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UPS is working on a fleet of 50 custom-built electric delivery trucks
- gt_ 9y agoRural American mail trucks are being replaced with barely-running junk minivans or really whatever can be purchased for the cheapest possible amount, probably the lease emission-aware solution I can think of. I’m not sure if these are workers providing their own transportation on contract or what, but I have seen some very sketchy vehicles delivering mail in multiple states around the US lately.
- sillyquiet 9y agorural route carriers, who are generally independent contractors working for the USPS to serve low volume highly-dispersed routes, (what used to be called star routes) have provided their own vehicles since forever.
- Spooky23 9y agoRural delivery has always been private vehicles. Carriers with spouses who have good jobs buy right hand drive Subaru’s. Everyone else drives some hooptie mobile. A lot of farm spouses used to do this gig. A moderately reliable car and a mechanically inclination is a key to success — cars need brakes every 3-6 weeks. USPS in general started buying more low bidder commercial vehicles because their package volumes have increased and the bespoke, cheap mail trucks were too small.
- toomuchtodo 9y agoSometimes a Model S will do: https://electrek.co/2016/02/25/mail-man-tesla-model-s/ https://electrek.co/2016/02/25/mail-man-tesla-model-s/
- ams6110 9y agoJeep used to sell a RHD Cherokee for delivery. I think, or maybe they were re-imported. But I've seen more than a few rural carriers driving these. Older Jeeps tend to rust out so there may not be many of them on the road these days.
- jws 9y agoThe USPS is in a pinch for vehicles. Their LLVs (the boxy mail truck, Long Life Vehicle) are at end of service life and being extended with costly maintenance. They need to hit alternative fuel targets with the replacements, electric looks like the win for most of the trucks, but they aren't there yet so they keep fixing things. It seems likely that stopgap vehicles are a reasonable answer. In my suburban area I'm seeing minivans where I used to see LLVs. There is a nice exposition of LLVs and the electric replacement option here: https://www.greatbusinessschools.org/usps-long-life-vehicle/ https://www.greatbusinessschools.org/usps-long-life-vehicle/
- reaperducer 9y agoFedEx has been using all-electric delivery vehicles in Chicago for at least five years.
- pjc50 9y agoIt's a pity that the UK used to have a huge fleet of low-speed electric doorstep delivery trucks, devoted to milk and groceries; but they were all phased out just prior to the internet era.
- Theodores 9y ago...along with postmen on bicycles. The Royal Mail moved to hand pushed trolleys for health and safety reasons. I imagine how good that bike fleet would be today if they added electric assistance. Sure bicycles might not be great for the final mile delivery of someone's Amazon order of 50litres of mineral water but that is the point.
- Jakob 9y agoGermany’s Post Office built and used ~2,000 custom-built electric delivery trucks in 2016 and deployed ~10.000 per year since 2017. UPS’s 50 seems very low for 2018 in comparison. One article about them: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-03-24/even-germany-s-post-office-is-building-an-electric-car https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-03-24/even-germ... They are called StreetScooter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StreetScooter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StreetScooter
- eventualhorizon 9y agoThis is a pilot run of 50. Think of them as prototypes. They will use what they learn from these prototypes to build a larger fleet. If they can make these purchase price competitive with their current trucks it will be a huge win.
- blattimwind 9y agoMeanwhile DHL/Streetscooter has already sold at least a few hundred of these.
- cptskippy 9y agoStreetscooter's volume is 4 cubic meters, a single UPS truck is closer to 20 cubic meters. Saying they should just use Streetscooters is like telling a family of 5 to use a motorcycle.
- oger 9y agoDifferent markets have different requirements. The DHL streetscooters are a massive success and are drawing interest / demand from many companies outside of DHL. They kickstarted this when no major manufacturer was willing / able to provide them a solution. The platform seems to be scalable and will be able to provide bigger hulls as well. And they are somehow battle tested now as not all was smooth sailing after launch - as could be expected. The whole white / brown / yellow van users will be the first to jump on EVs for many reasons. Remember that in Germany the federal administrative court will rule on (partial) bans of diesel vehicles in cities...
- madengr 9y agoRegeneration makes sense for frequent starts and stops, though delivery drivers often drive pretty aggressively, so I wonder if they will really get 100 miles range with inefficient driving?
- sdfasdasfsf 9y agoRegen cancells some (most?) of "aggressive driving" leaving speed (i.e. wind resistance) as the major killer of range. If they're deployed in thick urban areas that might not be an issue.
- sokoloff 9y agoWith aggressive driving, it's very easy to move braking loads into the friction brakes, making a 100% loss. Even when you cycle energy out of the battery and back in via regen, there are losses (to heat). Driving carefully in my LEAF, I can get 4.2-4.5 miles per kWh. Driving like an ass, it's easy to get that figure down under 2.
- athenot 9y agoAlso get 4.2 miles/KWh here. Maybe they will build in some kind of feedback for the trucks. The leaf has (had) the little trees that appear on the dashboard; maybe UPS can track this and issue a token incentive (free meal, bonus) at the end of the month if the delivery schedule is accomplished with less energy.
- greglindahl 9y agoWith "one pedal" driving, the feedback mechanism is having to touch the brake pedal or not.
- bdamm 9y agoAllotting a specific energy cost per mile and then paying the courier the surplus would solve that.
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- the-dude 9y agoIn The Netherlands, DHL uses bikes : http://www.dhl.com/en/press/releases/releases_2014/express/dhl_express_tests_the_use_of_bicycle_couriers_in_major_german_cities.html http://www.dhl.com/en/press/releases/releases_2014/express/d... I absolutely hate DHL as a recipient in NL, but this is pretty cool. They have other green vehicles too ( gas, electric ).
- tequila_shot 9y agohow is gas green?
- Spooky23 9y agoLow emissions. The alternative IC engine is typically diesel and spews lots of carcinogenic particles and compounds.
- the-dude 9y agoYou may have a point. It burns cleaner ( liquified natural gas ).
- epicureanideal 9y agoMaybe they meant natural gas (actual gas) rather than the liquid fuel we call "gas" as short for "gasoline".
- fastbeef 9y agoBiogas can be generated by fermenting sewage. All buses in Stockholm run on it, it burns extremely clean and is carbon-neutral since it utilizes carbon already in the present carbon cycle.
- devy 9y agoAll yeast strains produce some amount of hydrogen sulfide during fermentation as a by-product of sulfate processing. [1] You can barely call that biogas "burns extremely clean" with hydrogen sulfide in them, can you? [1]: https://beerandbrewing.com/off-flavor-of-the-week-sulfur/ https://beerandbrewing.com/off-flavor-of-the-week-sulfur/
- xxpor 9y agoHasn't UPS had all electric trucks in Manhattan for a while now?
- ryanianian 9y agoNot everywhere....There's a diesel UPS truck parked and idling across the street from me in midtown right now...
- rdl 9y agoI put in a preorder for the Workhorse W-15 pickup at CES (I'd been following them for a year). $1k fully-refundable, same as Model 3. http://workhorse.com/pickup/ http://workhorse.com/pickup/ 80 mile electric-only range is great, and it gets electric incentives (federal and more importantly for me, exempt from 40% import duty to Puerto Rico). The great thing as a pickup truck is it works as a stationary power source for tools, either from battery or generator. It's probably inferior to a Tacoma or something for offroad/etc. use, but is still adequate. Apparently their main market for these is the electric utility market, for outside plant maintenance/etc.
- slimsag 9y agoI didn't see this mentioned on their site anywhere / had to Google it. The truck is $52,000.. I can't imagine picking that over a Tundra for $31,120.
- seanmcdirmid 9y agoIncentives + taxes. I didn't know Puerto Rico normally had a 40% tax on vehicles! Kind of like how a Tesla Model S is economical in Norway given the taxes on the alternatives.
- rdl 9y agoThe Puerto Rico tax is...weird. It goes up highly progressively on value (I think 40% over 40k), it seems to be different for importer/dealer vs. individual, etc., but the 2015 electric exemption is nice. (But, in exchange via act 20+22: zero capital gains (LT/ST), zero tax on dividends, and consulting/services/export revenue are taxed at 0-4% -- all guaranteed through at least 2035. Seems to be becoming quite the hub for traders and cryptocurrency people, plus some saas/consultancy types, which becomes interesting to me for network effect reasons.)
- seanmcdirmid 9y ago> (But, in exchange via act 20+22: zero capital gains (LT/ST), zero tax on dividends, and consulting/services/export revenue are taxed at 0-4% -- all guaranteed through at least 2035. Seems to be becoming quite the hub for traders and cryptocurrency people, plus some saas/consultancy types, which becomes interesting to me for network effect reasons.) And in exchange for that, Puerto Rico is broke. But that is not a topic for here and now :)
- ams6110 9y agoUPS has an interesting approach to their trucks. They call them "cars" first of all, and they are a custom design. Nobody else can buy them, and when they wear out and they are done using them they crush them. I never really understood why that made sense, when all the other courier companies use Sprinters or some other standard vehicle. They must see it as a competitive advantage.
- MisterTea 9y agoThey destroy them for brand protection. See this comment: http://hankstruckforum.com/htforum/index.php?PHPSESSID=1e65be5c04719a6c095916ee9e50f0cf&topic=7583.msg58091#msg58091 http://hankstruckforum.com/htforum/index.php?PHPSESSID=1e65b... I once saw a heavy wrecker flatbed in the late 00's hauling three ex-ups trucks with standard shift to the scrap yard. They were hastily painted white with a roller to hide the UPS color and logo but you could still see the logo through the shoddy paint job and brown patches along the edges.
- kalcode 9y ago>They destroy them for brand protection. See this comment: Comment has some sound reasoning why they feel that way. Curious though, why do you post/take that commen on a forum that was copied from an unnamed forum as fact?
- RyJones 9y agoIt's a (supposed) copy of a newspaper article. I searched for the original publication and can't find it.
- yorby 9y agoAround here, UPS also use small vehicles similar to golf carts in the busy seasons
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- Feniks 9y agoThey'll need this in Europe. Lots of cities are clamping down on pollution.
- dx034 9y agoThey already have that. In Germany, mail is delivered by custom-made electric vehicles (streetScooter) and at least in London, UPS already uses electric trucks for delivery.
- jsumrall 9y agoI'm working at an online supermarket called Picnic, in the Netherlands, and we deliver with small electric trucks. It works well in cities and suburban areas. People seem to like seeing the trucks in the neighborhoods compared to larger box trucks used by other delivery companies. It's small and quiet, which makes it less of a nuisance. https://i.imgur.com/Howtq17.jpg https://i.imgur.com/Howtq17.jpg
- nwah1 9y agoWhen EVs advertize 100 mile range, that means in the best conditions. Heavy loads would reduce that. Cold weather itself can make your range worse, and additionally any kind of heating or AC will reduce range further. I recently purchased an EV with a "100 mile range," and it so far hasn't achieved higher than a 70 mile range, given the cold weather, even with 100% charge, no climate control, and no real load. Turn on the heat, and suddenly you lose another 20 miles of range. And it can take ages to charge, with current technology. I don't think this sounds too practical for deliveries, quite yet. But somehow, there are Lyft and Uber drivers who have these.
- ryanianian 9y agoIt probably makes most sense in urban areas where a totally full truck can leave the local depot and fully unload in less than 15 miles. That's the case with my local UPS (in the greater NYC area). Electric vehicles are perfect for this scenario. (This said I'm sure they'll have to have contingency plans for when the things run out of juice but that's probably the same plan they currently have for accidents or breakdowns)
- antishatter 9y agoI wonder if their estimates are taking into account the type of work the truck will be doing.
- pedroaraujo 9y agoTesla seems to be the only company nowadays invested in developing an actually good electric vehicles I never understood why the other car companies insist in producing crappy EV products and yet so expensive for what they are worth. I wouldn't recommend buying an EV that is not Tesla.
- kwhitefoot 9y agoWhat's wrong with Nissan Leaf or Hyundai Ioniq?
- kwhitefoot 9y agoWhich EV did you buy? I have a 2015 Tesla S 70D and the weather, heater, etc., don't seem to make as much difference as you say. But it is the only EV that I have any first hand knowledge of. Mind you, the real range is nearer 200 miles so I rarely need to worry about running out. On a 10 A, 230 V, single phase connection (Norway) it will add more than 80 miles overnight (say 18:00 to 06:00) so it is perfectly practical for everyday use. At a Tesla Supercharger it takes an hour to go from 20% to 80%, that is adding over 100 miles.
- computer22 9y agoThey're also purchasing bike trailers in Germany... and will deliver by e-bike. https://www.facebook.com/hinterhercom/photos/a.496446767057350.98740.490939550941405/1615849118450437/?type=3&theater https://www.facebook.com/hinterhercom/photos/a.4964467670573...
- zaroth 9y agoSpeaking of custom built electric delivery vehicles... I've been thinking of something purpose built to carry only small cargo and no passengers, i.e. 8 cu ft and 100lb total cargo capacity, with a limited range designed to make delivery runs and then return and charge (or maybe just swap power packs). Nuro [1] is working on something in this vein. I think their vehicle is much too big personally, I would start with something that could carry maybe 30 lbs and 2 cu ft of cargo and scale up from there. While the walking-speed Starship [2] seems like it went too far in the other direction. But it seems like there is space for a cargo-only vehicle that could be extremely useful in the city, particularly if it's an on-demand model where businesses can hail them with an API call. The question is whether a robot like this--which doesn't carry people but still has to operate on the roadways--does it make the AI problem materially easier to solve? And in the spirit of fake-it-till-you-make-it, why not launch the service today by paying "operators" to remote control the vehicle over 4G links with just enough software to do collision avoidance and safely pull over if the operator disconnects? [1] - https://nuro.ai/ https://nuro.ai/ [2] - https://www.starship.xyz/ https://www.starship.xyz/
- stevenAthompson 9y agoThey can't get UPS WorldShip to print a label properly (after decades of development). I certainly wouldn't want to ride in any vehicle they designed.
- ecommerceguy 9y agoFantastic. We shipped 17 tons with UPS in the last year, each shipment utilized their carbon neutral shipping option. I'm glad to see the last mile is getting a bit greener and hopefully more efficient.
- aventrix 9y agoA bit of an aside, but you have to wonder how much electricity they could save on air conditioning by painting their trucks white instead of brown. Perhaps they don't use any AC at all, which means their delivery drivers are stuck in that solar oven all day. I know they now at least paint the tops of their trucks white. Edit: Fixed typo.
- asteli 9y agoGiven that the cab is usually left completely open, and that the cargo area isn't enclosed when it's in use, I'm not sure it makes sense to use aircon in a delivery vehicle,
- pvsdileep 9y agoThough UPS is slow in the race it is very good strategy to tackle the problem. Most UPS or USPS vehicles need only 100-150 miles range, they can charge overnight. No need to wait for a crazy vehicle which has 500 mile range
- nateguchi 9y agoRoyal Mail (in the UK) is currently trialling an electric post van [1]. [1] https://electrek.co/2017/08/23/royal-mail-new-electric-autonomous-truck-arrival/ https://electrek.co/2017/08/23/royal-mail-new-electric-auton...