6 ms·

SV is very liberal, yet typically engineers (eg. EE, Mechanical, Civil, Aero, Industrial, Chemical, ...) are conservative. I wonder how many people with real e

SV is very liberal, yet typically engineers (eg. EE, Mechanical, Civil, Aero, Industrial, Chemical, ...) are conservative. I wonder how many people with real engineering degrees (disclosure my BS is EE with CS minor from top school) are SV liberal.

davidf18 9y ago
Unable to edit my comment so adding this: http://www.machinedesign.com/news/politics-engineers http://www.machinedesign.com/news/politics-engineers "Engineers tend to view themselves as much less liberal and slightly more conservative than the general public, according to a recent survey of over 1,200 readers of MACHINE DESIGN and Electronic Design magazines. The same survey also found that engineers say they are more likely to be Republican (42.1%) or Independent (33.7%) voters, as opposed to Democrats (14.5%)."
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- jakecopp 9y ago
  I imagine this correlation could be explained by engineers having a high average salary, and I think high salaries (on average) correlate with being conservative. I don't have references though.
api 9y ago
SV liberalism is kind of hypocritical and surface. Here we have an apparently super-liberal place whose main industry is mass surveillance and that does everything in its power via local zoning policy to price out the poor and minorities. The local echo chamber is all about 'diversity' yet the local tech industry is among the least diverse industries in the world. A lot of the echo chambering is in the "methinks you doth protest too much" category IMHO.
- FeepingCreature 9y ago
  > among the least diverse industries in the world. If you count asians as white... Also gonna want a cite on that. afaik sv hiring is about equal with labor market.
  - api 9y ago
    I was thinking more of gender diversity than racial diversity, though the racial diversity of SV is not great. There are loads of female mathematicians, doctors, civil engineers, writers, journalists, etc. so obviously language and math is not beyond women. Programming is just language and math.
    - mrgordon 9y ago
      Proof that more women (as a percentage) are mathematicians than programmers? I think it’s about equal for many of the same reasons.
    - FeepingCreature 9y ago
      > obviously language and math is not beyond women I think there's several claims here: 1) "no/very few women can be good at stem/math/language/programming." Nobody but the most comically self-parodying misogynists says that. 2) "fewer women are good at stem/math/language/programming than men." This is the "SV conservative/classic liberal" position. If equal opportunity is provided, any remaining differences in hiring are plausibly down to availability which is down to average capability. 3) "women and men are just as good at stem/math/language/programming." This is the progressive/feminist position. The people who hold 3 want the rest of the world to think that the people who hold 2 actually hold 1. Many 2 would be willing to tentatively jump on board with 3, but 3 somehow keep antagonizing them. As such, similarly to the Trump election, it's politically a question of which side disgusts you less.
      - api 9y ago
        I used to believe #2 but experience brought me to #3. People are really irrational. Racism, sexism, and ageism are really just a few of the many dumb conditioned biases that guide decision making. A random example: taller people and people with broader shoulders make more sales. We are intelligent minds grafted clumsily onto apes.
MisterBastahrd 9y ago
Engineers are usually conservative because they mostly come from stable, conservative households. A lot of them became engineers because aside from their interest in how things work, it was a safe career choice that would allow them to perpetuate the lifestyles they had come to enjoy while living with their parents. The people in SV are largely more willing to challenge orthodoxy and take risks.
- caseysoftware 9y ago
  [Citation needed] for "Engineers are usually conservative because they mostly come from stable, conservative households."
yters 9y ago
That is my personal experience too. Conservative ideas tend to be more thought out and logical, hence why traditional cultures are conservative. They're traditional because they lasted a long time, and they lasted a long time because their principles match reality.

davidf18 9y ago

Unable to edit my comment so adding this: http://www.machinedesign.com/news/politics-engineers http://www.machinedesign.com/news/politics-engineers "Engineers tend to view themselves as much less liberal and slightly more conservative than the general public, according to a recent survey of over 1,200 readers of MACHINE DESIGN and Electronic Design magazines. The same survey also found that engineers say they are more likely to be Republican (42.1%) or Independent (33.7%) voters, as opposed to Democrats (14.5%)."

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
jakecopp 9y ago
I imagine this correlation could be explained by engineers having a high average salary, and I think high salaries (on average) correlate with being conservative. I don't have references though.

api 9y ago

SV liberalism is kind of hypocritical and surface. Here we have an apparently super-liberal place whose main industry is mass surveillance and that does everything in its power via local zoning policy to price out the poor and minorities. The local echo chamber is all about 'diversity' yet the local tech industry is among the least diverse industries in the world. A lot of the echo chambering is in the "methinks you doth protest too much" category IMHO.

FeepingCreature 9y ago
> among the least diverse industries in the world. If you count asians as white... Also gonna want a cite on that. afaik sv hiring is about equal with labor market.
- api 9y ago
  I was thinking more of gender diversity than racial diversity, though the racial diversity of SV is not great. There are loads of female mathematicians, doctors, civil engineers, writers, journalists, etc. so obviously language and math is not beyond women. Programming is just language and math.
  - mrgordon 9y ago
    Proof that more women (as a percentage) are mathematicians than programmers? I think it’s about equal for many of the same reasons.
  - FeepingCreature 9y ago
    > obviously language and math is not beyond women I think there's several claims here: 1) "no/very few women can be good at stem/math/language/programming." Nobody but the most comically self-parodying misogynists says that. 2) "fewer women are good at stem/math/language/programming than men." This is the "SV conservative/classic liberal" position. If equal opportunity is provided, any remaining differences in hiring are plausibly down to availability which is down to average capability. 3) "women and men are just as good at stem/math/language/programming." This is the progressive/feminist position. The people who hold 3 want the rest of the world to think that the people who hold 2 actually hold 1. Many 2 would be willing to tentatively jump on board with 3, but 3 somehow keep antagonizing them. As such, similarly to the Trump election, it's politically a question of which side disgusts you less.
    - api 9y ago
      I used to believe #2 but experience brought me to #3. People are really irrational. Racism, sexism, and ageism are really just a few of the many dumb conditioned biases that guide decision making. A random example: taller people and people with broader shoulders make more sales. We are intelligent minds grafted clumsily onto apes.

MisterBastahrd 9y ago

Engineers are usually conservative because they mostly come from stable, conservative households. A lot of them became engineers because aside from their interest in how things work, it was a safe career choice that would allow them to perpetuate the lifestyles they had come to enjoy while living with their parents. The people in SV are largely more willing to challenge orthodoxy and take risks.

caseysoftware 9y ago
[Citation needed] for "Engineers are usually conservative because they mostly come from stable, conservative households."

yters 9y ago

That is my personal experience too. Conservative ideas tend to be more thought out and logical, hence why traditional cultures are conservative. They're traditional because they lasted a long time, and they lasted a long time because their principles match reality.