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War is some special experience that Western Men have ... where they get to fulfil some kind of murderous power fantasy over people who don't matter? No. Nothin
by ryanmarsh 8y ago
War is some special experience that Western Men have ... where they get to fulfil some kind of murderous power fantasy over people who don't matter?
No. Nothing about that is western. That’s just history.
War is the most human you’ll ever be. I don’t know how to explain it to someone who doesn’t want to believe their own potential for malevolence. It’s like eating from the forbidden tree in the garden. You’re eyes become open to the savage visceral reality that we’re nothing more than primates that talk.
- placebo 8y agoTrue. Nothing about violence is specifically western. Also true that the reality is that humans have evolved from more primitive animals that are totally driven by survival instincts and thus will usually act that way too (though mostly disguised in more subtle forms than war). What you're missing though (or perhaps deliberately ignoring) is the potential of humans to rise above being marionettes of their animal instinct. Acting by instinct has its upsides sometimes. It certainly brings raw animal gratification but rationalising that we're "nothing more than primates that talk" is just an excuse to enjoy the animal gratification while ignoring the consequences (which beyond hurting other sentient beings also blocks one's way to real freedom, which is the real tragedy).
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- amelius 8y ago> You’re eyes become open to the savage visceral reality that we’re nothing more than primates that talk. If you look at all the accomplishments of mankind in science and art, how can you say that?
- w_t_payne 8y agoHumanity is what happens when we tame human nature.
- erikpukinskis 8y agoI think “civilization” might be a better word for that.
- w_t_payne 8y agoI used 'humanity' to link to humanitarianism and the humanities. Civilisation has ... other connotations.
- erikpukinskis 8y agotame has the same connotations. Anyway you’d have to say more than a one liner if you wanted to have a real conversation about what you meant.
- w_t_payne 8y agoTrue enough.
- ataturk 8y agoAs someone who has probed the depths of his own "malevolence" in very anti-social ways (and with nothing to do with socially acceptable state-sanctioned acts) I understand what you are saying. However, "primates that talk" is not what we aspire to being, at least not me. The enthusiasm that soldiers have for carrying out the policies of their leaders is what bothers me about them. It's really nothing to do with the basic mechanics of killing other than the outright cowardice that technology brings into it all.