6 ms·

Cochrane Collaboration is a network of independent scientists. They analyzed the evidence and said that Tamiflu is no more effective than Paracetamol: http://ww

by neves 9y ago

Cochrane Collaboration is a network of independent scientists. They analyzed the evidence and said that Tamiflu is no more effective than Paracetamol: http://www.cochrane.org/news/tamiflu-and-relenza-getting-full-evidence-picture http://www.cochrane.org/news/tamiflu-and-relenza-getting-ful...

neves 9y ago
A little more info: "Tamiflu (the antiviral drug oseltamivir) shortens symptoms of influenza by half a day, but there is no good evidence to support claims that it reduces admissions to hospital or complications of influenza." https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/04/140411091937.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/04/140411091937.h... Or the complete review: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD008965.pub4/abstract;jsessionid=D0952B85723A29FF11B3087DB5F71938.f03t02 http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD008965...
huhtenberg 9y ago
YMMV. On my trip to Japan I came down with a flu (Influenza-B). Got 40c fever, full-body muscle pain, the whole shebang. Slept through two whole days, occasionally taking ibuprofen to knock the fever off enough to be able to eat something. Then finally went to a doctor, who without any hesitation prescribed Tamiflu, a stock of which they keep in the office at all times. Two tablets later - the fever is gone, replaced with some dry cough and a bit of a runny nose. I know my flu. I had plenty of them and if I have one, it lasts for 3-4 weeks before the temp drops below 38c. There is no doubt in my mind that I recovered from the last flu in 2 days exclusively because of Tamiflu and seeing it compared to Paracetamol makes no sense.
- refurb 9y ago
  Your story is why we don't run single patient clinical trials. In fact, Tamiflu has pretty limited efficacy if not taken in the first 24-48 hours.
  - huhtenberg 9y ago
    Do you mind clarifying who are these "we"? It might be my old BBS habit kicking in, but I really don't appreciate a random person on the Internet taking on themselves to speak on behalf of others with no apparent reason. And it is a single anecdote, so, no, it'd be indeed very strange to base the results of a "clinical trial" on it alone. It does however mean that in at least one case the drug worked and it worked very well. As I said above "YMMV".
    - jsight 9y ago
      From context, "we" is the drug company running the clinical trial. And his first sentence did read very strangely, as you clearly weren't talking about anything other than an anecdote. :) Having said that, his point other point seems to be valid. Tamiflu does not make a claim as to helping someone in your case, afaik.
    - Xylakant 9y ago
      There is not strong indication that the drug worked well or even at all. It was taken long outside the window where its best applied. Chances are that in your case, the illness has run its course and the pills were taken at the time you would have gotten better anyways. I’d bet that sleeping two days had a much stronger effect on your recovery than two doses of tamiflu. That’s why we - as a society - do not accept clinical trials that do not conform to a minimal scientific standard, statistical significance being one of the requirements.
      - huhtenberg 9y ago
        Hey, random HN poster. I too went to the kindergarten and know what statistical significance is. Surprise. So thanks a bunch, but no need for lecturing on the basics of scientific method. I am also a part of a rational part of the society, which you appear to be trying to exclude me from if I'm reading your comment correctly. > I’d bet that ... You can bet whatever you want. I had numerous flu's in my lifespan of almost 50 years. All but one were the same, and the exception ended in less than a week. It was lab-tested to confirm that it was in fact a flu virus. It was the only one when I was taking an antiviral med.
- bfuller 9y ago
  The flu doesn't last 3-4 weeks
  - huhtenberg 9y ago
    That's a fair point, actually, and I should clarify that. From where I'm from there's 36.6c, 37.7c and 39c temperature marks that respectively denote the "ok", "basic cold", "bed regime" and "burning hot" ranges. It does take me several weeks after getting a flu to get back to the "basic cold" level. With this antiviral thing I got there in 2 days flat.

by neves 9y ago

neves 9y ago

A little more info: "Tamiflu (the antiviral drug oseltamivir) shortens symptoms of influenza by half a day, but there is no good evidence to support claims that it reduces admissions to hospital or complications of influenza." https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/04/140411091937.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/04/140411091937.h... Or the complete review: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD008965.pub4/abstract;jsessionid=D0952B85723A29FF11B3087DB5F71938.f03t02 http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD008965...

huhtenberg 9y ago

YMMV. On my trip to Japan I came down with a flu (Influenza-B). Got 40c fever, full-body muscle pain, the whole shebang. Slept through two whole days, occasionally taking ibuprofen to knock the fever off enough to be able to eat something. Then finally went to a doctor, who without any hesitation prescribed Tamiflu, a stock of which they keep in the office at all times. Two tablets later - the fever is gone, replaced with some dry cough and a bit of a runny nose. I know my flu. I had plenty of them and if I have one, it lasts for 3-4 weeks before the temp drops below 38c. There is no doubt in my mind that I recovered from the last flu in 2 days exclusively because of Tamiflu and seeing it compared to Paracetamol makes no sense.

refurb 9y ago
Your story is why we don't run single patient clinical trials. In fact, Tamiflu has pretty limited efficacy if not taken in the first 24-48 hours.
- huhtenberg 9y ago
  Do you mind clarifying who are these "we"? It might be my old BBS habit kicking in, but I really don't appreciate a random person on the Internet taking on themselves to speak on behalf of others with no apparent reason. And it is a single anecdote, so, no, it'd be indeed very strange to base the results of a "clinical trial" on it alone. It does however mean that in at least one case the drug worked and it worked very well. As I said above "YMMV".
  - jsight 9y ago
    From context, "we" is the drug company running the clinical trial. And his first sentence did read very strangely, as you clearly weren't talking about anything other than an anecdote. :) Having said that, his point other point seems to be valid. Tamiflu does not make a claim as to helping someone in your case, afaik.
  - Xylakant 9y ago
    There is not strong indication that the drug worked well or even at all. It was taken long outside the window where its best applied. Chances are that in your case, the illness has run its course and the pills were taken at the time you would have gotten better anyways. I’d bet that sleeping two days had a much stronger effect on your recovery than two doses of tamiflu. That’s why we - as a society - do not accept clinical trials that do not conform to a minimal scientific standard, statistical significance being one of the requirements.
    - huhtenberg 9y ago
      Hey, random HN poster. I too went to the kindergarten and know what statistical significance is. Surprise. So thanks a bunch, but no need for lecturing on the basics of scientific method. I am also a part of a rational part of the society, which you appear to be trying to exclude me from if I'm reading your comment correctly. > I’d bet that ... You can bet whatever you want. I had numerous flu's in my lifespan of almost 50 years. All but one were the same, and the exception ended in less than a week. It was lab-tested to confirm that it was in fact a flu virus. It was the only one when I was taking an antiviral med.
bfuller 9y ago
The flu doesn't last 3-4 weeks
- huhtenberg 9y ago
  That's a fair point, actually, and I should clarify that. From where I'm from there's 36.6c, 37.7c and 39c temperature marks that respectively denote the "ok", "basic cold", "bed regime" and "burning hot" ranges. It does take me several weeks after getting a flu to get back to the "basic cold" level. With this antiviral thing I got there in 2 days flat.