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The key to Elon Musk making Tesla work well is figuring out how Apple works so well. I have no real idea how Apple manages to be effective and innovative with 1

The key to Elon Musk making Tesla work well is figuring out how Apple works so well. I have no real idea how Apple manages to be effective and innovative with 100,000+ employees. I don't think Elon Musk really understands what they're doing either but I really hope he can replicate it. The most obvious answer is that Tesla becomes a division of Apple and Tim Cook helps scale Tesla, as he helped Steve Jobs scale Apple.

alexkavon 8y ago
That is some Silicon Valley fanfic speculation right there haha.
- airstrike 8y ago
  Still a better love story than Twilight
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
abritinthebay 8y ago
Given the debt load Tesla has there is no way they get bought by most companies. That said... if we’re hypothesizing then yeah, it’s a good ideological fit at least.
- InTheArena 8y ago
  tesla's liabilities are still less then their assets, and their order book is absolutely insanely robust. Their price makes it so a car manufacturer (save maybe VW) couldn't buy them, but given that both Apple and Google are trying to get into automobiles, Either of them would jump at the chance, assuming a sane valuation stock wise.
  - Driverswanted 8y ago
    They don't have orders, they have refundable deposits. How many are converting? Elon would not say on the call. Why?
    - InTheArena 8y ago
      Tesla's statement was that the order book was holding solid at around 450k, IIRC. Not bad for something with a multi-year backlog. I suspect the reason why is because Tesla is only targeting the highest end model 3s right now, and people who have put down deposits are waiting to see what the federal tax credit situation is like, and if I can manage to hold out for the base model since I don't need the 300mi upgraded on (but can afford it, if I wish). Tesla is going after the high margin cars right now (as they should). within the next month (if current tends hold) they will bass BMW, Mercedes and Audi in the premium sedan market with that strategy, all while trying to maximize incoming revenue. On the other hand it could be a conspiracy to shaft Short Sellers, who are owed a complete collapse of the stock, bankruptcy of Tesla, and Elon being led away in chains.
dv_dt 8y ago
I think we have a little too much faith in how some organization trees of people by itself causes effectiveness, vs having a good personal working dynamic and people themselves. And it could be many re-organizations aren't really undertaken to re-org per se, but to provide a bit of a reset to the personal dynamics of teams.
- dv_dt 8y ago
  See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawthorne_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawthorne_effect
deanCommie 8y ago
The vast majority of Apple's 100,000+ is retail employees, just like the majority of Amazon's 500,000+ is warehouse workers.
- staunch 8y ago
  That doesn't seem very different from Tesla's situation with manufacturing and retail stores.
mongol 8y ago
It is an interesting suggestion from a branding perspective. Apple and Tesla feels like similar brands in that they are hip and innovative. But to what extent Apple can help Tesla to scale better, vs any larger automotive company feels uncertain. Has the "Apple buys Tesla idea" been seriously discussed in media?
- InTheArena 8y ago
  It's been out there quite a bit: http://bgr.com/2017/05/04/elon-musk-tesla-apple-acquisition/ http://bgr.com/2017/05/04/elon-musk-tesla-apple-acquisition/ and More to the point, there have been discussions in the past. Apple apparently started discussions back in 2012.
InTheArena 8y ago
Tim cook is a awesome COO. As a CEO, Apple is squandering all of the advantages that Steve Jobs left them with. They have been without any clear direction or product vision for a while now, and continuing debacles like the Mac Pro situation (5+ years and counting since Apple has a had a competitive pro stand alone machine), the poor quality of the new Macbook Pro (bad keyboard, dongle hell), the absolute joke that is the Mac Mini indicates that Apple is loosing the ability to even evolutionary improve their products. This is because you don't have a guy with product vision at the top. Instead you have someone who is great at optimization. So yes to Tim Cook. No to running Tesla.
- stcredzero 8y ago
  Tim cook is a awesome COO...So yes to Tim Cook. No to running Tesla. Isn't operations what Tesla needs right now?
  - InTheArena 8y ago
    Operations is, but not at the expense of having a vision of what to deliver. You can hire and define operations, you can't do the same for product vision.
    - InTheArena 8y ago
      What elon needs is a clone of Shotwell from SpaceX. Someone who shares the vision, but can execute the day to day.
    - staunch 8y ago
      Yes, that's why Elon Musk stays on as CEO of Tesla but it becomes a subsidiary of Apple, Inc.
- erikpukinskis 8y ago
  Isn’t that Ive’s job?
- nradov 8y ago
  An alternative explanation could be that Apple is quietly discontinuing MacOS laptop / desktop computers while putting more resources into replacing them with larger iOS devices. At some point it no longer makes sense to maintain separate operating systems and hardware architectures. All the pundits have been predicting convergence for years now.

alexkavon 8y ago

That is some Silicon Valley fanfic speculation right there haha.

airstrike 8y ago
Still a better love story than Twilight

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

abritinthebay 8y ago

Given the debt load Tesla has there is no way they get bought by most companies. That said... if we’re hypothesizing then yeah, it’s a good ideological fit at least.

InTheArena 8y ago
tesla's liabilities are still less then their assets, and their order book is absolutely insanely robust. Their price makes it so a car manufacturer (save maybe VW) couldn't buy them, but given that both Apple and Google are trying to get into automobiles, Either of them would jump at the chance, assuming a sane valuation stock wise.
- Driverswanted 8y ago
  They don't have orders, they have refundable deposits. How many are converting? Elon would not say on the call. Why?
  - InTheArena 8y ago
    Tesla's statement was that the order book was holding solid at around 450k, IIRC. Not bad for something with a multi-year backlog. I suspect the reason why is because Tesla is only targeting the highest end model 3s right now, and people who have put down deposits are waiting to see what the federal tax credit situation is like, and if I can manage to hold out for the base model since I don't need the 300mi upgraded on (but can afford it, if I wish). Tesla is going after the high margin cars right now (as they should). within the next month (if current tends hold) they will bass BMW, Mercedes and Audi in the premium sedan market with that strategy, all while trying to maximize incoming revenue. On the other hand it could be a conspiracy to shaft Short Sellers, who are owed a complete collapse of the stock, bankruptcy of Tesla, and Elon being led away in chains.

dv_dt 8y ago

I think we have a little too much faith in how some organization trees of people by itself causes effectiveness, vs having a good personal working dynamic and people themselves. And it could be many re-organizations aren't really undertaken to re-org per se, but to provide a bit of a reset to the personal dynamics of teams.

dv_dt 8y ago
See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawthorne_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawthorne_effect

deanCommie 8y ago

The vast majority of Apple's 100,000+ is retail employees, just like the majority of Amazon's 500,000+ is warehouse workers.

staunch 8y ago
That doesn't seem very different from Tesla's situation with manufacturing and retail stores.

mongol 8y ago

It is an interesting suggestion from a branding perspective. Apple and Tesla feels like similar brands in that they are hip and innovative. But to what extent Apple can help Tesla to scale better, vs any larger automotive company feels uncertain. Has the "Apple buys Tesla idea" been seriously discussed in media?

InTheArena 8y ago
It's been out there quite a bit: http://bgr.com/2017/05/04/elon-musk-tesla-apple-acquisition/ http://bgr.com/2017/05/04/elon-musk-tesla-apple-acquisition/ and More to the point, there have been discussions in the past. Apple apparently started discussions back in 2012.

InTheArena 8y ago

Tim cook is a awesome COO. As a CEO, Apple is squandering all of the advantages that Steve Jobs left them with. They have been without any clear direction or product vision for a while now, and continuing debacles like the Mac Pro situation (5+ years and counting since Apple has a had a competitive pro stand alone machine), the poor quality of the new Macbook Pro (bad keyboard, dongle hell), the absolute joke that is the Mac Mini indicates that Apple is loosing the ability to even evolutionary improve their products. This is because you don't have a guy with product vision at the top. Instead you have someone who is great at optimization. So yes to Tim Cook. No to running Tesla.

stcredzero 8y ago
Tim cook is a awesome COO...So yes to Tim Cook. No to running Tesla. Isn't operations what Tesla needs right now?
- InTheArena 8y ago
  Operations is, but not at the expense of having a vision of what to deliver. You can hire and define operations, you can't do the same for product vision.
  - InTheArena 8y ago
    What elon needs is a clone of Shotwell from SpaceX. Someone who shares the vision, but can execute the day to day.
  - staunch 8y ago
    Yes, that's why Elon Musk stays on as CEO of Tesla but it becomes a subsidiary of Apple, Inc.
erikpukinskis 8y ago
Isn’t that Ive’s job?
nradov 8y ago
An alternative explanation could be that Apple is quietly discontinuing MacOS laptop / desktop computers while putting more resources into replacing them with larger iOS devices. At some point it no longer makes sense to maintain separate operating systems and hardware architectures. All the pundits have been predicting convergence for years now.