6 ms·

Campaign against Craigslist reaches absurd heights

32 points by grellas 16y ago

bherms 16y ago
Does this remind anyone else of Atlas Shrugged? The government forces someone to bend to their will, then tries to also force that person/business to also speak out on the oppressors behalf. Sickening IMO, but sadly, it's just another tactic used to fool people into thinking they're doing something worthwhile here. I'd like to hear Clist speak out and say that they're shutting Adult down because they were forced to, but that the issue still remains and, if anything, having it publicly available on Craigslist probably made the "industry" safer.
- wmeredith 16y ago
  Yes, there's an Atlas Shrugged correlation there. However, I'm pretty sure that a governing body forcing the oppressed to make erroneous public statements on their behalf has been a non-fiction occurrence for far longer than Atlas Shrugged has been in print.
  - sabat 16y ago
    In this context, Rand was merely acting as a reporter.
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]
- tptacek 16y ago
  Give me a break. craiglist picked a fight. They disabled the adult ads, and replaced them with a "fuck you" to the state AG's. They have every right to do that, and I'm glad they did; it's more honest that way. However, nobody has any business feigning outrage that the AG's then questioned their step. Most of the time, when people stamp "censored" over content on their site, they do in fact intend to put it back. You can break out the Ayn Rand when someone passes a law requiring craigslist to genuflect, instead of just issuing a sharply worded press release in an ongoing pissing match.
  - joe_the_user 16y ago
    "They have every right to do that, and I'm glad they did; it's more honest that way. However, nobody has any business feigning outrage that the AG's then questioned their step." Well, unless you're outraged the AG ever began their campaign to begin with. Then you might feel outrage that they're following it to its conclusion. I suppose you have a point that claim should have been "AG's campaign stays as stupid as it ever was ..."
tptacek 16y ago
Is Blumenthal's crusade against craigslist a shameless pandering PR stunt from a (popular) politician running for higher office? Yes. Is the underlying concern nonsensical? No. Did craigslist take a real step to ameliorate the concern of AG's around the country over trafficking ads? Yes. Did craigslist eliminate trafficking ads (and ads for prostitution in general) from the site? No. Is the Internet changing the game for the illicit sex industry? Yes. Is craigslist assuming a central role in that transformation? Yes. Is craiglist actively pursuing that role? Probably not. Is it fair that they're bearing the brunt of public outrage over the Internet's role in making the illicit sex market more efficient? I don't know. Maybe. Articles taking the piss out of CT Gov candidate Blumenthal for making a campaign issue out of craigslist: peachy keen. Articles suggesting that public outrage against craiglist is intrinsically wrong, or articles that don't say that directly but form arguments clearly premised on that notion: not so great.
- jobu 16y ago
  Going after Craigslist over the adult content was a short sighted political move that will make it harder to fight prostitution in the long run. To some extent it's like the music labels going after napster. This eliminates the largest network (and the easiest one for authorities to monitor), and pushes the whole internet sex economy further underground.
  - tptacek 16y ago
    I know that's the talking point about prostitution, but I don't automatically agree with it. If targeting craigslist is part of a broader crackdown on the online sex trade, where craigslist is forced to adopt a more conservative editorial posture and other sites are forced out of business completely, then the argument doesn't stand. People talk as if the sex trade can go completely underground, as if it's only exposed to the public eye through the benevolent lens of craiglist. Of course that's not true. Even among the worst offenders, the mafia-based sex slave traffickers, it's still a business, and it still needs customer acquisition mechanisms.
    - joe_the_user 16y ago
ww520 16y ago
The tech industry seriously needs to organize to have a bigger political clout.
- tptacek 16y ago
  And you think craiglist prostitution ads are the rallying point for that?
  - ww520 16y ago
    While I agree that the current Craiglist's predicament is unpleasant, what is it about that "First they came for ..." thing?
    - tptacek 16y ago
      You mean, "First they came for the sex traffickers, and I said nothing, because I agreed that the sex trade is bad and that making it more expensive and riskier was a worthy use of my tax dollars"? Next you'll tell me that they're coming for the car stereo fences.
      - ww520 16y ago
        First they came for Craiglist's adult section where some member submitted content were objectionable. Next they come for the gun forum where some member submitted content are objectionable. Next they come for Reddit where some member submitted pictures are objectionable. Next they come for Hacker News because someone posts detail in hacking into DOD. Craiglist has broken no law. The politicians are going on a moral crusade for their benefit. They pick on the geeks because well back in school they were the easy targets.
        tptacek 16y ago
        These aren't objectionable pictures. These aren't objectionable message board posts. These are advertisements for overtly criminal activities. You have to make a real argument. And speaking as one of the geekier people on HN, please spare me the geek exceptionalism.
oiuygtfrtghyju 16y ago
Isn't it time to go after the real enemy? Corning make almost all the glass that transmits all this digital pornography around the world. Isn't it time somebody acted to stop these monsters profiting from the evil trade in dense wavelength division multiplexing?
tedunangst 16y ago
In other news, the Mercury News website was obviously hacked. It's a well known impossibility for "old media" to publish anything supportive of craigslist.

32 points by grellas 16y ago

Does this remind anyone else of Atlas Shrugged? The government forces someone to bend to their will, then tries to also force that person/business to also speak out on the oppressors behalf. Sickening IMO, but sadly, it's just another tactic used to fool people into thinking they're doing something worthwhile here. I'd like to hear Clist speak out and say that they're shutting Adult down because they were forced to, but that the issue still remains and, if anything, having it publicly available on Craigslist probably made the "industry" safer.

wmeredith 16y ago
Yes, there's an Atlas Shrugged correlation there. However, I'm pretty sure that a governing body forcing the oppressed to make erroneous public statements on their behalf has been a non-fiction occurrence for far longer than Atlas Shrugged has been in print.
- sabat 16y ago
  In this context, Rand was merely acting as a reporter.
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
tptacek 16y ago
Give me a break. craiglist picked a fight. They disabled the adult ads, and replaced them with a "fuck you" to the state AG's. They have every right to do that, and I'm glad they did; it's more honest that way. However, nobody has any business feigning outrage that the AG's then questioned their step. Most of the time, when people stamp "censored" over content on their site, they do in fact intend to put it back. You can break out the Ayn Rand when someone passes a law requiring craigslist to genuflect, instead of just issuing a sharply worded press release in an ongoing pissing match.
- joe_the_user 16y ago
  "They have every right to do that, and I'm glad they did; it's more honest that way. However, nobody has any business feigning outrage that the AG's then questioned their step." Well, unless you're outraged the AG ever began their campaign to begin with. Then you might feel outrage that they're following it to its conclusion. I suppose you have a point that claim should have been "AG's campaign stays as stupid as it ever was ..."

tptacek 16y ago

Is Blumenthal's crusade against craigslist a shameless pandering PR stunt from a (popular) politician running for higher office? Yes. Is the underlying concern nonsensical? No. Did craigslist take a real step to ameliorate the concern of AG's around the country over trafficking ads? Yes. Did craigslist eliminate trafficking ads (and ads for prostitution in general) from the site? No. Is the Internet changing the game for the illicit sex industry? Yes. Is craigslist assuming a central role in that transformation? Yes. Is craiglist actively pursuing that role? Probably not. Is it fair that they're bearing the brunt of public outrage over the Internet's role in making the illicit sex market more efficient? I don't know. Maybe. Articles taking the piss out of CT Gov candidate Blumenthal for making a campaign issue out of craigslist: peachy keen. Articles suggesting that public outrage against craiglist is intrinsically wrong, or articles that don't say that directly but form arguments clearly premised on that notion: not so great.

jobu 16y ago
Going after Craigslist over the adult content was a short sighted political move that will make it harder to fight prostitution in the long run. To some extent it's like the music labels going after napster. This eliminates the largest network (and the easiest one for authorities to monitor), and pushes the whole internet sex economy further underground.
- tptacek 16y ago
  I know that's the talking point about prostitution, but I don't automatically agree with it. If targeting craigslist is part of a broader crackdown on the online sex trade, where craigslist is forced to adopt a more conservative editorial posture and other sites are forced out of business completely, then the argument doesn't stand. People talk as if the sex trade can go completely underground, as if it's only exposed to the public eye through the benevolent lens of craiglist. Of course that's not true. Even among the worst offenders, the mafia-based sex slave traffickers, it's still a business, and it still needs customer acquisition mechanisms.
  - joe_the_user 16y ago

ww520 16y ago

The tech industry seriously needs to organize to have a bigger political clout.

tptacek 16y ago
And you think craiglist prostitution ads are the rallying point for that?
- ww520 16y ago
  While I agree that the current Craiglist's predicament is unpleasant, what is it about that "First they came for ..." thing?
  - tptacek 16y ago
    You mean, "First they came for the sex traffickers, and I said nothing, because I agreed that the sex trade is bad and that making it more expensive and riskier was a worthy use of my tax dollars"? Next you'll tell me that they're coming for the car stereo fences.
    - ww520 16y ago
      First they came for Craiglist's adult section where some member submitted content were objectionable. Next they come for the gun forum where some member submitted content are objectionable. Next they come for Reddit where some member submitted pictures are objectionable. Next they come for Hacker News because someone posts detail in hacking into DOD. Craiglist has broken no law. The politicians are going on a moral crusade for their benefit. They pick on the geeks because well back in school they were the easy targets.
      - tptacek 16y ago
        These aren't objectionable pictures. These aren't objectionable message board posts. These are advertisements for overtly criminal activities. You have to make a real argument. And speaking as one of the geekier people on HN, please spare me the geek exceptionalism.

oiuygtfrtghyju 16y ago

Isn't it time to go after the real enemy? Corning make almost all the glass that transmits all this digital pornography around the world. Isn't it time somebody acted to stop these monsters profiting from the evil trade in dense wavelength division multiplexing?

tedunangst 16y ago

In other news, the Mercury News website was obviously hacked. It's a well known impossibility for "old media" to publish anything supportive of craigslist.