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It matters, and it might be ok if the wealthy were being nice about it. Unfortunately a very active subset seems to be bringing back feudalism. In the 20s-70s r

It matters, and it might be ok if the wealthy were being nice about it. Unfortunately a very active subset seems to be bringing back feudalism. In the 20s-70s rich people were conveniently afraid of communist revolution and thus inclined to distributed gains. Without another credible threat of global revolution I don’t know how this gets fixed. Of course, communism did have downsides for the people who actually lived under it.

psyc 9y ago
I basically agree with your first sentence. Specifically, I don't believe capitalism itself is the root problem, but rather something like a deficit in social cohesion. No sense that we're fellow humans collectively struggling towards a better society. That sense doesn't necessarily imply a communist implementation. It could mean something as simple as an ethos in which those who are better off try to help others up. I couldn't begin to address how that might come about, and I'm as wary as anyone about trying to use a State to do it. Because the State never actually turns out to be the People, except in the naive or fanciful abstract.
- charlesdm 9y ago
  Capitalism works fine, the only 'flaw' I think it has is that excessive capital can compound way too fast. If you have $10m, and you invest that really really really well, you might be making 10 to 30% on that capital. Maybe more if you're an entrepreneur investing strategically. That's fine. But let's say you're worth $1bn, and you compound at 10% per year.. you're making money hand over fist. Add smart use of debt to that, and that's probably too much rent seeking to be healthy. Basically, once you pass a few 100 million, I think it gets really unfair. Below.. it doesn't really matter. No one will live in poverty because someone owns $100m -- it's meaningless in the grand scheme of things. But wealth is a snowball that doesn't grow fast enough on the low end, and too fast on the high end. The only way to fix that would probably be a global wealth tax, but I don't see that happening anytime soon.
sparkzilla 9y ago
"downsides"
- ericd 9y ago
  Largest understatement I've seen in a while.
  - cal5k 9y ago
    Between Mao and Stalin alone you're probably talking 50-100MM deaths. That's one hell of a downside.
    - noobermin 9y ago
      I assure you, capitalism has killed more people than that. We just don't call them victims of capitalism.
      - rich-w-big-ego 9y ago
        At least in Capitalism you are allowed to talk about your suffering. In the communist utopias of the 20th century, speaking of your suffering or trying to alleviate it was a capital offence.
      - ericd 9y ago
        I'd really like to see your accounting to see if it's apples to apples, because the 50-100M is not counting people who died due to proxy wars, or anything like that, just people who lived directly under communist governments, and died directly because of communist policies that lead to things like mass starvation, and in many cases, because of literal death squads. It's surprising that people already seem to be forgetting how incredibly horrible communism was when implemented.
      - dwaltrip 9y ago
        We're going to need more than assurances to see your point.
    - 9y ago
charlesdm 9y ago
"Nice about it"? What should they do, hand it out to people?
- tibbetts 9y ago
  Pay their taxes without whining or trying to take over the government. Don’t try to discredit science to protect your wealth. Consider the social costs of their investments. Engage in substantial philanthropy.

psyc 9y ago

I basically agree with your first sentence. Specifically, I don't believe capitalism itself is the root problem, but rather something like a deficit in social cohesion. No sense that we're fellow humans collectively struggling towards a better society. That sense doesn't necessarily imply a communist implementation. It could mean something as simple as an ethos in which those who are better off try to help others up. I couldn't begin to address how that might come about, and I'm as wary as anyone about trying to use a State to do it. Because the State never actually turns out to be the People, except in the naive or fanciful abstract.

charlesdm 9y ago
Capitalism works fine, the only 'flaw' I think it has is that excessive capital can compound way too fast. If you have $10m, and you invest that really really really well, you might be making 10 to 30% on that capital. Maybe more if you're an entrepreneur investing strategically. That's fine. But let's say you're worth $1bn, and you compound at 10% per year.. you're making money hand over fist. Add smart use of debt to that, and that's probably too much rent seeking to be healthy. Basically, once you pass a few 100 million, I think it gets really unfair. Below.. it doesn't really matter. No one will live in poverty because someone owns $100m -- it's meaningless in the grand scheme of things. But wealth is a snowball that doesn't grow fast enough on the low end, and too fast on the high end. The only way to fix that would probably be a global wealth tax, but I don't see that happening anytime soon.

sparkzilla 9y ago

"downsides"

ericd 9y ago
Largest understatement I've seen in a while.
- cal5k 9y ago
  Between Mao and Stalin alone you're probably talking 50-100MM deaths. That's one hell of a downside.
  - noobermin 9y ago
    I assure you, capitalism has killed more people than that. We just don't call them victims of capitalism.
    - rich-w-big-ego 9y ago
      At least in Capitalism you are allowed to talk about your suffering. In the communist utopias of the 20th century, speaking of your suffering or trying to alleviate it was a capital offence.
    - ericd 9y ago
      I'd really like to see your accounting to see if it's apples to apples, because the 50-100M is not counting people who died due to proxy wars, or anything like that, just people who lived directly under communist governments, and died directly because of communist policies that lead to things like mass starvation, and in many cases, because of literal death squads. It's surprising that people already seem to be forgetting how incredibly horrible communism was when implemented.
    - dwaltrip 9y ago
      We're going to need more than assurances to see your point.
  - 9y ago

charlesdm 9y ago

"Nice about it"? What should they do, hand it out to people?

tibbetts 9y ago
Pay their taxes without whining or trying to take over the government. Don’t try to discredit science to protect your wealth. Consider the social costs of their investments. Engage in substantial philanthropy.