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I don't think the US is involved in mass imprisonment [0] and organ harvesting [1] of innocent people. We're talking about hundreds of thousands being locked up

I don't think the US is involved in mass imprisonment [0] and organ harvesting [1] of innocent people. We're talking about hundreds of thousands being locked up for holding beliefs the CCP doesn't like. And it's happening today. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Falun_Gong https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Falun_Gong [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_Gong_practitioners_in_China https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_Go...

fulafel 8y ago
US is pretty bad re imprisonment: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarce...
- pietroglyph 8y ago
  The difference is that, generally, the US doesn't imprison people because of what they say.
  - pizza 8y ago
    The US will however airstrike your wedding reception, or your hospital, or your school, etc. based on bad information.
    - themihai 8y ago
      Not, unless you life in a war zone..?
      - megous 8y ago
        Yes, airstrikes typically happen in what US calls war zones. Typically weak countries without allies that are willing to do anything in response. Anyway, what were you tryin to say?
        themihai 8y ago
        I don't think that U.S. is lead by some evil forces that target civilians. . I'm trying to say that you should expect the worse in wars regardless who's fighting or how weak/strong they are(see WW1/WW2). That's why people should avoid wars. Syria could have avoided the war but it preferred to keep the dictator in place. Too bad that it ended-up with the worst deal: a revolution, a war and the same dictator at the helm..plus a huge debt to Vlad.
  - 8note 8y ago
    yes, the US imprisons people based on how they look, not what they say.
    - GhostVII 8y ago
      Source?
      - Larrikin 8y ago
        Have you purposefully ignored the decades of news coverage about racial bias in policing and sentencing?
    - themihai 8y ago
      Compare that with China where you don't even have the right to talk about government abuse.
- adventured 8y ago
  China and the US are going opposite directions. The US incarceration rate is rapidly declining and has been falling for ten years. The US is pursuing drug legalization and decriminalization and is widely seeking to soften its approach overall. China is doing no such thing and has no interest in such, they regard drugs across the board to be completely opposed to their system's values. The US is pursuing the end of its failed mass-incarceration policies, with wide-spread bi-partisan support. China is aggressively clamping down on its people in just about every possible manner. It's so aggressive at this point, it's difficult to keep up with all the stories pouring out of China about a new repression/restriction. The US maintains extremely high degrees of freedom of speech, demonstration, expression, religion, movement. Yes, it's obviously not perfect on any given thing, that hardly needs said (and it's better at some things than others, for example it remains world-class on freedom of speech protections). China has almost none of that and is persistently revoking the gains that had been made. One need merely compare the vast, endless protest of Trump's Presidency and many of its policies, the terrible things that have been said about him and his family, the violent threats that are routinely made toward him across social media, the nude statue, the giant protest ducky, and on and on and on. Or, eg most media being stacked against him (~90% of all stories being negative; or just see: Colbert and Kimmel and the things they've said, which would get you immediately put into prison in China or worse). Now contrast that with how China treats Xi, from protests (lack thereof) to media. Or to simplify, see: Winnie the Pooh. You can't even say bad things about Mao in China, that's enough to get you put into prison. Feel free to call George Washington a devil slave owning piece of trash, all day long, all over the Internet, if you like. The US legalized gay marriage and has made vast strides over the decades in regards to equality for gay persons. China actively tortures gay people in trying to convert them and censors gay culture. The US has millions of Muslims that have assimilated fairly well into its culture and laws. Conflicts between US non-Muslims and US Muslims are rare, despite the US being overwhelmingly a Christian/Catholic nation. No purges are occuring, no culture eradication is occuring, no mass detentions are occuring; mass killings of Muslims did not occur after 9/11. China is torturing Muslims and seeking to wipe out Muslim culture in the Xinjiang region. What China is doing in Xinjiang is Guantanamo x1000, literally. Except Guantanamo was overwhelmingly directed at terrorists and battlefield combatants (and yes it failed at that premise on many occasions). What China is doing is targeting all Muslims because they're Muslims. And they may just be getting warmed up, if the history of dictatorships is any indication. Trump ran on a platform of decreasing the US military's expanse and the involvement in war in the Middle East. He routinely points out the stupidity of what the US has done in the Middle East in the past, no other President has dared to say such things. He just had to be talked into staying involved in Syria by the Europeans. The American people increasingly poll that they'd like to see a draw-down of the US military on the global stage, less entanglement rather than more; Americans are beyond war weary. China is going the opposite direction. They're violently annexing vast territory from other nations, persistently threatening Taiwan (with violent annexation seeming like an inevitability), and seeking global expansion for their military. Factually we don't have an accurate count at all on just how vast the torture camps are in China ('re-education camps'), how many people they're putting into prison, and how many people they're executing.
sametmax 8y ago
US has one of the biggest jail population in the world, which also exhibits a big social bias toward black males. Then it has the biggest military budget in the world, despite the fact no country has attacked it for centuries. But it did invade Irak, while lying about the WMD and against the vote of almost the entire world. Before that it used drugs to finance big entities, funded dictatorships and dropped the second bomb on Japan during WWII, ignoring that the first one did the job. It also consider it's own population as a threat, recording everything it communicates. Just because it doesn't do the same mistakes as another countries doesn't mean it's doing things right. You would be living in China, you would rationalize what the state does, just like you do because you are in the US. I could do the same speech about France, my own country. Education first goal is to avoid repeating mistakes, but it works only if you can recognize how much mess we have done, or are currently doing.
- burger_moon 8y ago
  > despite the fact no country has attacked it for centuries. It's odd how you say this but then also write about WWII and japan later on. Also I think you're making an arguement based on fallicies, the person you are responding to is referencing things happening currently. You are referencing things that happened in previous generations, aside from the first point which is valid though certainly a bit odd to compare to organ harvesting. Perhaps a better comparison would be to China's treatment of Tibetans and the US prison population. I'm not sure. I don't really care either way, just pointing out how stupid and pointless both of your arguments are.
  - sametmax 8y ago
    Why do mean you are no longer in irak or that the nsa is no longer spying on the people it's supposed to protect ? Beside, japan never attacked the us soil. I'm underlying all this because i want to point out the us is a very agressive country with an history of violence internally and externally. That's not to deny the positive things in america nor the good that it did for the world or the comfort and freedom a lot of it's population enjoy. It's just that tye later should not make you forget the former. If you can't see both, you are blind of one eye.

fulafel 8y ago

US is pretty bad re imprisonment: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarce...

pietroglyph 8y ago
The difference is that, generally, the US doesn't imprison people because of what they say.
- pizza 8y ago
  The US will however airstrike your wedding reception, or your hospital, or your school, etc. based on bad information.
  - themihai 8y ago
    Not, unless you life in a war zone..?
    - megous 8y ago
      Yes, airstrikes typically happen in what US calls war zones. Typically weak countries without allies that are willing to do anything in response. Anyway, what were you tryin to say?
      - themihai 8y ago
        I don't think that U.S. is lead by some evil forces that target civilians. . I'm trying to say that you should expect the worse in wars regardless who's fighting or how weak/strong they are(see WW1/WW2). That's why people should avoid wars. Syria could have avoided the war but it preferred to keep the dictator in place. Too bad that it ended-up with the worst deal: a revolution, a war and the same dictator at the helm..plus a huge debt to Vlad.
- 8note 8y ago
  yes, the US imprisons people based on how they look, not what they say.
  - GhostVII 8y ago
    Source?
    - Larrikin 8y ago
      Have you purposefully ignored the decades of news coverage about racial bias in policing and sentencing?
  - themihai 8y ago
    Compare that with China where you don't even have the right to talk about government abuse.
adventured 8y ago
China and the US are going opposite directions. The US incarceration rate is rapidly declining and has been falling for ten years. The US is pursuing drug legalization and decriminalization and is widely seeking to soften its approach overall. China is doing no such thing and has no interest in such, they regard drugs across the board to be completely opposed to their system's values. The US is pursuing the end of its failed mass-incarceration policies, with wide-spread bi-partisan support. China is aggressively clamping down on its people in just about every possible manner. It's so aggressive at this point, it's difficult to keep up with all the stories pouring out of China about a new repression/restriction. The US maintains extremely high degrees of freedom of speech, demonstration, expression, religion, movement. Yes, it's obviously not perfect on any given thing, that hardly needs said (and it's better at some things than others, for example it remains world-class on freedom of speech protections). China has almost none of that and is persistently revoking the gains that had been made. One need merely compare the vast, endless protest of Trump's Presidency and many of its policies, the terrible things that have been said about him and his family, the violent threats that are routinely made toward him across social media, the nude statue, the giant protest ducky, and on and on and on. Or, eg most media being stacked against him (~90% of all stories being negative; or just see: Colbert and Kimmel and the things they've said, which would get you immediately put into prison in China or worse). Now contrast that with how China treats Xi, from protests (lack thereof) to media. Or to simplify, see: Winnie the Pooh. You can't even say bad things about Mao in China, that's enough to get you put into prison. Feel free to call George Washington a devil slave owning piece of trash, all day long, all over the Internet, if you like. The US legalized gay marriage and has made vast strides over the decades in regards to equality for gay persons. China actively tortures gay people in trying to convert them and censors gay culture. The US has millions of Muslims that have assimilated fairly well into its culture and laws. Conflicts between US non-Muslims and US Muslims are rare, despite the US being overwhelmingly a Christian/Catholic nation. No purges are occuring, no culture eradication is occuring, no mass detentions are occuring; mass killings of Muslims did not occur after 9/11. China is torturing Muslims and seeking to wipe out Muslim culture in the Xinjiang region. What China is doing in Xinjiang is Guantanamo x1000, literally. Except Guantanamo was overwhelmingly directed at terrorists and battlefield combatants (and yes it failed at that premise on many occasions). What China is doing is targeting all Muslims because they're Muslims. And they may just be getting warmed up, if the history of dictatorships is any indication. Trump ran on a platform of decreasing the US military's expanse and the involvement in war in the Middle East. He routinely points out the stupidity of what the US has done in the Middle East in the past, no other President has dared to say such things. He just had to be talked into staying involved in Syria by the Europeans. The American people increasingly poll that they'd like to see a draw-down of the US military on the global stage, less entanglement rather than more; Americans are beyond war weary. China is going the opposite direction. They're violently annexing vast territory from other nations, persistently threatening Taiwan (with violent annexation seeming like an inevitability), and seeking global expansion for their military. Factually we don't have an accurate count at all on just how vast the torture camps are in China ('re-education camps'), how many people they're putting into prison, and how many people they're executing.

sametmax 8y ago

US has one of the biggest jail population in the world, which also exhibits a big social bias toward black males. Then it has the biggest military budget in the world, despite the fact no country has attacked it for centuries. But it did invade Irak, while lying about the WMD and against the vote of almost the entire world. Before that it used drugs to finance big entities, funded dictatorships and dropped the second bomb on Japan during WWII, ignoring that the first one did the job. It also consider it's own population as a threat, recording everything it communicates. Just because it doesn't do the same mistakes as another countries doesn't mean it's doing things right. You would be living in China, you would rationalize what the state does, just like you do because you are in the US. I could do the same speech about France, my own country. Education first goal is to avoid repeating mistakes, but it works only if you can recognize how much mess we have done, or are currently doing.

burger_moon 8y ago
> despite the fact no country has attacked it for centuries. It's odd how you say this but then also write about WWII and japan later on. Also I think you're making an arguement based on fallicies, the person you are responding to is referencing things happening currently. You are referencing things that happened in previous generations, aside from the first point which is valid though certainly a bit odd to compare to organ harvesting. Perhaps a better comparison would be to China's treatment of Tibetans and the US prison population. I'm not sure. I don't really care either way, just pointing out how stupid and pointless both of your arguments are.
- sametmax 8y ago
  Why do mean you are no longer in irak or that the nsa is no longer spying on the people it's supposed to protect ? Beside, japan never attacked the us soil. I'm underlying all this because i want to point out the us is a very agressive country with an history of violence internally and externally. That's not to deny the positive things in america nor the good that it did for the world or the comfort and freedom a lot of it's population enjoy. It's just that tye later should not make you forget the former. If you can't see both, you are blind of one eye.