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What’s stopping them from switching to driving for Uber and Lyft? Whether or not those are devasting to Taxis the fact still remains those systems are superior

What’s stopping them from switching to driving for Uber and Lyft? Whether or not those are devasting to Taxis the fact still remains those systems are superior to traditional Taxis.

ProAm 9y ago
The money is lower, its still a race to the bottom, still essentially financed by VC and both companies hope to eliminate the driver with autonomy.
cwyers 9y ago
Taxi medallions are hellishly expensive. Most of the time, you have a loan to purchase your medallion, that you then spend a long, long time paying off. It's essentially a form of indentured servitude. You can switch to Uber/Lyft. But you still have to pay off that loan for your medallion. And if Uber/Lyft aren't paying the same rate as driving a cab used to, you can find yourself without the money to pay your medallion loan and still make ends meet. That said, I disagree with the headline blaming this on the gig economy. There's lots to blame the gig economy for, but this is pretty squarely showing the flaws in the old medallion system -- that you need a crippling amount of financial debt in your name to participate in the system.
- Domenic_S 9y ago
  I thought taxi companies owned the medallions -- hoarding them like gold coins -- and charged the driver what amounted to a "rental fee" for using them. IIRC it's unusual for a single driver to own their own medallion. I could be misremembering though.
  - lambda 9y ago
    In many cities there would be a mix. Some drivers would rent them from companies, some would own the medallion themselves.
  - lazerpants 9y ago
    You're both right. As the medallions increased astronomically in price, only larger groups of drivers or companies could afford to participate.
  - noxToken 9y ago
    Basically. From Wikipedia[0]: > Over the years, many medallions once owned by individual drivers were sold to large taxi fleets. As of 2012, about 18% of all taxis were owner operated, while the rest were leased; this is a decline from the 29% ownership rate in 2006. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicabs_of_New_York_City#Logistics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicabs_of_New_York_City#Logi...
zakk 9y ago
> those systems are superior to traditional Taxis. For some definition of superior. For instance, Uber is for sure superior in stripping the taxi drivers of their rights. https://stallman.org/uber.html#abuse https://stallman.org/uber.html#abuse
- chrischen 9y ago
  1. Superior by offering app-based hailing, real time location updates 2. Ability to share rides 3. Ability to review/report bad behavior (on both driver and customer side)—this along was a notorious problem with cab drivers. And I bet terrible customers used to be rampant too, but they were paying the drivers so nobody cared. 4. No cash. No tip (arguably more controversial thing they got rid of).
  - zakk 9y ago
    In the city I live in I can hail a standard taxi with the app of the local taxi company, of course I can share a ride, and I can pay with bank card/credit card. I never had to report bad behaviors, but I could just look at the taxi number, displayed clearly near the dashboard, and report it to the taxi company. I am it that Uber can have minor advantages, but I boycott it due to the huge disadvantages in terms of worker rights. Also they have been working at a loss to kill competitors: refusing to use Uber means defending your right to choose a service in the future.
djsumdog 9y ago
I knew drivers in New Zealand who switched from Wellington Combined to Uber and earned a ton more. But I have a feeling that's not true in most American cities. I've met very few Uber/Lyft drivers here who switched from cabs. Drivers in Seattle earn less and less every year; driving several times more. It would be nice to see some numbers in this article to see comparable rates from all the other app services like Uber/Lyft/Via etc. I mean if it's a $10k/year pay cut .. well then just do it and take night courses to do something else more worthwhile. If it's way more than that; non-sustainable, then you're just going to have to wait for Uber to tank and prices to go back up (you might need to wait a few years).
- veb 9y ago
  I'm still waiting for one of these companies to show up in Dunedin. Dunedin Taxis charges me nearly $20 for a 6 minute trip home - and their app never works. Sometimes I'm waiting 25 minutes. Also, impossible for me to ring them as I'm deaf so... I have to text my wife to ring one! :( I seriously do not understand why no NZ taxi companies have banded together, raised some investment and created a good app then strengthened the market in the places that Uber etc don't exist in yet. It's almost like they don't want to be taxis anymore.
  - djsumdog 9y ago
    Because building a basic app is actually pretty complex and there are only 4 million people who live there. It's why all the IT powerhouses (Frondi, Datacom, Catalyst, Sol-sucking-net, etc.) are all based in Wellington and contract out to everyone else. I'm kinda surprised Uber isn't in Dunedin yet though. I know they're in Welly/Auckland .. and I suspect Chch as well.
    - disordinary 9y ago
      There's plenty of taxi apps as well as other ride sharing apps like Zoomy. Often Uber drivers in NZ work for a smaller taxi company and have multiple ride sharing apps on their phone. Building apps is actually simple. I work with one of those large powerhouses and they're actually really bad at it. Smaller teams can usually do a better job. Has nothing to do with population size. Also, I think Uber is in CHCH and the Tron. No doubt Dunedin is in their expansion plans.

What’s stopping them from switching to driving for Uber and Lyft? Whether or not those are devasting to Taxis the fact still remains those systems are superior to traditional Taxis.

ProAm 9y ago

The money is lower, its still a race to the bottom, still essentially financed by VC and both companies hope to eliminate the driver with autonomy.

cwyers 9y ago

Taxi medallions are hellishly expensive. Most of the time, you have a loan to purchase your medallion, that you then spend a long, long time paying off. It's essentially a form of indentured servitude. You can switch to Uber/Lyft. But you still have to pay off that loan for your medallion. And if Uber/Lyft aren't paying the same rate as driving a cab used to, you can find yourself without the money to pay your medallion loan and still make ends meet. That said, I disagree with the headline blaming this on the gig economy. There's lots to blame the gig economy for, but this is pretty squarely showing the flaws in the old medallion system -- that you need a crippling amount of financial debt in your name to participate in the system.

Domenic_S 9y ago
I thought taxi companies owned the medallions -- hoarding them like gold coins -- and charged the driver what amounted to a "rental fee" for using them. IIRC it's unusual for a single driver to own their own medallion. I could be misremembering though.
- lambda 9y ago
  In many cities there would be a mix. Some drivers would rent them from companies, some would own the medallion themselves.
- lazerpants 9y ago
  You're both right. As the medallions increased astronomically in price, only larger groups of drivers or companies could afford to participate.
- noxToken 9y ago
  Basically. From Wikipedia[0]: > Over the years, many medallions once owned by individual drivers were sold to large taxi fleets. As of 2012, about 18% of all taxis were owner operated, while the rest were leased; this is a decline from the 29% ownership rate in 2006. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicabs_of_New_York_City#Logistics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicabs_of_New_York_City#Logi...

zakk 9y ago

> those systems are superior to traditional Taxis. For some definition of superior. For instance, Uber is for sure superior in stripping the taxi drivers of their rights. https://stallman.org/uber.html#abuse https://stallman.org/uber.html#abuse

chrischen 9y ago
1. Superior by offering app-based hailing, real time location updates 2. Ability to share rides 3. Ability to review/report bad behavior (on both driver and customer side)—this along was a notorious problem with cab drivers. And I bet terrible customers used to be rampant too, but they were paying the drivers so nobody cared. 4. No cash. No tip (arguably more controversial thing they got rid of).
- zakk 9y ago
  In the city I live in I can hail a standard taxi with the app of the local taxi company, of course I can share a ride, and I can pay with bank card/credit card. I never had to report bad behaviors, but I could just look at the taxi number, displayed clearly near the dashboard, and report it to the taxi company. I am it that Uber can have minor advantages, but I boycott it due to the huge disadvantages in terms of worker rights. Also they have been working at a loss to kill competitors: refusing to use Uber means defending your right to choose a service in the future.

djsumdog 9y ago

I knew drivers in New Zealand who switched from Wellington Combined to Uber and earned a ton more. But I have a feeling that's not true in most American cities. I've met very few Uber/Lyft drivers here who switched from cabs. Drivers in Seattle earn less and less every year; driving several times more. It would be nice to see some numbers in this article to see comparable rates from all the other app services like Uber/Lyft/Via etc. I mean if it's a $10k/year pay cut .. well then just do it and take night courses to do something else more worthwhile. If it's way more than that; non-sustainable, then you're just going to have to wait for Uber to tank and prices to go back up (you might need to wait a few years).

veb 9y ago
I'm still waiting for one of these companies to show up in Dunedin. Dunedin Taxis charges me nearly $20 for a 6 minute trip home - and their app never works. Sometimes I'm waiting 25 minutes. Also, impossible for me to ring them as I'm deaf so... I have to text my wife to ring one! :( I seriously do not understand why no NZ taxi companies have banded together, raised some investment and created a good app then strengthened the market in the places that Uber etc don't exist in yet. It's almost like they don't want to be taxis anymore.
- djsumdog 9y ago
  Because building a basic app is actually pretty complex and there are only 4 million people who live there. It's why all the IT powerhouses (Frondi, Datacom, Catalyst, Sol-sucking-net, etc.) are all based in Wellington and contract out to everyone else. I'm kinda surprised Uber isn't in Dunedin yet though. I know they're in Welly/Auckland .. and I suspect Chch as well.
  - disordinary 9y ago
    There's plenty of taxi apps as well as other ride sharing apps like Zoomy. Often Uber drivers in NZ work for a smaller taxi company and have multiple ride sharing apps on their phone. Building apps is actually simple. I work with one of those large powerhouses and they're actually really bad at it. Smaller teams can usually do a better job. Has nothing to do with population size. Also, I think Uber is in CHCH and the Tron. No doubt Dunedin is in their expansion plans.