diplomats and isolate an embassy (eg cut power, water, etc), essentially making it non-maintainable (inhospitable) as a position. It could also surround it literally, effectively sealing it off to access, preventing the ability to leave (with predictable consequences). The strong microwaves would be treated as an act of war: an attack on Americans, on American soil, by a foreign power. If it didn't immediately stop, the US would invade that foreign soil and do whatever it decided was required.
    - kahnpro 8y ago
      Given that embassies are not actually foreign soil, if the offense was bad enough, US authorities will simply storm the place and make it stop. But that's a drastic action that won't happen before many other options have been tried.
- pests 8y ago
  Politics and retaliation aside, embassies and diplomatic immunity is nothing more than a courtesy offered by the host country.
- stareatgoats 8y ago
  The claim in the article seems dubious. Why would an embassy operate a stingray? More likely it's US government agencies spying on the embassies.
  - deleted 8y ago

adventured 8y ago

> I don't understand the assertion that the US Gov't can't do anything to prevent the foreign governments from doing this... There has been zero evidence presented so far that it is in fact foreign governments doing any of this. More likely it's the vast cabal of Federal agencies in the greater DC area all disregarding the law because nobody in the US Congress has the will to rein them in. And of course for all we know, the espionage may be entirely legal courtesy of some clandestine national security FISA sign-off. The US Government system is made up of dozens of extremely powerful agencies, and they are at war with each other at all times for power, information and budget. Sometimes that war is cold, sometimes it's warm. Simply put, they're all spying on each other and all aspects of the system that is meant to control them (while they attempt to control the system instead).

spaceandthyme 8y ago
Source?
indiv0 8y ago
I wouldn't go so far as to say that there's no federal agencies in the DC Stingray soup, but how can you say it's more likely to be federal agencies in DC of all places? If there was a single city in the US that foreign agencies would target, it would undoubtedly be DC. The abundance of embassies in the city make it a very easy target.

ballenf 8y ago

The situation discussed in the article was with regard to Stingray-type devices placed at foreign embassies which are considered foreign soil. The FCC doesn't regulate embassies any more than it regulates Beijing or Moscow. The Stingrays found on K Street (far from Embassy Row) and some bridges were more likely US government operations. So the question comes back to are there non-embassy, non-US government Stingrays deployed and how to find them.

trendia 8y ago
Honest question: If an embassy started blaring very loud music (or a siren), can the US do anything about it? Likewise, if they started emitting strong microwaves at people, can the US do anything about it? It seems like there must be some limitation to what you can do from the embassy to people outside of it.
- adventured 8y ago
  The loud music would draw a political rebuke / protest response, and then after if it didn't cease, it would plausibly draw some kind of tit for tat response in the other nation. The US can expel diplomats and isolate an embassy (eg cut power, water, etc), essentially making it non-maintainable (inhospitable) as a position. It could also surround it literally, effectively sealing it off to access, preventing the ability to leave (with predictable consequences). The strong microwaves would be treated as an act of war: an attack on Americans, on American soil, by a foreign power. If it didn't immediately stop, the US would invade that foreign soil and do whatever it decided was required.
  - kahnpro 8y ago
    Given that embassies are not actually foreign soil, if the offense was bad enough, US authorities will simply storm the place and make it stop. But that's a drastic action that won't happen before many other options have been tried.
pests 8y ago
Politics and retaliation aside, embassies and diplomatic immunity is nothing more than a courtesy offered by the host country.
stareatgoats 8y ago
The claim in the article seems dubious. Why would an embassy operate a stingray? More likely it's US government agencies spying on the embassies.
- deleted 8y ago