11 ms·

FedEx reserves 20 Tesla Semi all-electric big rig trucks

167 points by ExcelSaga 9y ago

lunchbreak 9y ago
The biggest issue with electric semis is that trucks have a maximum weight limit, and the battery is much heavier than fuel for the same mileage. As much as you may get the same range, if you can't carry as much cargo, you lose the benefits of price per mile. Note that Tesla didn't mention the weight of the battery when announcing the truck. (Though I assume they believe they can get it even lighter before they release production models)
- paranoidrobot 9y ago
  Do you think Fedex (20), Walmart (15), Anheuser-Busch (40), Pepsico (100), and UPS (125) would have put down money to buy hundreds of these without checking if they can actually carry a load? They're being rated to carry a 80,000lb load at highway speeds for 500 miles - clearly the weight distribution isn't a problem. The other thing you're forgetting is that it's not a battery vs fuel weight you need to compare it's battery+motor vs engine+transmission+gearbox+fuel+urea+etc. There's so much less that needs to be in an electric truck.
  - lunchbreak 9y ago
    True points - though I would think for at least FedEx and UPS carry significant amount of light cargo in some trucks (boxes with empty space around the actual contents, and other lighter contents) compared to other trucking groups which carry almost solid cargo (a truck carrying sugar for example). Pepsi specifically is an interesting one - because I assume that most of the cargo space is liquid, though I wonder how much empty space is in their cargo areas due to round bottles
  - femidav 9y ago
    Battery alone (for 500-miles range) will weight more than double of engine+transmission+gearbox+fuel of 2000-miles range ICE semi.
aviv 9y ago
FOMO is a powerful incentive.
- akhatri_aus 9y ago
  What exactly do you miss out on, going forward its only likely these trucks will be cheaper and more in abundance. If anything its better to wait.
  - wpietri 9y ago
    Experience. It's the same reason I'll try out a new language on a throwaway prototype: real experience helps you think more clearly about the future.
  - aviv 9y ago
    PR, or lack thereof, when these ship.
    - mygo 9y ago
      FedEx could be delivering my packages by horse as far as I'm concerned so long as they arrive on time
  - r00fus 9y ago
    Except your competition may get a lock on the supply contract because they were early-adopters. Or they figure out how Tesla is doing it, and risk competing with Tesla, outcompeting you. Companies that don't innovate better be ready to be disrupted.
rawrmaan 9y ago
It's becoming clearer and clearer that the main things preventing total EV takeover are lack of good products on the market and production capacity. I'm excited to hopefully watch both of these problems erode in the next 5 years. Really really ready to stop breathing fossil fuels all day every day in the city.
- d--b 9y ago
  And sound!
  - yorby 9y ago
    artificial sounds (because they are too quiet)
    - Guereric 9y ago
      From my understanding, the requirement for artificial sounds when reversing already exists for big trucks and haulers, regardless of the type of engine inside, for the safety of pedestrians. It's the quietness of small electric vehicles, like cars and SUVs, that prompted the requirement in consumer vehicles.
- yorby 9y ago
  as long as they are not powered by coal power plants... (but I guess that those are typically in poor neighborhoods)
  - p1necone 9y ago
    It's still a decent improvement if they are - one big coal plant running at relatively constant speed is much more efficient than an equivalent number of individual petrol engines in cars afaik.
    - maliker 9y ago
      More energy efficient, yes. But resulting more CO2 and SOx and NOx emissions even with scrubbers.
modeless 9y ago
How is Tesla getting all these companies to put out press releases announcing that they are buying Tesla's products? Brilliant marketing. Maybe they offer discounts?
- plusbryan 9y ago
  They clearly get as much value out of it as Tesla. Look investors, we're an innovative company too! When was the last time you saw a positive press cycle about FedEx on their own?
- maxxxxx 9y ago
  Tesla is the cool thing right now. It's the same thing as saying they use AI for something. Good PR.
- btian 9y ago
  Judging by past Tesla products, no discounts for pre-ordering.
- notatoad 9y ago
  the chance to put out one of these press releases definitely factors into the purchasing decision for these companies. They're buying good PR almost as much as they're buying trucks.
  - rconti 9y ago
    And no doubt they have every escape clause in history in their contract. Great marketing for both companies, no risk for FedEx, and Tesla probably values the PR as much as the money at this point. They're not getting paid unless and until they can actually deliver the trucks, so why not get good press in the meantime?
    - ams6110 9y ago
      Twenty trucks is really nothing for a company like FedEx. As the article noted, this is a very small pilot project for them.
tptacek 9y ago
FedEx had over 70,000 trucks 15 years ago. Obviously most of them aren't long-haul, but you'd want to know what percentage of the FedEx fleet this represented to judge how much the impact of this is about PR versus operations.
- ams6110 9y ago
  Local delivery of palletized freight still requires a semi truck in most cases. That's where I would see these being used.
- BinaryIdiot 9y ago
  Total isn't a good number to compare against. The number of trucks they buy _per year_ would be a better number. Even if the Tesla semi is the end all, best semi in the world by orders of magnitude, they still wouldn't be replacing an entire fleet in a year.
amluto 9y ago
I would love to see Tesla demonstrate that their Superchargers are anywhere near super enough. A couple days ago, I supercharged at the “120 kW” Tesla factory in Fremont. For quite a few minutes, I got 23kW. After a while, it went up to 50kW or so. I checked the other car sharing my charger, and the total was well under 120kW. I suspect the station has an overall power limit. Also, there was a line. For trucks, you need something like a megawatt to recharge on a lunch break, and a line blows the whole thing up.
- beisner 9y ago
  Solar. Freakin. Roadways.
  - freehunter 9y ago
    Have you seen the roads through most of the country? We can't keep tar and stone in decent condition, no way we'd keep those solar panels running.
    - beisner 9y ago
      Of course, it was a reference to a viral video a few years back with the same title. A joke, if you will.
      - matte_black 9y ago
        Would have been a hit on Reddit.
    - seanmcdirmid 9y ago
      These are like two different problems, though probably compounding. Allowing vehicle charging while moving is an interesting problem, regardless of where the power comes from (well, it’s way easier if it’s attsched to the truck).
      - notatoad 9y ago
notthegov 9y ago
Last week, a few super geniuses in SF were debating Tesla's valuation. This was after the last night of Token Fest. I've only been in SF since August but what it has taught me is there are super brilliant people in this world. So smart that I think it's possible, dare I say probable, that an amazing infinite world is on the horizon. Elon's unfathomable intellect and ability to execute is, in fact, a normal basic expression of the human mind. He's just synchronized perfectly, like a superconductor, with the invariant object at the center of the Universe. What is that object? Total information in hyperspace. Here is a video I found 9-years ago that explains it well- https://youtu.be/r9UsvGo2ImU https://youtu.be/r9UsvGo2ImU Barack Obama recently said during a speech in Japan that he hopes to create a million young Barack Obamas. I agree with him -- I think the principles that make a person great are fundamental, universal and within everyone's reach. Elon is proof that anything is possible. Here's to a million future Elons, Baracks and, most importantly, a million new Satoshis. Smart, cypherpunk minded super geniuses conspiring without credit in a great work to build a better world.
Proven 9y ago
Sorry for their loss... Preordering from a soon to be bankrupt company isn’t a great business idea. But then again the Fed is always there to rescue everyone. It’d be hilarious if Trump bailed out Tesla. Trump too his his Solyndra or whatever that crony piece of shot company that Obama rescued was called.
suspectdoubloon 9y ago
Those trucks look like beluga whales. I wonder if that's what their inspiration for the design was.

167 points by ExcelSaga 9y ago

The biggest issue with electric semis is that trucks have a maximum weight limit, and the battery is much heavier than fuel for the same mileage. As much as you may get the same range, if you can't carry as much cargo, you lose the benefits of price per mile. Note that Tesla didn't mention the weight of the battery when announcing the truck. (Though I assume they believe they can get it even lighter before they release production models)

paranoidrobot 9y ago
Do you think Fedex (20), Walmart (15), Anheuser-Busch (40), Pepsico (100), and UPS (125) would have put down money to buy hundreds of these without checking if they can actually carry a load? They're being rated to carry a 80,000lb load at highway speeds for 500 miles - clearly the weight distribution isn't a problem. The other thing you're forgetting is that it's not a battery vs fuel weight you need to compare it's battery+motor vs engine+transmission+gearbox+fuel+urea+etc. There's so much less that needs to be in an electric truck.
- lunchbreak 9y ago
  True points - though I would think for at least FedEx and UPS carry significant amount of light cargo in some trucks (boxes with empty space around the actual contents, and other lighter contents) compared to other trucking groups which carry almost solid cargo (a truck carrying sugar for example). Pepsi specifically is an interesting one - because I assume that most of the cargo space is liquid, though I wonder how much empty space is in their cargo areas due to round bottles
- femidav 9y ago
  Battery alone (for 500-miles range) will weight more than double of engine+transmission+gearbox+fuel of 2000-miles range ICE semi.

aviv 9y ago

FOMO is a powerful incentive.

akhatri_aus 9y ago
What exactly do you miss out on, going forward its only likely these trucks will be cheaper and more in abundance. If anything its better to wait.
- wpietri 9y ago
  Experience. It's the same reason I'll try out a new language on a throwaway prototype: real experience helps you think more clearly about the future.
- aviv 9y ago
  PR, or lack thereof, when these ship.
  - mygo 9y ago
    FedEx could be delivering my packages by horse as far as I'm concerned so long as they arrive on time
- r00fus 9y ago
  Except your competition may get a lock on the supply contract because they were early-adopters. Or they figure out how Tesla is doing it, and risk competing with Tesla, outcompeting you. Companies that don't innovate better be ready to be disrupted.

rawrmaan 9y ago

It's becoming clearer and clearer that the main things preventing total EV takeover are lack of good products on the market and production capacity. I'm excited to hopefully watch both of these problems erode in the next 5 years. Really really ready to stop breathing fossil fuels all day every day in the city.

d--b 9y ago
And sound!
- yorby 9y ago
  artificial sounds (because they are too quiet)
  - Guereric 9y ago
    From my understanding, the requirement for artificial sounds when reversing already exists for big trucks and haulers, regardless of the type of engine inside, for the safety of pedestrians. It's the quietness of small electric vehicles, like cars and SUVs, that prompted the requirement in consumer vehicles.
yorby 9y ago
as long as they are not powered by coal power plants... (but I guess that those are typically in poor neighborhoods)
- p1necone 9y ago
  It's still a decent improvement if they are - one big coal plant running at relatively constant speed is much more efficient than an equivalent number of individual petrol engines in cars afaik.
  - maliker 9y ago
    More energy efficient, yes. But resulting more CO2 and SOx and NOx emissions even with scrubbers.

modeless 9y ago

How is Tesla getting all these companies to put out press releases announcing that they are buying Tesla's products? Brilliant marketing. Maybe they offer discounts?

plusbryan 9y ago
They clearly get as much value out of it as Tesla. Look investors, we're an innovative company too! When was the last time you saw a positive press cycle about FedEx on their own?
maxxxxx 9y ago
Tesla is the cool thing right now. It's the same thing as saying they use AI for something. Good PR.
btian 9y ago
Judging by past Tesla products, no discounts for pre-ordering.
notatoad 9y ago
the chance to put out one of these press releases definitely factors into the purchasing decision for these companies. They're buying good PR almost as much as they're buying trucks.
- rconti 9y ago
  And no doubt they have every escape clause in history in their contract. Great marketing for both companies, no risk for FedEx, and Tesla probably values the PR as much as the money at this point. They're not getting paid unless and until they can actually deliver the trucks, so why not get good press in the meantime?
  - ams6110 9y ago
    Twenty trucks is really nothing for a company like FedEx. As the article noted, this is a very small pilot project for them.

tptacek 9y ago

FedEx had over 70,000 trucks 15 years ago. Obviously most of them aren't long-haul, but you'd want to know what percentage of the FedEx fleet this represented to judge how much the impact of this is about PR versus operations.

ams6110 9y ago
Local delivery of palletized freight still requires a semi truck in most cases. That's where I would see these being used.
BinaryIdiot 9y ago
Total isn't a good number to compare against. The number of trucks they buy _per year_ would be a better number. Even if the Tesla semi is the end all, best semi in the world by orders of magnitude, they still wouldn't be replacing an entire fleet in a year.

amluto 9y ago

I would love to see Tesla demonstrate that their Superchargers are anywhere near super enough. A couple days ago, I supercharged at the “120 kW” Tesla factory in Fremont. For quite a few minutes, I got 23kW. After a while, it went up to 50kW or so. I checked the other car sharing my charger, and the total was well under 120kW. I suspect the station has an overall power limit. Also, there was a line. For trucks, you need something like a megawatt to recharge on a lunch break, and a line blows the whole thing up.

beisner 9y ago
Solar. Freakin. Roadways.
- freehunter 9y ago
  Have you seen the roads through most of the country? We can't keep tar and stone in decent condition, no way we'd keep those solar panels running.
  - beisner 9y ago
    Of course, it was a reference to a viral video a few years back with the same title. A joke, if you will.
    - matte_black 9y ago
      Would have been a hit on Reddit.
  - seanmcdirmid 9y ago
    These are like two different problems, though probably compounding. Allowing vehicle charging while moving is an interesting problem, regardless of where the power comes from (well, it’s way easier if it’s attsched to the truck).
    - notatoad 9y ago

notthegov 9y ago

Last week, a few super geniuses in SF were debating Tesla's valuation. This was after the last night of Token Fest. I've only been in SF since August but what it has taught me is there are super brilliant people in this world. So smart that I think it's possible, dare I say probable, that an amazing infinite world is on the horizon. Elon's unfathomable intellect and ability to execute is, in fact, a normal basic expression of the human mind. He's just synchronized perfectly, like a superconductor, with the invariant object at the center of the Universe. What is that object? Total information in hyperspace. Here is a video I found 9-years ago that explains it well- https://youtu.be/r9UsvGo2ImU https://youtu.be/r9UsvGo2ImU Barack Obama recently said during a speech in Japan that he hopes to create a million young Barack Obamas. I agree with him -- I think the principles that make a person great are fundamental, universal and within everyone's reach. Elon is proof that anything is possible. Here's to a million future Elons, Baracks and, most importantly, a million new Satoshis. Smart, cypherpunk minded super geniuses conspiring without credit in a great work to build a better world.

Proven 9y ago

Sorry for their loss... Preordering from a soon to be bankrupt company isn’t a great business idea. But then again the Fed is always there to rescue everyone. It’d be hilarious if Trump bailed out Tesla. Trump too his his Solyndra or whatever that crony piece of shot company that Obama rescued was called.

suspectdoubloon 9y ago

Those trucks look like beluga whales. I wonder if that's what their inspiration for the design was.