9 ms·

Your son could have that at a state school for probably free (depending on the state, and with good grades), and work in a restaurant three or four nights a wee

by hashkb 9y ago

Your son could have that at a state school for probably free (depending on the state, and with good grades), and work in a restaurant three or four nights a week to offset some other costs.

lettergram 9y ago
Ugh - depends what state school. My wife and I both went to University of Illinois (we are from Illinois). I worked 10 - 20 hours per week, and got some smaller grants, my wife got larger grants.. We still both have more debt than I care to admit... It's literally 20% of our overall monthly expenses. I found the connections personally invaluable and worth it. My wife is just starting her PhD at U of I, so we both agree it was worth it, but just barely.
- wenc 9y ago
  I live in Illinois. I just looked up in-state tuition for UIUC = $17k/year. That is not cheap, but it's a lot less than many lower-ranking private schools. Loyola charges $21k. Roosevelt charges $26k. UIUC is a great state school, one of the best in the country. I'd say you got a good deal. But yes, definitely not close to free.
epistasis 9y ago
I would be very interested to know which, if any, schools make this possible.
- bernardino 9y ago
  I find it’s doable to attend a college where you won’t pay tuition, but it will most likely be a semi-low-tier, state school and or your estimated family contribution must be zero. After spending a few years at a community college, I will (I think, I need more for or against opinions) be attending San Francisco State University in the fall. My tuition looks like it will be waived (tuition is about 8k for in-state students, 17k for out-of-state students) since I’m in-state and my estimated family contribution (via FASFA) is zero (family income is about 31k). I will then just have to take out loans for living expenses and hopefully work part-time to lessen them.
  - hackerman12345 9y ago
    I got great value from CC. But you'll want to make sure it not only has proper (regional) accreditation, but also a "transfer agreement" to the local university of your choice. This isn't 100% necessary, but it sure helps as a guideline to know what courses have value for your future program. The naming schemes at different schools can be confusing ("Am I supposed to take Technical Calculus 1 or Calculus 1 for Scientists and Engineers?") - so having the direct transfer numbers is helpful. The advisors at CC aren't always necessarily educated and may make assumptions like EE and EE Tech being the same program.. Finally, if you're going on to a BS, the AS is next to useless in my experience (besides resume fodder). It's the actual classes that transfer that are the value, and whether you finish at CC or not is not a big deal.. (though go ahead and do it if it's just like a few classes different). CC is cheap and there's sometimes interesting courses like archaeology or whatever so have fun with that. Cons: It can be a little more difficult to find a top quality internship while you're a CC student. You should still try to find one though, and join clubs and whatnot.. CC won't have FSAE but they do tend to have other stuff.
- meri_dian 9y ago
  It's possible to graduate from an average state school with maybe $30,000 in debt, given modest parental support and working a part time job. That sort of debt is easy to deal with if you get work in a reasonably well paying field
  - ikeyany 9y ago
    I'm curious to know what percentage of HN readers had their parents help pay for university/housing. That could explain why so many here think university is obviously "what you do".
    - meri_dian 9y ago
      It doesn't matter though. Look at the statistics for life long earning potential for degree vs non degree holders. Even if you have to graduate with $100k of debt, you should definitely go to college. It's easy to be intimidated by the debt load, but that fear is shortsighted. In the long term college makes sense. Here's some data on the lifetime earning potential between college grads and non grads, from the US Social Security Administration: "Men with bachelor's degrees earn approximately $900,000 more in median lifetime earnings than high school graduates. Women with bachelor's degrees earn $630,000 more. Men with graduate degrees earn $1.5 million more in median lifetime earnings than high school graduates. Women with graduate degrees earn $1.1 million more" >https://www.ssa.gov/retirementpolicy/research/education-earnings.html https://www.ssa.gov/retirementpolicy/research/education-earn...
      - astura 9y ago
        Be careful. Just because degree holders have higher lifetime earnings, that doesn't necessarily mean graduating from college will increase lifetime earnings. The alternative hypothesis is that the attributes that drive someone to both go to college and succeed in passing classes are also the same attributes that cause success at work. I'm not saying a college degree doesn't open doors for you, it absolutely does, I'm saying you can't look at the numbers like that and make that conclusion. (The dropout rate is also ~45% so you take a significant risk of taking on the cost burden without a payout)
- iak8god 9y ago
  The SUNY system offers free tuition to NY state residents with annual income under $125K. That may not be too relevant for the children of HNers, but it's a huge proportion of households in NY state. https://www.ny.gov/programs/tuition-free-degree-program-excelsior-scholarship https://www.ny.gov/programs/tuition-free-degree-program-exce...
- pnw_hazor 9y ago
  The state of Washington has a free tuition program as well.
- robotresearcher 9y ago
  All public universities in Germany (which is 95%+ of all universities), and some other G8 countries. https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/student-finance/how-much-does-it-cost-study-germany https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/student-finance...
meri_dian 9y ago
Not sure why you're getting downvoted. Going to one of your state schools is a good choice for a relatively low cost education. It's naive to think a college degree isn't valuable. Among a collection of candidates with and without college degrees, those with degrees will not only get preferential treatment, but also once they are deep in their careers those who do not have formal degrees will be held back from leadership roles. This is how the real world works much of the time, the idea that college is becoming less important is wrong. It's becoming more important.
- greedo 9y ago
  They're probably getting downvoted because the cost of state schools is still too high to work your way through (without loans etc.)
  - Slansitartop 9y ago
    Probably depends on the state. Aren't California's as expensive as private schools now? Some other states still have reasonably priced state schools.
    - greedo 9y ago
      I live in the midwest, and our "premier" state school is $18k/year (including housing). Unless you're going to go to community college for your first two years and then transfer, it's very hard to not incur a substantial amount of debt in completing your degree.
seanmcdirmid 9y ago
When I went to school in the early/mid 90s, tuition was low enough that I could basically support myself with a job and some minimal support from my dad ($1000/quarter). Those days are long gone, however.
- limeblack 9y ago
  Yes and the full ride scholarships(scholarships in general) are that much more difficult to give. My father got a full ride to a state school back in the 80s but today with his grades it wouldn't happen.
  - seanmcdirmid 9y ago
    I didn’t get a scholarship (though I should have applied) and it was still affordable. This was at UW in a top 10 CS program.

by hashkb 9y ago

Your son could have that at a state school for probably free (depending on the state, and with good grades), and work in a restaurant three or four nights a week to offset some other costs.

lettergram 9y ago

Ugh - depends what state school. My wife and I both went to University of Illinois (we are from Illinois). I worked 10 - 20 hours per week, and got some smaller grants, my wife got larger grants.. We still both have more debt than I care to admit... It's literally 20% of our overall monthly expenses. I found the connections personally invaluable and worth it. My wife is just starting her PhD at U of I, so we both agree it was worth it, but just barely.

wenc 9y ago
I live in Illinois. I just looked up in-state tuition for UIUC = $17k/year. That is not cheap, but it's a lot less than many lower-ranking private schools. Loyola charges $21k. Roosevelt charges $26k. UIUC is a great state school, one of the best in the country. I'd say you got a good deal. But yes, definitely not close to free.

epistasis 9y ago

I would be very interested to know which, if any, schools make this possible.

bernardino 9y ago
I find it’s doable to attend a college where you won’t pay tuition, but it will most likely be a semi-low-tier, state school and or your estimated family contribution must be zero. After spending a few years at a community college, I will (I think, I need more for or against opinions) be attending San Francisco State University in the fall. My tuition looks like it will be waived (tuition is about 8k for in-state students, 17k for out-of-state students) since I’m in-state and my estimated family contribution (via FASFA) is zero (family income is about 31k). I will then just have to take out loans for living expenses and hopefully work part-time to lessen them.
- hackerman12345 9y ago
  I got great value from CC. But you'll want to make sure it not only has proper (regional) accreditation, but also a "transfer agreement" to the local university of your choice. This isn't 100% necessary, but it sure helps as a guideline to know what courses have value for your future program. The naming schemes at different schools can be confusing ("Am I supposed to take Technical Calculus 1 or Calculus 1 for Scientists and Engineers?") - so having the direct transfer numbers is helpful. The advisors at CC aren't always necessarily educated and may make assumptions like EE and EE Tech being the same program.. Finally, if you're going on to a BS, the AS is next to useless in my experience (besides resume fodder). It's the actual classes that transfer that are the value, and whether you finish at CC or not is not a big deal.. (though go ahead and do it if it's just like a few classes different). CC is cheap and there's sometimes interesting courses like archaeology or whatever so have fun with that. Cons: It can be a little more difficult to find a top quality internship while you're a CC student. You should still try to find one though, and join clubs and whatnot.. CC won't have FSAE but they do tend to have other stuff.
meri_dian 9y ago
It's possible to graduate from an average state school with maybe $30,000 in debt, given modest parental support and working a part time job. That sort of debt is easy to deal with if you get work in a reasonably well paying field
- ikeyany 9y ago
  I'm curious to know what percentage of HN readers had their parents help pay for university/housing. That could explain why so many here think university is obviously "what you do".
  - meri_dian 9y ago
    It doesn't matter though. Look at the statistics for life long earning potential for degree vs non degree holders. Even if you have to graduate with $100k of debt, you should definitely go to college. It's easy to be intimidated by the debt load, but that fear is shortsighted. In the long term college makes sense. Here's some data on the lifetime earning potential between college grads and non grads, from the US Social Security Administration: "Men with bachelor's degrees earn approximately $900,000 more in median lifetime earnings than high school graduates. Women with bachelor's degrees earn $630,000 more. Men with graduate degrees earn $1.5 million more in median lifetime earnings than high school graduates. Women with graduate degrees earn $1.1 million more" >https://www.ssa.gov/retirementpolicy/research/education-earnings.html https://www.ssa.gov/retirementpolicy/research/education-earn...
    - astura 9y ago
      Be careful. Just because degree holders have higher lifetime earnings, that doesn't necessarily mean graduating from college will increase lifetime earnings. The alternative hypothesis is that the attributes that drive someone to both go to college and succeed in passing classes are also the same attributes that cause success at work. I'm not saying a college degree doesn't open doors for you, it absolutely does, I'm saying you can't look at the numbers like that and make that conclusion. (The dropout rate is also ~45% so you take a significant risk of taking on the cost burden without a payout)
iak8god 9y ago
The SUNY system offers free tuition to NY state residents with annual income under $125K. That may not be too relevant for the children of HNers, but it's a huge proportion of households in NY state. https://www.ny.gov/programs/tuition-free-degree-program-excelsior-scholarship https://www.ny.gov/programs/tuition-free-degree-program-exce...
pnw_hazor 9y ago
The state of Washington has a free tuition program as well.
robotresearcher 9y ago
All public universities in Germany (which is 95%+ of all universities), and some other G8 countries. https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/student-finance/how-much-does-it-cost-study-germany https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/student-finance...

meri_dian 9y ago

Not sure why you're getting downvoted. Going to one of your state schools is a good choice for a relatively low cost education. It's naive to think a college degree isn't valuable. Among a collection of candidates with and without college degrees, those with degrees will not only get preferential treatment, but also once they are deep in their careers those who do not have formal degrees will be held back from leadership roles. This is how the real world works much of the time, the idea that college is becoming less important is wrong. It's becoming more important.

greedo 9y ago
They're probably getting downvoted because the cost of state schools is still too high to work your way through (without loans etc.)
- Slansitartop 9y ago
  Probably depends on the state. Aren't California's as expensive as private schools now? Some other states still have reasonably priced state schools.
  - greedo 9y ago
    I live in the midwest, and our "premier" state school is $18k/year (including housing). Unless you're going to go to community college for your first two years and then transfer, it's very hard to not incur a substantial amount of debt in completing your degree.

seanmcdirmid 9y ago

When I went to school in the early/mid 90s, tuition was low enough that I could basically support myself with a job and some minimal support from my dad ($1000/quarter). Those days are long gone, however.

limeblack 9y ago
Yes and the full ride scholarships(scholarships in general) are that much more difficult to give. My father got a full ride to a state school back in the 80s but today with his grades it wouldn't happen.
- seanmcdirmid 9y ago
  I didn’t get a scholarship (though I should have applied) and it was still affordable. This was at UW in a top 10 CS program.