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> So firing him for stating his opinion Do you think it's possible for his stating of his opinion to have side effects like creating a toxic work environment,

> So firing him for stating his opinion Do you think it's possible for his stating of his opinion to have side effects like creating a toxic work environment, which would be the antithesis of doing his job well?

oceanghost 9y ago
Google is a toxic work environment. He was fired for pointing that out.
- ditonal 9y ago
  Downvoted but true, look at direct physical threats to Damore in the lawsuit by people Google still employs. Yet he got fired for violating code of conduct...are threats not violations? It's a double standard, if you threaten people deemed conservative there are no repercussions, even though I consider that far more hostile than a doc.
  - gaius 9y ago
    And the “blacklists” maintained by Google managers and spread to other employers - that practice was found to be illegal in the U.K. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36242312 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36242312
  - caseysoftware 9y ago
    In reading the original article, I think this quote is the opening: > Because companies have a duty to comply with equal employment laws and an interest in promoting diversity, “employers must be permitted to ‘nip in the bud’ the kinds of employee conduct that could lead to a ‘hostile workplace,’ rather than waiting until an actionable hostile workplace has been created before taking action," Sophir wrote. If that is the case, the employees who create and talk about these blacklists - which appear to be well-documented according to HR - may be creating an ongoing hostile work environment long before this memo existed, which demonstrates Damore's point.
  - bduerst 9y ago
    It says that the employee who made the threat was reprimanded: >... email read, in relevant part: “You’re a misogynist and a terrible human. I will keep hounding you until one of us is fired. F[*] you.” The employee was issued a final warning for sending this email. http://apps.nlrb.gov/link/document.aspx/09031d45826e6391 http://apps.nlrb.gov/link/document.aspx/09031d45826e6391 (pdf)
- anonytrary 9y ago
  This is not unique to Google. If you don't "vibe" with your company's culture, you are more likely to become a scapegoat. The outsiders leave or get fired, keeping the culture pure (people get fired for lack of culture fit). This mentality is indeed toxic, but the bottom line of any company benefits from harmony between all of the employees.
  - gaius 9y ago
    This mentality is indeed toxic, but the bottom line of any company benefits from harmony between all of the employees. Not to excuse anything that's actually toxic, mind, but I think it's more subtle than that. Why is Google so inept at social media? Why are they so often blindsided by attention from regulators and tax authorities? Why Google Glass and the glassholes? Because in the pursuit of this harmony they have a limited kind of diversity based on race and gender, but they're all 20-something graduates of the same handful of universities - there's no diversity whatsoever on age or class axes. So things that are completely obvious to outsiders, they are organisationally incapable of understanding. Trapped in a local minima and unable to climb out.
- jacksmith21006 9y ago
  Yet been the top place to work six years in a row. Nobody else done it even two years in a row. How can they be both? http://fortune.com/best-companies/google/ http://fortune.com/best-companies/google/ Google: #1 on 100 Best Companies to Work For in 2017 | Fortune
  - leereeves 9y ago
    > How can they be both? Best place to work if you fit the culture. Toxic environment if you don't.
  - gowld 9y ago
    This page isn’t working fortune.com redirected you too many times. Try clearing your cookies. http://fortune.com/best-companies/list/filtered?searchByName=google http://fortune.com/best-companies/list/filtered?searchByName... "No results found" This year is 2018, and Salesforce is #1. I don't see Google.
  - whataretensors 9y ago
    'Top places to work' contests are internal marketing competitions.
  - oceanghost 9y ago
    You know they buy these awards right? Usually with ad sales.
Udik 9y ago
An environment in which you can be fired for having expressed scientific views which- while debatable- are certainly not fringe seems pretty toxic. Maybe only for those who don't fit in, but still..

oceanghost 9y ago

Google is a toxic work environment. He was fired for pointing that out.

ditonal 9y ago
Downvoted but true, look at direct physical threats to Damore in the lawsuit by people Google still employs. Yet he got fired for violating code of conduct...are threats not violations? It's a double standard, if you threaten people deemed conservative there are no repercussions, even though I consider that far more hostile than a doc.
- gaius 9y ago
  And the “blacklists” maintained by Google managers and spread to other employers - that practice was found to be illegal in the U.K. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36242312 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36242312
- caseysoftware 9y ago
  In reading the original article, I think this quote is the opening: > Because companies have a duty to comply with equal employment laws and an interest in promoting diversity, “employers must be permitted to ‘nip in the bud’ the kinds of employee conduct that could lead to a ‘hostile workplace,’ rather than waiting until an actionable hostile workplace has been created before taking action," Sophir wrote. If that is the case, the employees who create and talk about these blacklists - which appear to be well-documented according to HR - may be creating an ongoing hostile work environment long before this memo existed, which demonstrates Damore's point.
- bduerst 9y ago
  It says that the employee who made the threat was reprimanded: >... email read, in relevant part: “You’re a misogynist and a terrible human. I will keep hounding you until one of us is fired. F[*] you.” The employee was issued a final warning for sending this email. http://apps.nlrb.gov/link/document.aspx/09031d45826e6391 http://apps.nlrb.gov/link/document.aspx/09031d45826e6391 (pdf)
anonytrary 9y ago
This is not unique to Google. If you don't "vibe" with your company's culture, you are more likely to become a scapegoat. The outsiders leave or get fired, keeping the culture pure (people get fired for lack of culture fit). This mentality is indeed toxic, but the bottom line of any company benefits from harmony between all of the employees.
- gaius 9y ago
  This mentality is indeed toxic, but the bottom line of any company benefits from harmony between all of the employees. Not to excuse anything that's actually toxic, mind, but I think it's more subtle than that. Why is Google so inept at social media? Why are they so often blindsided by attention from regulators and tax authorities? Why Google Glass and the glassholes? Because in the pursuit of this harmony they have a limited kind of diversity based on race and gender, but they're all 20-something graduates of the same handful of universities - there's no diversity whatsoever on age or class axes. So things that are completely obvious to outsiders, they are organisationally incapable of understanding. Trapped in a local minima and unable to climb out.
jacksmith21006 9y ago
Yet been the top place to work six years in a row. Nobody else done it even two years in a row. How can they be both? http://fortune.com/best-companies/google/ http://fortune.com/best-companies/google/ Google: #1 on 100 Best Companies to Work For in 2017 | Fortune
- leereeves 9y ago
  > How can they be both? Best place to work if you fit the culture. Toxic environment if you don't.
- gowld 9y ago
  This page isn’t working fortune.com redirected you too many times. Try clearing your cookies. http://fortune.com/best-companies/list/filtered?searchByName=google http://fortune.com/best-companies/list/filtered?searchByName... "No results found" This year is 2018, and Salesforce is #1. I don't see Google.
- whataretensors 9y ago
  'Top places to work' contests are internal marketing competitions.
- oceanghost 9y ago
  You know they buy these awards right? Usually with ad sales.

Udik 9y ago

An environment in which you can be fired for having expressed scientific views which- while debatable- are certainly not fringe seems pretty toxic. Maybe only for those who don't fit in, but still..