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> Do people really consider the ethics of introducing tech like this? But consider the fact that you are using terms out of the humanities, while most of my fe

> Do people really consider the ethics of introducing tech like this? But consider the fact that you are using terms out of the humanities, while most of my fellow CS students endlessly griped about how useless their humanities courses were and how they wished the school would get rid of that course requirement (six courses total over 4 years). Until we teach the tech-priests of the 21st century the great responsibility due to the power that they hold, I doubt things will improve.

Nursie 9y ago
I'm not sure I agree the implicit assumption here that humanities courses necessarily result in more, well, humanity. In the UK, for instance, we have no requirements for a university degree other than the courses relevant to that degree. I was there to study computer science, not get a rounded education at someone else's insistence. And yet most of the really rapacious, conscienceless, anti-human stuff seems to me to come from the libertarian and 'bro' fringes of Silicon Valley, seemingly despite the requirements to study more 'humanities'.
- binaryriviera 9y ago
  I agree. It seems to come from the silicon valley culture more than anything. After all Peter Thiel, one of the more extreme examples of this sort of thinking, got a philosophy bachelors degree iirc.
- stordoff 9y ago
  > In the UK, for instance, we have no requirements for a university degree other than the courses relevant to that degree. Which depends almost entirely on the university in question. My computer science degree (Cambridge) had two separate courses focusing on ethics/humanities. Year 1 had Professional Practice and Ethics (which starts as broad as "Ethical theory. Basic questions in ethics. Survey of ethical theories: [...]. Advantages and disadvantages of the two main theories: utilitarian and deontological.", not just as it relates to CS), and Year 2 had Economics and Law (broad introduction to micro/macroeconomics, and a general overview of the law as it related to CS). The course introduction for the latter notes that you are to treat it as if reading a humanties subject: > One word of warning: many part 1b students may never have studied a humanties subject since GCSE. It is a different task from learning a programming language; it is not sufficient to acquire proficiency at a small core of manipulative techniques, and figure out the rest when needed. Breadth matters. You should spend at least half of the study time you allocate to this subject on general reading. There are many introductory texts on economics and on law; your college library is probably a good place to start. FWIW, I don't recall many complaints about the presence of these courses. Most seemed to find it useful to get a more rounded view, and it was a nice change of pace from tens of hours of pure computer science a week). It was also likely helpful for my later studies in Law. https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/teaching/0809/EconLaw/ https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/teaching/0809/EconLaw/
  - nabeards 9y ago
    > Which depends almost entirely on the university in question. This is also true in the US. I actually chose to study religion and philosophy in addition to CS. My reasons for doing so aside, I truly benefited from it as it helps guide the type of work I will take. I'm torn on whether it should be required, mainly because I am not in a position to decide what makes a 'better' software engineer.
    - stordoff 9y ago
      I didn't doubt that; I just felt that the OP made it sound like doing a UK CS degree would mean only studying pure CS, which is overstating things somewhat so wanted to clarify. You aren't necessarily going to be picking classes from across the university to fulfill generic requirements (if nothing else, you don't really have the time to do so), but it's not hyperfocused either.
  - JoeMalt 9y ago
    Unfortunately the Econ, Law and Ethics course is still widely derided, even though some of the content is genuinely useful.
  - Nursie 9y ago
    I would certainly consider courses in professional practice, law and ethics to be far more supportive and on topic than generalised requirements to take a certain number of "humanities" courses.
- briandear 9y ago
  Libertarians aren’t “anti-human,” they are anti-totalitarianism.
  - Nursie 9y ago
    The ethics and actions that spring from libertarian thought certainly appear to be suited more to perfectly rational robots than to imperfect, fleshy and irrational humans, and how people actually live their lives.

Nursie 9y ago

I'm not sure I agree the implicit assumption here that humanities courses necessarily result in more, well, humanity. In the UK, for instance, we have no requirements for a university degree other than the courses relevant to that degree. I was there to study computer science, not get a rounded education at someone else's insistence. And yet most of the really rapacious, conscienceless, anti-human stuff seems to me to come from the libertarian and 'bro' fringes of Silicon Valley, seemingly despite the requirements to study more 'humanities'.

binaryriviera 9y ago
I agree. It seems to come from the silicon valley culture more than anything. After all Peter Thiel, one of the more extreme examples of this sort of thinking, got a philosophy bachelors degree iirc.
stordoff 9y ago
> In the UK, for instance, we have no requirements for a university degree other than the courses relevant to that degree. Which depends almost entirely on the university in question. My computer science degree (Cambridge) had two separate courses focusing on ethics/humanities. Year 1 had Professional Practice and Ethics (which starts as broad as "Ethical theory. Basic questions in ethics. Survey of ethical theories: [...]. Advantages and disadvantages of the two main theories: utilitarian and deontological.", not just as it relates to CS), and Year 2 had Economics and Law (broad introduction to micro/macroeconomics, and a general overview of the law as it related to CS). The course introduction for the latter notes that you are to treat it as if reading a humanties subject: > One word of warning: many part 1b students may never have studied a humanties subject since GCSE. It is a different task from learning a programming language; it is not sufficient to acquire proficiency at a small core of manipulative techniques, and figure out the rest when needed. Breadth matters. You should spend at least half of the study time you allocate to this subject on general reading. There are many introductory texts on economics and on law; your college library is probably a good place to start. FWIW, I don't recall many complaints about the presence of these courses. Most seemed to find it useful to get a more rounded view, and it was a nice change of pace from tens of hours of pure computer science a week). It was also likely helpful for my later studies in Law. https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/teaching/0809/EconLaw/ https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/teaching/0809/EconLaw/
- nabeards 9y ago
  > Which depends almost entirely on the university in question. This is also true in the US. I actually chose to study religion and philosophy in addition to CS. My reasons for doing so aside, I truly benefited from it as it helps guide the type of work I will take. I'm torn on whether it should be required, mainly because I am not in a position to decide what makes a 'better' software engineer.
  - stordoff 9y ago
    I didn't doubt that; I just felt that the OP made it sound like doing a UK CS degree would mean only studying pure CS, which is overstating things somewhat so wanted to clarify. You aren't necessarily going to be picking classes from across the university to fulfill generic requirements (if nothing else, you don't really have the time to do so), but it's not hyperfocused either.
- JoeMalt 9y ago
  Unfortunately the Econ, Law and Ethics course is still widely derided, even though some of the content is genuinely useful.
- Nursie 9y ago
  I would certainly consider courses in professional practice, law and ethics to be far more supportive and on topic than generalised requirements to take a certain number of "humanities" courses.
briandear 9y ago
Libertarians aren’t “anti-human,” they are anti-totalitarianism.
- Nursie 9y ago
  The ethics and actions that spring from libertarian thought certainly appear to be suited more to perfectly rational robots than to imperfect, fleshy and irrational humans, and how people actually live their lives.