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What’s the reality here? Some sense of “fairness”? Because shop-workers need to work fixed hours, everyone should? You’re hiring developers to build software

What’s the reality here? Some sense of “fairness”? Because shop-workers need to work fixed hours, everyone should? You’re hiring developers to build software, not to be office furniture — do the exact hours worked matter very much?

andrewaylett 8y ago
Plenty of shops in the big retail park near my house (Edinburgh, UK) don't open until 10am.
- dghughes 8y ago
  Even 10am seems early. When I have a week day off and see people shopping I always wonder who are all these people? I can't see everyone being off that day, the same day.
  - astura 8y ago
    Besides people with the day off? People who are not employed for whatever reason (housewife/househusband, between jobs, on permanent disability, medical leave, retired, on sabbatical, etc.) People who work second shift People who work third shift People who work part time People on call Seasonal employees People who work non-traditional schedules[1] People who have flextime at work Students who have late classes or no classes that day [1] Examples: a friend who worked 12 hour shifts Fri-Sun but had M-Th off; another friend who works 10 hour shifts M-T and Th-Fri with Wed and the weekend off.
    - dghughes 8y ago
      I don't disagree with your list but living in a fairly small town of 70,000 it seems odd to see so many people out. You can add tourists to the list too.
  - deleted 8y ago
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Liquix 8y ago
This sounds a bit condescending. Just because it's normal for shops to open early doesn't mean that people who work those jobs are less negatively impacted by alarms and sleep quality. What's the difference between being tired & miserable in a manual labor position and being tired & miserable in an engineering/devops position?
- naasking 8y ago
  The cognitive difficulty of the work, I imagine. For instance, consider the scope of the screwup for getting something wrong because you're tired, ie. affecting thousands of people rather than a few people in the shop.
  - pc86 8y ago
    Yup, it's not like people working manual labor or machine shop labor can kill themselves or others if they're tired. Clearly the fact that we need to think about overengineered microservices written in JavaScript means our lives are just as hard. For fuck's sake HN we're talking about waking up and going to work. Most of us here are getting paid $100k+ (or twice that in SV) to type for a living. Stop trying to pretend your life is so difficult because you need to set an alarm, be presentable at an office, and work normal hours.
    - danharaj 8y ago
      The obvious resolution is that all workers should be able to set their work conditions so that they can do their jobs without sacrificing any bit of their wellbeing.
      - dasmoth 8y ago
        That would certainly seem like the ideal.
        spurcell93 8y ago
        Ah, the old, if you don't like it go somewhere else argument employed by privileged capitalists everywhere. "People who are worried about the negative conditions at Uber shouldn't drive for Uber! It's not anyone's problem that those conditions are negative. "
JustSomeNobody 8y ago
What about the office manager who'd rather leave at 5? Before people accept a job somewhere they should find out the required work hours. If that doesn't match their ideal, then they should not accept the job.
deleted 8y ago
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andrewaylett 8y ago

Plenty of shops in the big retail park near my house (Edinburgh, UK) don't open until 10am.

dghughes 8y ago
Even 10am seems early. When I have a week day off and see people shopping I always wonder who are all these people? I can't see everyone being off that day, the same day.
- astura 8y ago
  Besides people with the day off? People who are not employed for whatever reason (housewife/househusband, between jobs, on permanent disability, medical leave, retired, on sabbatical, etc.) People who work second shift People who work third shift People who work part time People on call Seasonal employees People who work non-traditional schedules[1] People who have flextime at work Students who have late classes or no classes that day [1] Examples: a friend who worked 12 hour shifts Fri-Sun but had M-Th off; another friend who works 10 hour shifts M-T and Th-Fri with Wed and the weekend off.
  - dghughes 8y ago
    I don't disagree with your list but living in a fairly small town of 70,000 it seems odd to see so many people out. You can add tourists to the list too.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]

Liquix 8y ago

This sounds a bit condescending. Just because it's normal for shops to open early doesn't mean that people who work those jobs are less negatively impacted by alarms and sleep quality. What's the difference between being tired & miserable in a manual labor position and being tired & miserable in an engineering/devops position?

naasking 8y ago
The cognitive difficulty of the work, I imagine. For instance, consider the scope of the screwup for getting something wrong because you're tired, ie. affecting thousands of people rather than a few people in the shop.
- pc86 8y ago
  Yup, it's not like people working manual labor or machine shop labor can kill themselves or others if they're tired. Clearly the fact that we need to think about overengineered microservices written in JavaScript means our lives are just as hard. For fuck's sake HN we're talking about waking up and going to work. Most of us here are getting paid $100k+ (or twice that in SV) to type for a living. Stop trying to pretend your life is so difficult because you need to set an alarm, be presentable at an office, and work normal hours.
  - danharaj 8y ago
    The obvious resolution is that all workers should be able to set their work conditions so that they can do their jobs without sacrificing any bit of their wellbeing.
    - dasmoth 8y ago
      That would certainly seem like the ideal.
      - spurcell93 8y ago
        Ah, the old, if you don't like it go somewhere else argument employed by privileged capitalists everywhere. "People who are worried about the negative conditions at Uber shouldn't drive for Uber! It's not anyone's problem that those conditions are negative. "

JustSomeNobody 8y ago

What about the office manager who'd rather leave at 5? Before people accept a job somewhere they should find out the required work hours. If that doesn't match their ideal, then they should not accept the job.

deleted 8y ago

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