5 ms·

There should be a body cam on every officer and their police powers and privileges should deactivate the moment its turned off deliberately or “accidentally”. A

by txsh 9y ago

There should be a body cam on every officer and their police powers and privileges should deactivate the moment its turned off deliberately or “accidentally”. A time delayed feed should be made public and an independent federal agency should randomly audit the recordings for civil rights abuses. Police should be treated like other political officials and there should be a democratic mechanism for the public to remove them from their position. There should be a national ban on psychological profiling during the police hiring process. Police departments should compensate their officers with substantially higher salaried instead of their current compensation: poor pay with perks like the chance to exert power, abuse people, steal things, and almost completely avoid prosecution. Finally, police officers should be required to live in the areas they police. They should be provided with the same public housing the general public enjoys if they have trouble finding or affording a house. Of course, these ideas are too sensible to be ever become real.

jbattle 9y ago
I'm not anti-bodycam at all - but they don't seem to have had the effect we all hoped for... https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/10/20/558832090/body-cam-study-shows-no-effect-on-police-use-of-force-or-citizen-complaints https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/10/20/558832090... From a minute of googling, looks like San Diego had more dramatic results
- acedio 9y ago
  From the article: >> It's to be expected that these cameras might have little impact on the behavior of police officers in Washington, D.C., he says, because this particular force went through about a decade of federal oversight to help improve the department. Seems as though the D.C. PD didn't have many issues that needed correcting?
- gt_ 9y ago
  ...according to a study conducted by the police department in question. I contested a ticket I received from an aggressive traffic cop in Portland for texting in a stand-still bumper to bumper traffic jam. He was on a motorcycle and saw me as he rode by on the sidewalk!!! This guy had incredible nerve. In court, I insisted we view the footage from his body camera, which could only be done if I first refuse his plea offer, a significant issue IMO. I took the risk. The way he spoke to me was so militant and I thought it would be good to have the room give it a listen and see the traffic jam. The footage turns off as he is walking up to my car!!! Then he told me “either the battery died or the tape ran out”. Tape!!! This was 2015. The ticket was dropped, but I don’t think many people I know would have had this persistence, especially risking the plea denial. Beyond being annoyed, I was also intrigued with the abuse of power in such a trivial case.
  - DrScump 9y ago
    Why had you not reviewed the recording (and other discovery) well before the court date?
    - gt_ 9y ago
      If that was possible, I didn’t know it was. Is there a law about this? How would I go about that next time?
      - upvotinglurker 9y ago
        Get a (paid) lawyer? (I agree you shouldn't HAVE to in a society with a well functioning justice system, but that would be the obvious means)
goblins 9y ago
I wouldn't say sensible, unrealistic or implausible is closer. "Sorry madam the last person I dealt with broke my camera, I'm not a cop at the moment" Political policing departments... Hhmm you think the police equivalent of trump are going to be any less corrupt? I'm also sure housing the police where they work would definitely no in anyway make them, their family and property, any sort of target being as everyone loves the police.
- txsh 9y ago
  > Sorry madam the last person I dealt with broke my camera, I'm not a cop at the moment" He could help in any way a normal citizen could help someone in trouble until another officer arrives with a working body cam. > Political policing That’s not what I said. What’s wrong with allowing the public to petition for a police officer to be fired? > I'm also sure housing the police where they work would definitely no in anyway make them, their family and property, any sort of target being as everyone loves the police. Everyone hates the police. That’s the point. It’s a lot harder to curb stomp a kid’s head if you know you’ll see his mother at the grocery store. It’s a lot harder to force a woman to blow you at a traffic stop if she’s in a book club with your wife. If your profession requires you to have a secret lair, you’re probably a villain.
  - goblins 9y ago
    >He could help in any way a normal citizen could help someone in trouble until another officer arrives with a working body cam. "Sorry madam I know the theif is getting away but I can only help as a normal citizen" Or "Sorry madam I cannot do anything just now I need my camera, if I tried to save her and it went wrong someone could claim I did someone wrong and a mob could then demand I lose my job based on only half facts" >What’s wrong with allowing the public to petition for a police officer to be fired? Because as you say everyone hates to police, that would mean you're local high level gangster could drum up enough support to fill the ranks of the police with cops who wouldn't touch them. >Everyone hates the police. That’s the point. It’s a lot harder to curb stomp a kid’s head... Also a lot harder to arrest those dangerous and violent criminals who will then take revenge on you, your family or property. But then I forget if you're a cop your family is fair game, because fuck cops right?
darpa_escapee 9y ago
Where I'm from, police make $100k+ a year.
crankylinuxuser 9y ago
> A time delayed feed should be made public and an independent federal agency should randomly audit the recordings for civil rights abuses. You know, there's a converse to that. We're developing more and more AI that can detect "events". Wouldn't be interesting if you could detect "criminal" events, even if the officer didn't see, remember, or even know they were criminal to begin with? It means, that every body cam, camera, and recorder turns into a statute-of-limitations criminal detector. A fishing expedition only bound by compute power. And each charge is a goldmine of $$$$, with almost inexcusable evidence (video!). It's why the idea of "Badgecam" is boneheaded without one more addendum: the data is sealed until court order opens it up, upon probable cause at the time with said officer. Else, this massive data collection turns into a panopticon of driving and walking officers and devices.

by txsh 9y ago

jbattle 9y ago

I'm not anti-bodycam at all - but they don't seem to have had the effect we all hoped for... https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/10/20/558832090/body-cam-study-shows-no-effect-on-police-use-of-force-or-citizen-complaints https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/10/20/558832090... From a minute of googling, looks like San Diego had more dramatic results

acedio 9y ago
From the article: >> It's to be expected that these cameras might have little impact on the behavior of police officers in Washington, D.C., he says, because this particular force went through about a decade of federal oversight to help improve the department. Seems as though the D.C. PD didn't have many issues that needed correcting?
gt_ 9y ago
...according to a study conducted by the police department in question. I contested a ticket I received from an aggressive traffic cop in Portland for texting in a stand-still bumper to bumper traffic jam. He was on a motorcycle and saw me as he rode by on the sidewalk!!! This guy had incredible nerve. In court, I insisted we view the footage from his body camera, which could only be done if I first refuse his plea offer, a significant issue IMO. I took the risk. The way he spoke to me was so militant and I thought it would be good to have the room give it a listen and see the traffic jam. The footage turns off as he is walking up to my car!!! Then he told me “either the battery died or the tape ran out”. Tape!!! This was 2015. The ticket was dropped, but I don’t think many people I know would have had this persistence, especially risking the plea denial. Beyond being annoyed, I was also intrigued with the abuse of power in such a trivial case.
- DrScump 9y ago
  Why had you not reviewed the recording (and other discovery) well before the court date?
  - gt_ 9y ago
    If that was possible, I didn’t know it was. Is there a law about this? How would I go about that next time?
    - upvotinglurker 9y ago
      Get a (paid) lawyer? (I agree you shouldn't HAVE to in a society with a well functioning justice system, but that would be the obvious means)

goblins 9y ago

I wouldn't say sensible, unrealistic or implausible is closer. "Sorry madam the last person I dealt with broke my camera, I'm not a cop at the moment" Political policing departments... Hhmm you think the police equivalent of trump are going to be any less corrupt? I'm also sure housing the police where they work would definitely no in anyway make them, their family and property, any sort of target being as everyone loves the police.

txsh 9y ago
> Sorry madam the last person I dealt with broke my camera, I'm not a cop at the moment" He could help in any way a normal citizen could help someone in trouble until another officer arrives with a working body cam. > Political policing That’s not what I said. What’s wrong with allowing the public to petition for a police officer to be fired? > I'm also sure housing the police where they work would definitely no in anyway make them, their family and property, any sort of target being as everyone loves the police. Everyone hates the police. That’s the point. It’s a lot harder to curb stomp a kid’s head if you know you’ll see his mother at the grocery store. It’s a lot harder to force a woman to blow you at a traffic stop if she’s in a book club with your wife. If your profession requires you to have a secret lair, you’re probably a villain.
- goblins 9y ago
  >He could help in any way a normal citizen could help someone in trouble until another officer arrives with a working body cam. "Sorry madam I know the theif is getting away but I can only help as a normal citizen" Or "Sorry madam I cannot do anything just now I need my camera, if I tried to save her and it went wrong someone could claim I did someone wrong and a mob could then demand I lose my job based on only half facts" >What’s wrong with allowing the public to petition for a police officer to be fired? Because as you say everyone hates to police, that would mean you're local high level gangster could drum up enough support to fill the ranks of the police with cops who wouldn't touch them. >Everyone hates the police. That’s the point. It’s a lot harder to curb stomp a kid’s head... Also a lot harder to arrest those dangerous and violent criminals who will then take revenge on you, your family or property. But then I forget if you're a cop your family is fair game, because fuck cops right?

darpa_escapee 9y ago

Where I'm from, police make $100k+ a year.

crankylinuxuser 9y ago

> A time delayed feed should be made public and an independent federal agency should randomly audit the recordings for civil rights abuses. You know, there's a converse to that. We're developing more and more AI that can detect "events". Wouldn't be interesting if you could detect "criminal" events, even if the officer didn't see, remember, or even know they were criminal to begin with? It means, that every body cam, camera, and recorder turns into a statute-of-limitations criminal detector. A fishing expedition only bound by compute power. And each charge is a goldmine of $$$$, with almost inexcusable evidence (video!). It's why the idea of "Badgecam" is boneheaded without one more addendum: the data is sealed until court order opens it up, upon probable cause at the time with said officer. Else, this massive data collection turns into a panopticon of driving and walking officers and devices.