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Apple SIM
- forcer 9y agowhy its working only on iPad and not on iPhone?
- asclepi 9y agoiPhones are generally sold through carriers with the phone locked to that specific carrier. The main point of the Apple SIM - the ability to switch between short-term mobile internet contracts across multiple carriers - would be pretty moot in this scenario. Note that the Apple SIM isn't new, nor tied to the release of the new iPad model today. It's been around since at least 2014. I remember going to an Apple Store back then to pick one up. The associate at first didn't know what I was talking about but eventually found them somewhere stashed in the back-office.
- toomuchtodo 9y agoCould a virtual SIM not replace physical SIMs, reducing the friction of switching providers? It seems we’re just waiting on carriers to catch up to the idea at the moment. https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/virtual-sim/11572/ https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/virtual-sim/11572/
- ucaetano 9y agoGoogle already does it with Project Fi + Pixel. https://www.androidcentral.com/using-project-fi-pixel-2s-esim-amazing https://www.androidcentral.com/using-project-fi-pixel-2s-esi...
- dudus 9y agoI came here to say this. I bought a Pixel 2 XL for my wife last year and there was an option to use SIM-less with Project Fi. I was confused at first and went with it, and it worked. Then I just stored the old SIM. To be honest I don't quite remember how was the process but I remember it was pretty easy to setup.
- asclepi 9y agoYes, this will be the future. I believe the latest iPad Pro models have a virtual Apple SIM embedded. The Apple Watch Series 3 also has a virtual SIM. They will eventually appear in phones as well.
- yincrash 9y agoThe standard is called eSIM, and it is in at least one phone. https://www.theverge.com/2017/10/4/16424740/google-pixel-2-xl-esim-technology-project-fi-first-ever https://www.theverge.com/2017/10/4/16424740/google-pixel-2-x...
- electricslpnsld 9y ago> iPhones are generally sold through carriers This used to be true but it doesn't save you money now to buy an iPhone attached to a carrier plan. Apple will even sell you a carrier-free iPhone [1]. I would love an Apple SIM for travel to Canada, etc. [1] https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-iphone/iphone-x#00 https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-iphone/iphone-x#00
- Cyph0n 9y agoCan you pay for an unlocked iPhone in installments? I'm not prepared to throw down the price upfront honestly.
- hprotagonist 9y agotechnically yes, because verizon got sued into being required to sell unlocked phones.
- votepaunchy 9y agoDevice locking was prohibited by the FCC for Block C (700 MHz): > (e)Handset locking prohibited. No licensee may disable features on handsets it provides to customers, to the extent such features are compliant with the licensee's standards pursuant to paragraph (b)of this section, nor configure handsets it provides to prohibit use of such handsets on other providers' networks. https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/27.16 https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/27.16
- piptastic 9y agoYes, you can buy an unlocked Phone from Apple and use the financing available on their website.
- smnrchrds 9y agoNot sure about the US, but here in Canada, all phones come unlocked by law [1]. iPhones sold through carriers still come with 2-year contracts and installments, similar to how they were before the unlocking regulation went into effect. [1] https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/phone/mobile/code.htm https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/phone/mobile/code.htm
- lloeki 9y ago> iPhones are generally sold through carriers with the phone locked to that specific carrier. Maybe in the U.S. Much less so over here.
- a_t48 9y agoI wonder how the rates compare to Google Fi? (Which is also compatible with iPad, even if it isn't advertized).
- Jtsummers 9y agoSeems you select a carrier so it's whatever their rates are. The Apple SIM just allows you to use the same SIM rather than swapping out SIM cards for each carrier you might want to use (more useful when traveling internationally, I imagine, than when staying in one country).
- odonnellryan 9y agoIn case anyone is curious, there's a list of compatible devices on this page: https://support.google.com/fi/answer/6330195?hl=en https://support.google.com/fi/answer/6330195?hl=en I didn't know this was a thing. Is it new?
- marzell 9y agoFYI on Fi there are many devices that seem to work well, even if they aren't on the official list of supported devices. Fi also supports additional devices using a data-only SIM, which doesn't cost any extra except for the per-GB data rates. No $15 surcharge just for the ability to use other devices, etc. Same thing with tethering. edit: also, this isn't exactly new, Google Fi was introduced in October 2016. I've been using it since then with no problems. In fact, I once received a reimbursement for a short outage that I hadn't even realized happened.
- votepaunchy 9y agoThere's no extra charge for a data-only SIM but you are required to have a primary device which costs $20 (plus $10/GB). Would be great to offer this to customers on other carriers.
- odonnellryan 9y agoWhen I realized this I ordered one right away.
- Mononokay 9y agoThe fact that there are two T-Mobile logos on that page side-by-side bugs me. Irrationally so.
- kylec 9y agoThis isn't new, the Apple SIM has been around since 2014: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_SIM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_SIM
- paxys 9y agoAnd you have been able to purchase a data plan straight from your iPad even before Apple SIM was officially a thing.
- 2muchcoffeeman 9y agoA new iPad revision got released. So maybe someone just noticed Apple SIM.
- morganvachon 9y agoAnd it still doesn't work properly with every carrier. I bought a new, unlocked iPad Mini 4 that came with the Apple SIM, and no carrier would activate it. I finally got it working on Ting after getting one of Ting's SIM cards and lots of back-and-forth between Ting and Apple Support.
- jboles 9y agoI think it is only intended to work with Apple’s partner carriers. I wanted to add my iPad to my AT&T data service and I could not use the built in SIM. Instead AT&T sent one for free. The iPad has a separate SIM slot and I imagine it will have to until the built in SIM is truly universal.
- josteink 9y ago> The iPad has a separate SIM slot and I imagine it will have to until the built in SIM is truly universal. Or you know... In the rest of the world, people actually ask for SIM cards, physical cards, because they are portable, and 100% certifiably decouples your device from your cellular provider. Why on earth would I have something hidden inside... Which may or may not be interoperable... Which I cannot take and use with other devices if I need to? Which I cannot easily replace with a new one, from any carrier in the world?
- mrnobody_67 9y agotoo bad this doesn't work in iPhones. I have 15+ international SIM cards. Slightly inconvenient to have to buy one for each country I visit to avoid surprise roaming charges.
- Jtsummers 9y agoGoogle's Project Fi does work in iPhones (if they're unlocked) when you travel internationally. It's not quite as effective as using a Nexus (now Pixel) device (they switch between carriers more effectively, they're designed to), but it does work. Can get you down to one SIM if you don't mind not having a local-to-the-country phone number. EDIT: To qualify this, it's more useful if your primary country is the US.
- untog 9y ago> if you don't mind not having a local-to-the-country phone number This is actually one of my big pain points with SIM-juggling while travelling. iMessage would work great, except for the fact that Apple unregisters your US number and registers your new SIM number in its place. Which makes total sense on a technical level, but is irritating in practise.
- oarsinsync 9y agoMy slightly expensive hack-around is to have a second travel iPhone, and tether my primary phone to that when I travel. I used to swap SIM cards around so that my primary SIM ended up in my travel phone, and my region-specific SIM ended up in my primary phone, but ultimately that became more hassle than it was worth, and tethering was a less painful solution with the prevalence of wifi everywhere in most places I visit.
- radicaldreamer 9y agoThis isn’t new and it’s fairly expensive compared to Google Fi or T-Mobile. Might be worth it for customers in some countries but US users have much better choices for roaming internationally.
- hughes 9y agoWhere did you find pricing information? Google Fi is already outrageously expensive for data at $10/GB
- AaronFriel 9y agoIt's unlimited after $60 (6GB) now, and even before then my bills were lower on Fi than they ever were even on family plans before that.
- shkkmo 9y agoFi plans are only "outrageously expensive" if you are comparing them against other countries.
- hughes 9y agoI was pretty regularly hitting the $80 cap until I switched to Cricket for their $40 unlimited deal. If they're literally charging double compared to the domestic competition, it's pretty outrageous.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- shkkmo 9y agoExcept that you need to compare against the Cricket $60 unlimited deal that offers tethering and throttles it at 6GB. Even then they aren't quite on par since you don't have the 10 free data sim cards, free international data, and ability to make and receive calls from any device that has hangouts installed. Google Fi is also flexible in that you don't have to spend $80 a month if you are using less. When I don't have to do a bunch of tethering for work, I usually spend $30 - $40 a month total. Thus Google Fi cheaper for a variety of use cases. Different plans/carriers are cheaper for different use cases. Just because a carrier other than Google Fi is cheaper for your use case doesn't make Google Fi outrageously expensive.
- trisimix 9y agoNice to see no version on that list but that stuffs been out forever
- mvid 9y agoI'm surprised Apple has created a proper Fi competitor yet. It would fit so well into their premium brand of "your iPhone works the moment you step off the plane wherever your amazing life takes you". They wouldn't have their UX tied to cell providers, who are some of the most unpleasant entities to interact with. They would probably be able to lean further into their personal security stance, by fully obfuscating the user from the provider. They have the brand leverage to do it, I'm hoping this is a stepping stone.
- chatmasta 9y agoProbably because they’re making plenty of money from their existing relationships with carriers. There’s no reason for Apple to vertically integrate when they’re already the dominant player in their carrier relationships.
- vwadhwani 9y agoGoogle relies heavily on advertising revenue so needs to interject any time there's a threat to that. Doesn't matter if it's a web browser that defaults to bing or an ISP that interjects their own ads. On the other hand, Apple relies heavily on hardware sales for revenue.
- jonlucc 9y agoIf you go into any of the major retailers in the US, the iPhone is already the first-class device. Why would they want to be in the messy business of running a carrier, likely dependent on the partners they'd then be screwing over, while they built their own network from the ground up. On the other hand, maybe they'd just purchase Sprint or Verizon.
- kodablah 9y ago> Why would they want to be in the messy business of running a carrier Does Fi run the carrier? I thought it used existing carriers and just supported seamless transition between them (and wifi). Regardless, the motivation would be to get that market they're missing that doesn't use one of the big 4. Granted Apple has never catered to that market, so not sure why they would now (it'd actually be detrimental to them IMO). EDIT: Oh, and to the GP's point, seamless international use of your phone is a premium feature that might be valuable to customers. You could easily say "why do ____, they are already considered first class" for any new feature.
- oneplane 9y agoNice to see SoftBank on that page, probably means SoC makers can simply get the IP from them when getting other parts like an ARM core etc. Makes it a whole lot easier to just get a virtual SIM in your device.
- zokier 9y agoProbably means > On October 1, 2006, Vodafone Japan changed its corporate name, mobile phone brand name, and its mobile phone domain name to SoftBank Mobile, SoftBank, and [mb.softbank.jp], respectively and > SoftBank Mobile was the only official carrier of the iPhone in Japan until the release of iPhone 4S in 2011 when it became available on au by KDDI as well https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SoftBank_Group https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SoftBank_Group Oh, and SoftBank also happens to own Sprint, although that probably is unrelated here.
- oneplane 9y agoAh, so SoftBank Group is not just the ARM guys. Makes a different kind of sense now.
- cup-of-tea 9y agoFor some reason I instantly noticed the map is showing a park in Lyon. Does that have any significance? (Of course, they should have used openstreetmap https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/45.7790/4.8529 https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/45.7790/4.8529)
- sebastianavina 9y agoyeah, its steve jobs sending clues from his grave. Go there and dig under the first thing that looks like an apple for the next hint for the steve-treasure
- Thriptic 9y agoIs it possible to purchase a dongle for ipad which will let you pop in a sim and support this function?
- codq 9y agoA 'cellular dongle' would be a dream come true.
- tomcooks 9y agoNot really sure, but isn't it what 4g usp modems are for?
- Rjevski 9y agoWell you can use the Wi-Fi based modems/dongles/routers/whatever they call it that basically connect to the cellular network and create a Wi-Fi network you can connect your iPad to (or anything else really). A bit annoying given that it's one extra device to carry around and charge but if a "dongle" is what you want then I think it's the best solution.
- blhack 9y agoI've always wished that apple would offer this in the macbook pros. A laptop that doesn't have to tether, but just carries its own internet connection with it would be really nice.
- Kuraj 9y agoI'm currently looking at the Surface Pro LTE for this very reason.
- swiley 9y agoI know many thinkpads have an empty bay with a minipci connector that you can put modems in which do just that. I don't know why things like that aren't popular, I guess it looks "ugly?"
- philg_jr 9y agoI have an X270 with an LTE card. I've also helped set up a 3rd and 4th-gen X1 Carbon with an LTE card for a friend. I know Dell also offers LTE antennas in some of their higher-end Latitude laptops.
- megy 9y agoBecause a tiny portion of people would use it. Who wants to pay an extra monthly cost on their machine? The only people who would really do this are ones where it is covered by work.
- blhack 9y agoDo you mean the monthly cost of the data? I would totally do this, it's a few dollars to add on to my verizon plan, and something I already pay for for my hotspot.
- josteink 9y ago> Who wants to pay an extra monthly cost on their machine? It's not an extra cost when you get a twin-SIM for your regular subscription. You obviously have to pay extra to have the modem though. Source: Owner of Thinkpad Carbon X1 with built in 4G-moden and twin-SIM from my cellular provider.
- _RPM 9y agoWhatever you do, do not purchase any device from AT&T. You will be locked in to GSM only networks.
- jjtheblunt 9y agoHuh? LTE on AT&T has been a thing for a very long time, and it's not GSM.
- _RPM 9y agoI bought an iPhone 7 from AT&T, and the device is not compatible across the major carriers.
- _acme 9y agoYou're not using the term 'GSM' correctly. You mean to say that your device is locked to AT&T, not that it is 'GSM'-only.
- _RPM 9y agoActually, you’re wrong. Att sells an iPhone that is not compatible with CDMA networks. Trust me bud, I’ve done all the research. Apple sells their devices with the ability to use any of the 4 carriers.
- SkeptinenSpede5 9y agoNever.. I would give APPLE full rights to broke my privacy.
- tracker1 9y agoUnfortunately, when I go on road trips (mostly western US), there are a LOT of areas that only Verizon seems to have coverage. I've used most of the other carriers at one time or another, but I've been with Verizon for about 2 years now as I just got tired of not having connectivity when traveling inside the country.
- josteink 9y agoHow is this better than simply having... A SIM-card in your phone or tablet? A SIM-card is something you can swap and replace in less than 30 seconds, and 100% decouples your device from your cellular provider. The way things should be. It's hardware so it's portable. It's standardized so it's interoperable and works with all equipment, from all vendors. Why does Apple need to re-invent this? Why would I want to replace something 1. which works, 2. is industry standard and 3. has proven itself for more than two decades... With something which is 1. not industry-standard but Apple-only and 2. not proven? What on earth would compel anyone to make such a stupid trade-off? How stupid would you have to be to think this is a good thing?
- singularity2001 9y agoit might be helpful if you go abroad and your roaming options suck. otherwise agree. in new iPad it's not builtin, that's good.
- hjnilsson 9y agoHow is having a sim card better than simply having... free access to any carrier? A SIM-card is something you need to wait to arrive in snail mail. When going abroad you need to order one ahead of time to get a good price. Switching requires weeks of waiting for new cards to arrive, or going to a store. If you lose your device you need to wait for a replacement. Why would anyone want to use such an antediluvian method? Why would I want to use something which 1. needs me to remember/write down weird codes 2. doesn't work internationally without exorbitant fees and workarounds 3. is as old as VGA connectors. What on earth would compel anyone to make such a stupid trade-off? How stupid would you have to be to think this is a good thing? PS. Just making a point here, it's not all bad like you're making it out to be, and the dismissive tone muddles the problem. It surprises me that the resistance to new technical solutions to problems is so endorsed here on Hacker News of all places.
- gpderetta 9y agoBecause it works. Worse is better.
- 9y ago