6 ms·

We don't intentionally throw our garbage directly into the ocean, but it still makes its way there. Follow a garbage truck for a while and note how much loose t

We don't intentionally throw our garbage directly into the ocean, but it still makes its way there. Follow a garbage truck for a while and note how much loose trash falls out either while it's driving around or while it's picking up a garbage can and collecting the contents. Realize that much of the garbage in the street will be washed down a storm drain, usually without a filter, and that the storm drain will dump into a creek or river.

martinald 8y ago
Someone analysed the Thames in London and found it had 18 tonnes a year of plastic waste in it. The Yangtze (which is longer to be fair) has 1.5 million tonnes of year of plastic waste. Probably 1000x the waste per-river-km. GPs point is entirely correct; plastic waste isn't a huge problem (unsightly perhaps) in Western world, it's the developing world which is causing nearly all of this problem. Be far better to focus resources on there, it would literally have a 1000x+ better RoI than the west.
- noiv 8y ago
  One way to see it. Another may consider population, the western world massively exporting trash, having decades of head start on polluting the oceans with plastic (micro plastic needs time) and totally fails to develop exportable clean consumer products or to build or sell the machines needed to produce them. I don't like plastic in sea food, but it's probably to late with or without China. Pointing now at countries copy pasting our lifestyle is just ridiculous, they didn't invent plastic bags.
- abraae 8y ago
  I think its a poorly understood cultural thing. If you go to a beach e.g. in Phuket, Thailand, you'll find a mountain of rubbish just off the part where the tourists sit. Plastic bags and bottles, old car parts, tin cans, all sorts of shit. Same in Rarotonga, or many of what you might label third world countries that tourists go to. Right next to where people live and work, blowing around. In some cultures, rubbish is just ignored. You'd think if you worked next to the beach, you'd at least clean up the little patch next to your stall when you had some downtime, but this just doesn't seem part of the mindset. I don't know if its some kind of "tragedy of the commons" type thinking or what it is.
  - Kluny 8y ago
    Obviously if there's so much trash that it's overwhelming, you disregard it for the sake of your peace of mind. Picking up one bag out of millions in your immediate area feels futile. There also might not be any place to put it. First-world trash management programs don't magically spring out of nowhere. They are planned, developed, and maintained.
  - freedomben 8y ago
    This is largely the way things are in Jerusalem. There is tons of trash all over the place, stuffed into crevices and just loose on the street. It seems to be largely ignored by the locals (it is like this even in very non-touristy areas as well, so it's not just messy tourists).
    - RobertRoberts 8y ago
      I took a quick look at the google on this topic and found this: https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/MAGAZINE-total-rubbish-why-is-israel-so-filthy-1.6006920 https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/MAGAZINE-total-rubbish-w... That is incredible. I have been all over the US in many, many parks over 40 years and never once, anywhere, did I see a pile of trash like this. Even in the early 80s this never happened at a park. (I know many, many other countries are way worse, but being 3rd world is at least a partial excuse) In a big city, in a few places, (I lived on the streets for a bit in a few big cities) there wasn't even trash like this. Even the worst places in Portland, LA and other big cities, unless it was a total slum, it was not like this. Anywhere there their is a public interest, the US actually gives a crap about keeping it clean. It's surprising how other cultures give the US such a hard time about "recycling" and "being green", I am about to be sick of hearing it. Considering the size and magnitude of the park systems in the US, we are one of the cleanest, greenest friggin nations the world as ever known. (besides the nasty pollution from factories, but that is another issue)
      - golergka 8y ago
        > I took a quick look at the google on this topic and found this: > https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/MAGAZINE-total-rubbish-w.. https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/MAGAZINE-total-rubbish-w.... You wouldn't nothing close to Tel Aviv garbage piles in Givatayim, Raanana, Herzliya or Netanya, but at the same time Yaffo, but somehow, Jaffa, Acre and Jerusalem have it much worse. (And before I get accused of racism, Bnei Brak and Mea Shearim are just as bad, with Tiberias getting worse every year.) Israel is a very heterogenous country, with different communities having radically different lifestyles and ideals - reality that this Haaretz piece completely ignores.
irrational 8y ago
Maybe they should get better garbage trucks. Ours load from the top, so there is no way for trash to fall out.
- wanderr 8y ago
  Like so? https://imgur.com/gallery/YiwxQKy https://imgur.com/gallery/YiwxQKy
  - ravenstine 8y ago
    I knew it would be that gif before I clicked on it. It's compelling to watch, in a weird way. Sort of like the reverse effect of watching "satisfying" videos, the anticipation of waiting for something to go really wrong is nonetheless fascinating. I always end up staring at the one for a good minute or two.
    - seanp2k2 8y ago
      https://goo.gl/images/MFrL2h https://goo.gl/images/MFrL2h
  - irrational 8y ago
    Hah! Yes exactly! Only I've never seen that happen ;-)
ManFromUranus 8y ago
You're right, it's most likely our fault https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=8PavA4rUypE https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=8PavA4rUypE
- RobertRoberts 8y ago
  Not sure why you got voted down. It seems HN users don't like snark or can't understand sarcasm? (need a /sarcasm tag?)
  - ManFromUranus 8y ago
    A little from column A, a little from column B. I've spent too much time on reddit.... HN likes their comments snark free and I understand, It really is better that way. Sometimes I just can't resist though.
    - RobertRoberts 8y ago
      That is an interesting idea, an entire social group that shuns the minutiae. It explains some of my bad experiences here. They should have a "social rules" next to the "actual rules". I like the idea though, thanks for mentioning it. Plenty of other places for humor and stupidity, doesn't need to be on HN.
erw1 8y ago
Pretty sure that until recently, the preferred mode of trash disposal in NY was to tug it into the ocean and let it loose. edit: Yep, see [1] > Through most of its history until the mid-1900s, New York’s primary method for disposing of its waste was simply to dump it into the ocean. At one point, as much as 80% of New York’s garbage ended up out at sea. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/oct/27/new-york-rubbish-all-that-trash-city-waste-in-numbers https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/oct/27/new-york-rubb...
- ams6110 8y ago
  While true, there was a lot less plastic in the trash then.

martinald 8y ago

Someone analysed the Thames in London and found it had 18 tonnes a year of plastic waste in it. The Yangtze (which is longer to be fair) has 1.5 million tonnes of year of plastic waste. Probably 1000x the waste per-river-km. GPs point is entirely correct; plastic waste isn't a huge problem (unsightly perhaps) in Western world, it's the developing world which is causing nearly all of this problem. Be far better to focus resources on there, it would literally have a 1000x+ better RoI than the west.

noiv 8y ago
One way to see it. Another may consider population, the western world massively exporting trash, having decades of head start on polluting the oceans with plastic (micro plastic needs time) and totally fails to develop exportable clean consumer products or to build or sell the machines needed to produce them. I don't like plastic in sea food, but it's probably to late with or without China. Pointing now at countries copy pasting our lifestyle is just ridiculous, they didn't invent plastic bags.
abraae 8y ago
I think its a poorly understood cultural thing. If you go to a beach e.g. in Phuket, Thailand, you'll find a mountain of rubbish just off the part where the tourists sit. Plastic bags and bottles, old car parts, tin cans, all sorts of shit. Same in Rarotonga, or many of what you might label third world countries that tourists go to. Right next to where people live and work, blowing around. In some cultures, rubbish is just ignored. You'd think if you worked next to the beach, you'd at least clean up the little patch next to your stall when you had some downtime, but this just doesn't seem part of the mindset. I don't know if its some kind of "tragedy of the commons" type thinking or what it is.
- Kluny 8y ago
  Obviously if there's so much trash that it's overwhelming, you disregard it for the sake of your peace of mind. Picking up one bag out of millions in your immediate area feels futile. There also might not be any place to put it. First-world trash management programs don't magically spring out of nowhere. They are planned, developed, and maintained.
- freedomben 8y ago
  This is largely the way things are in Jerusalem. There is tons of trash all over the place, stuffed into crevices and just loose on the street. It seems to be largely ignored by the locals (it is like this even in very non-touristy areas as well, so it's not just messy tourists).
  - RobertRoberts 8y ago
    I took a quick look at the google on this topic and found this: https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/MAGAZINE-total-rubbish-why-is-israel-so-filthy-1.6006920 https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/MAGAZINE-total-rubbish-w... That is incredible. I have been all over the US in many, many parks over 40 years and never once, anywhere, did I see a pile of trash like this. Even in the early 80s this never happened at a park. (I know many, many other countries are way worse, but being 3rd world is at least a partial excuse) In a big city, in a few places, (I lived on the streets for a bit in a few big cities) there wasn't even trash like this. Even the worst places in Portland, LA and other big cities, unless it was a total slum, it was not like this. Anywhere there their is a public interest, the US actually gives a crap about keeping it clean. It's surprising how other cultures give the US such a hard time about "recycling" and "being green", I am about to be sick of hearing it. Considering the size and magnitude of the park systems in the US, we are one of the cleanest, greenest friggin nations the world as ever known. (besides the nasty pollution from factories, but that is another issue)
    - golergka 8y ago
      > I took a quick look at the google on this topic and found this: > https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/MAGAZINE-total-rubbish-w.. https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/MAGAZINE-total-rubbish-w.... You wouldn't nothing close to Tel Aviv garbage piles in Givatayim, Raanana, Herzliya or Netanya, but at the same time Yaffo, but somehow, Jaffa, Acre and Jerusalem have it much worse. (And before I get accused of racism, Bnei Brak and Mea Shearim are just as bad, with Tiberias getting worse every year.) Israel is a very heterogenous country, with different communities having radically different lifestyles and ideals - reality that this Haaretz piece completely ignores.

irrational 8y ago

Maybe they should get better garbage trucks. Ours load from the top, so there is no way for trash to fall out.

wanderr 8y ago
Like so? https://imgur.com/gallery/YiwxQKy https://imgur.com/gallery/YiwxQKy
- ravenstine 8y ago
  I knew it would be that gif before I clicked on it. It's compelling to watch, in a weird way. Sort of like the reverse effect of watching "satisfying" videos, the anticipation of waiting for something to go really wrong is nonetheless fascinating. I always end up staring at the one for a good minute or two.
  - seanp2k2 8y ago
    https://goo.gl/images/MFrL2h https://goo.gl/images/MFrL2h
- irrational 8y ago
  Hah! Yes exactly! Only I've never seen that happen ;-)

ManFromUranus 8y ago

You're right, it's most likely our fault https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=8PavA4rUypE https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=8PavA4rUypE

RobertRoberts 8y ago
Not sure why you got voted down. It seems HN users don't like snark or can't understand sarcasm? (need a /sarcasm tag?)
- ManFromUranus 8y ago
  A little from column A, a little from column B. I've spent too much time on reddit.... HN likes their comments snark free and I understand, It really is better that way. Sometimes I just can't resist though.
  - RobertRoberts 8y ago
    That is an interesting idea, an entire social group that shuns the minutiae. It explains some of my bad experiences here. They should have a "social rules" next to the "actual rules". I like the idea though, thanks for mentioning it. Plenty of other places for humor and stupidity, doesn't need to be on HN.

erw1 8y ago

Pretty sure that until recently, the preferred mode of trash disposal in NY was to tug it into the ocean and let it loose. edit: Yep, see [1] > Through most of its history until the mid-1900s, New York’s primary method for disposing of its waste was simply to dump it into the ocean. At one point, as much as 80% of New York’s garbage ended up out at sea. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/oct/27/new-york-rubbish-all-that-trash-city-waste-in-numbers https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/oct/27/new-york-rubb...

ams6110 8y ago
While true, there was a lot less plastic in the trash then.