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This is what Taleb has said for years. Wealth leads to education. Education does not necessarily, or even commonly, lead to wealth. If you gain wealth but do n

This is what Taleb has said for years. Wealth leads to education. Education does not necessarily, or even commonly, lead to wealth. If you gain wealth but do not come from an aristocratic or "respected family in society" background, the way to gain prestige is by paying for education for yourself or your children. Buying your kids a degree is the modern day equivalent of buying a venal office in 1500's France or Spain. (Except Venal offices probably guaranteed a little more ROI in addition to the status!) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venal_office https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venal_office

f1notformula1 9y ago
Agreed with this as well as the GP comment. Personally I think this also has the unfortunate side-effect of college's turning into de-facto gatekeepers to 'earned' status/success/wealth.
motohagiography 9y ago
I like to summarize a particular coastal elitist view as, "Let them eat college."
- dhimes 9y ago
  What is a "coastal elitist?" I've never heard that term. Since I live on the coast and have a few liberal friends, I know what a "coastal liberal" is. But "coastal elitist?" The only people I know who fit that bill are finance guys, and only a few at that.
  - OtterCoder 9y ago
    California and New England are so divorced from the concerns and ethos of the 'flyover' states that they may as well be on another planet. You may not think of yourself as elitist, but from the perspective of a Midwesterner, you almost certainly are.
    - moorhosj 9y ago
      “I don’t like to be put in a box and labeled. To prove I’m right, I’ll put a bunch of other people in a box and label them.”
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - dnomad 9y ago
      Yeah those damned coastal elites fighting for universal healthcare and more education and higher minimum wages. The reality is that the only real "elites" are these fantasists who've bought into this narrative and actually believe they are the "Real Americans (tm)." It's a childish delusion that is only sustainable by an even more delusional pride.
      - njarboe 9y ago
        If you just can't believe that a sane person could be against government enforced "universal healthcare, education, and higher minimum wages" you should expand your horizons a bit. These issues are not so clear cut in the details especially when thinking about long term solutions to problems.
        jjeaff 9y ago
        Exactly, and the biggest problem with these programs is that they are administered on a federal level. Some things that work well for high income coastal areas may not be ideal for the flyover states.
      - drdeca 9y ago
        I assume you mean elitists, not elites? There are certainly people who are elite, in one common sense or another.
      - dhimes 9y ago
        I agree that the rhetoric is harmful, but they do have a point and the "coasties" need to understand it if they want their political fortunes to change.
- erd0s 9y ago
  I liked it much more when elite meant you could hack Gibsons
adventured 9y ago
Some of that depends on how you want to define commonly. White and asian Americans have a near 40% chance of becoming millionaires with a graduate level education. Without a high school diploma, white Americans have a mere 1.7% chance of becoming a millionaire. A 20+ fold difference. "What Are Your Odds of Becoming a Millionaire?" https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-millionaire-odds/ https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-millionaire-odds/ "Bloomberg News asked economists at the Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis a question: Would it be possible to calculate the odds of being a millionaire for anyone in the U.S., based on age, education and race?" "According to the sample, a black person’s odds of being a millionaire increase from less than 1 percent if he or she doesn't complete high school to 6.7 percent with a graduate degree. White Americans without a high school diploma start out with slightly better chances—1.7 percent—that rapidly improve with more school: A graduate-level education increases their probability of amassing a net worth greater than $1 million to 37 percent."
- nosefrog 9y ago
  That's correlation, not necessarily causation.
  - adventured 9y ago
    No, it's very obvious causation. The variance is extreme, not subtle, and it shows dramatic improvement for all races. It moves upwards step by step with education attainment. Incomes similarly follow that path. Which is another way of saying, everything aligns. The income you can reach on average without a high school diploma, will radically implode your chances of ever being able to amass millionaire status. Need to save $50,000 to start a business? Good luck without a high school diploma. You're going to spend your life barely getting by, much less generating a surplus of savings. Want to become a millionaire via a mixture of 401k, company stock grants, savings, real-estate investment? You have a near zero shot at that without a high school diploma.
    - TheOtherHobbes 9y ago
      It's correlation. The cause is rationed access to the cultural - never mind the economic - resources needed to get into a graduate program. Success after the program is an effect - and partly down to luck, as the SA article suggests. Of course you'll have problems if you don't have a high school diploma. But by the time you've failed to get your diploma, the chances are excellent that your access to resources will have been severely constrained and rationed for your entire life, even if you start off with exceptional talents.

f1notformula1 9y ago

Agreed with this as well as the GP comment. Personally I think this also has the unfortunate side-effect of college's turning into de-facto gatekeepers to 'earned' status/success/wealth.

motohagiography 9y ago

I like to summarize a particular coastal elitist view as, "Let them eat college."

dhimes 9y ago
What is a "coastal elitist?" I've never heard that term. Since I live on the coast and have a few liberal friends, I know what a "coastal liberal" is. But "coastal elitist?" The only people I know who fit that bill are finance guys, and only a few at that.
- OtterCoder 9y ago
  California and New England are so divorced from the concerns and ethos of the 'flyover' states that they may as well be on another planet. You may not think of yourself as elitist, but from the perspective of a Midwesterner, you almost certainly are.
  - moorhosj 9y ago
    “I don’t like to be put in a box and labeled. To prove I’m right, I’ll put a bunch of other people in a box and label them.”
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - dnomad 9y ago
    Yeah those damned coastal elites fighting for universal healthcare and more education and higher minimum wages. The reality is that the only real "elites" are these fantasists who've bought into this narrative and actually believe they are the "Real Americans (tm)." It's a childish delusion that is only sustainable by an even more delusional pride.
    - njarboe 9y ago
      If you just can't believe that a sane person could be against government enforced "universal healthcare, education, and higher minimum wages" you should expand your horizons a bit. These issues are not so clear cut in the details especially when thinking about long term solutions to problems.
      - jjeaff 9y ago
        Exactly, and the biggest problem with these programs is that they are administered on a federal level. Some things that work well for high income coastal areas may not be ideal for the flyover states.
    - drdeca 9y ago
      I assume you mean elitists, not elites? There are certainly people who are elite, in one common sense or another.
    - dhimes 9y ago
      I agree that the rhetoric is harmful, but they do have a point and the "coasties" need to understand it if they want their political fortunes to change.
erd0s 9y ago
I liked it much more when elite meant you could hack Gibsons

adventured 9y ago

Some of that depends on how you want to define commonly. White and asian Americans have a near 40% chance of becoming millionaires with a graduate level education. Without a high school diploma, white Americans have a mere 1.7% chance of becoming a millionaire. A 20+ fold difference. "What Are Your Odds of Becoming a Millionaire?" https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-millionaire-odds/ https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-millionaire-odds/ "Bloomberg News asked economists at the Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis a question: Would it be possible to calculate the odds of being a millionaire for anyone in the U.S., based on age, education and race?" "According to the sample, a black person’s odds of being a millionaire increase from less than 1 percent if he or she doesn't complete high school to 6.7 percent with a graduate degree. White Americans without a high school diploma start out with slightly better chances—1.7 percent—that rapidly improve with more school: A graduate-level education increases their probability of amassing a net worth greater than $1 million to 37 percent."

nosefrog 9y ago
That's correlation, not necessarily causation.
- adventured 9y ago
  No, it's very obvious causation. The variance is extreme, not subtle, and it shows dramatic improvement for all races. It moves upwards step by step with education attainment. Incomes similarly follow that path. Which is another way of saying, everything aligns. The income you can reach on average without a high school diploma, will radically implode your chances of ever being able to amass millionaire status. Need to save $50,000 to start a business? Good luck without a high school diploma. You're going to spend your life barely getting by, much less generating a surplus of savings. Want to become a millionaire via a mixture of 401k, company stock grants, savings, real-estate investment? You have a near zero shot at that without a high school diploma.
  - TheOtherHobbes 9y ago
    It's correlation. The cause is rationed access to the cultural - never mind the economic - resources needed to get into a graduate program. Success after the program is an effect - and partly down to luck, as the SA article suggests. Of course you'll have problems if you don't have a high school diploma. But by the time you've failed to get your diploma, the chances are excellent that your access to resources will have been severely constrained and rationed for your entire life, even if you start off with exceptional talents.