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America's Love Affair with Avocado
- pmorici 9y agoI don't understand how high avocado prices could cause Chipotle to loose money. Guacamole is an optional add on why wouldn't they just raise the price of the guacamole to reflect the market price of avocado or use avocado futures to hedge their price risk.
- tgb 9y agoThat's not what the article claims: > Chipotle, a Mexican-themed restaurant chain, said that “historically high avocado costs” were a big reason why it posted disappointing financial results last year.
- hobs 9y agoWhat do you think disappointing financial results because of Avacados is claiming then?
- mastazi 9y agoparent comment said "that's not what the article claims", which (if you want to be nitpicky) is correct because the article reports a claim made by the company, without explicitly supporting it.
- tgb 9y agoThe post I replied to is claiming that they lose money on each sale of guacamole. (This is clear from bringing up the possibility of raising prices of the optional add on guacamole.) However, this is clearly much stronger claim than merely that Chipotle is doing worse financially than if their avocados cost less.
- traek 9y ago> The post I replied to is claiming that they lose money on each sale of guacamole. (This is clear from bringing up the possibility of raising prices of the optional add on guacamole.) That's not what they're claiming, they're saying that if ingredient prices rise (e.g. for avocados) Chipotle can raise menu costs to protect margins. Nowhere is it implied that guacamole was being sold below-cost.
- tgb 9y agoWell, the comment did say "losing money", but either way, that's not what was claimed in the article and that distinction is exactly what I was pointing out. High margins does not mean that they do well financially, obviously! Unless you think that the original remark was "I don't understand how raising prices could lose business" then this isn't what the article was saying. I don't understand what the confusion is: the article says they do less well financially than they would have if their ingredients were cheaper. The original comment here says "but they can always raise their prices" but that cannot guarantee that they do well financially. If the article had claimed that their margins were too low or that the extreme that they were losing money from each sale, then the first comment would have made sense. But it doesn't.
- ceeker 9y agoThis is the bit that you are missing: >>Some restaurants were forced to add a surcharge on guacamole, or temporarily to scrap it from their menus altogether. Others swallowed the bill. They could raise prices but they have chosen not to so far. They may have to in the future. That explains why their financials were not great.
- nanis 9y agoDemand curves are downward sloping. Guacamole and main items on Chipotle's menu are complements.
- philipodonnell 9y agoRaising prices for a chain like Chiptole is non-trivial. Think about all those menu boards listing the price of adding guacamole, every one of those has to be reprinted, distributed and posted. IT systems updated, etc. Not saying they don't do stuff like that all the time, there's just more of a lag between a commodity price rising and a chains ability to raise the price of the end product. These kinds of decisions are made over fairly long time frames. Someone will be studying the likely effect of each possible price, others are forecasting how long avocado prices might stay high. Lots of disagreements, oh Jim thinks it will stay this high for a year, Mary says another month. Those things have to get worked out before even the decision will be made. It just takes time and it would have to hurt first (sounds like that day is here), but they will eventually raise the price.
- noway421 9y agoAlso, the customers might not be happy. Especially if it was selling at no extra charge.
- sciencesage 9y agoA lot of chains use TV sets to list item pricing now, so that would make it easier. But I agree that it's usually not in the chain's best interest to raise prices often
- 0xJRS 9y agoWhile I think they should, Chipotle does not use screens for their overhead menus
- drawkbox 9y agoProbably a reason they are adding other high margin products like queso to offset shrinking margins on avocado. Guacamole is always expensive but worth it. Though simplicity and just doing the same thing well is really what Chipotle is or was, much like In-N-Out doesn't need gimmicks, just the same good food consistently with well paid employees so it is quality. Hopefully Chipotle doesn't add too many things.
- cvsh 9y agoBased on casual observation of what other customers are ordering from my frequent visits to Chipotle, it seems like queso has been a complete failure. I don't understand why they thought cheese would be something people would pay extra for. A) Cheese is not usually expensive, like avocado, and so not usually considered worth paying extra for 2) Cheese is known not to be healthy, and part of the appeal of Chipotle is the illusion that you're eating healthy food 3) A different kind of cheese is already available for free, so that substitute good is bound to drive down demand for queso I did notice that they recently cut corn tortillas and one (or two?) of the meat options, so they at least seem to be cognizant of the benefits of reducing decision fatigue by concentrating on their best-selling options
- gkgicccj 9y agoWhich cheese are you referring to and why do you think it's not healthy? Genuine q
- Fnoord 9y agoCheese, generally, contains a lot of fat and salt (as in natrium, I think in the USA it is called sodium). We're consuming too much natrium as it is. There are other, cheaper methods of obtaining protein. Some of which are locally available. In Africa, for example, insects are used as local source of protein. They have a low Co2 footprint for a variety of reasons: * Because a lack of transportation (locally available). Especially when compared to trademark protected cheeses such as Gorgonzola. * Barely any land is used and it can be stacked, allowing more space for other land usage (generally that could be forests, or at least not adding to deforestation). * No methane enters the air which directly affects Co2 emissions (which cows, generally the main animal used for cheese, do produce a lot). Compare insects and cheese to avocados: for Europeans avocados are not locally grown, and the deforestation is a "far from my bed" show.
- yinghang 9y agoQdoba, Chipotle's competitor, actually offers guac for free - which is super interesting to me!
- ams6110 9y agoIs there such a thing as imitation guac?
- csa 9y agoI imagine so, but I have not seen it. That said, I see guac thinned all the time with salsa (esp. tomatillo-based salsas).
- schrodinger 9y agoSometimes sour cream, too.
- magic_beans 9y agoThat is criminal.
- newman8r 9y agoThere was a scandal a while back where Kraft was calling a dip 'guacamole' despite having barely any avocado in it: http://articles.latimes.com/2006/nov/30/business/fi-fakeguac30 http://articles.latimes.com/2006/nov/30/business/fi-fakeguac... "We think customers understand that it isn't made from avocado," said Claire Regan, Kraft Foods' vice president of corporate affairs. "All of the ingredients are listed on the label for consumers to reference."
- 0xJRS 9y agoThere is also Moe's which offers guac for free, but the difference is that they give you 2 tbsp instead of the giant serving Chipotle does, which people might prefer to have and dont mind paying for.
- draw_down 9y agoAt your job, has anyone ever asked you to “just” do something?
- thisisit 9y agoI did a casual search and there is no avocado futures. Yet. :) Chipotle has been recovering from a food safety scandal [1]. So they have to tread very carefully. While raising prices might be trivial they can generate a lot of negative publicity. [1]: https://qz.com/968286/chipotle-mexican-grill-cmg-burrito-chain-is-recovering-from-a-food-safety-scandal/ https://qz.com/968286/chipotle-mexican-grill-cmg-burrito-cha...
- dragonwriter 9y ago> I don't understand how high avocado prices could cause Chipotle to loose money. Guacamole is an optional add on why wouldn't they just raise the price of the guacamole to reflect the market price of avocado Potentially because then price sensitive people to whom avocado is important to enjoyment of the Chipotle menu items compared to other meal alternatives will instead not eat at Chipotle, so Chiptle will lose more money.
- nradov 9y agoPrices have also increased because the Phytophthora Root Rot fungal infection has killed off whole avocado orchards in many areas. http://ipm.ucanr.edu/PMG/r8100111.html http://ipm.ucanr.edu/PMG/r8100111.html
- jcadam 9y agoPersonally, I hate avocado in all its forms (guacamole, etc.). I don't understand what people see, err, taste in them. My wife, OTOH, loves avocados (I had never tried avocado before she forced me to sample one while we were dating, which I ineptly pretended to sort of not hate), and if I forget to buy several when I do the shopping, I'll find myself trying to make up a story on the spot about how all the avocados at the grocery store were rotten, or they were out. And then she gives me that "I'm not buying it" look, sighs, rolls her eyes and stops speaking to me for a whole five minutes. EDIT: Ok... Wow, you know this was an attempt at humor, so some of the details may have been embellished a bit. I'll just back away from this thread slowly.
- AznHisoka 9y agoI feel they ruin the taste of sushi as well. I wanna taste the raw fish not the avocado.
- simonsarris 9y agoThis is a strange way to be mean to your wife? I don't get it. EDIT: sorry! Somehow missed the "forget" part of the sentence. I don't eat fruit, I don't like the taste. When I see dried mangoes, I buy them for my girlfriend because she loves them.
- PacifyFish 9y agoHe forgot to buy them. He's not being mean, he's being human.
- axaxs 9y agonearly $2.00 a piece wholesale? I'm curious why the market hasn't been flooded by now. *As pointed out below, it takes at least 5 years for an Avocado tree to produce fruit, which explains why there aren't quick adjustments.
- msandford 9y agoWhat's the lead time on making an avocado tree? Not as bad as making more programmers I'm sure, but it's not fast either.
- kiith_naabal 9y agoYou're not wrong - avocados planted from seed take anywhere from 5 to 13 years+ before they flower and produce fruit. http://ucavo.ucr.edu/general/answers.html http://ucavo.ucr.edu/general/answers.html
- axaxs 9y agoYikes...I should have done the research first. I'll edit, thank you.
- petecox 9y agoWe have a compost bin in the back yard where they sprout from seed spontaneously. I have grown a couple of trees and given some seedlings away to friends. Fingers crossed, they bear fruit eventually. If not, they make a fairly fast growing tree (2m after 3-4 years) - although this week the leaves burn quickly in the summer heat if inadequately watered.
- magic_beans 9y agoI have a large avocado plant that I grew from a pit. At only 2.5 years old, it's about 3 feet tall. Definitely won't be ready for fruit any time soon. Maybe when my grandchildren are born (for the record, I do not yet have children).
- 9y ago
- drawkbox 9y agoAvocado is a great substitute for mayo for losing weight, and in my opinion, better tasting as well.
- Iv 9y agoObligatory Oglaf : https://www.oglaf.com/incubus/ https://www.oglaf.com/incubus/
- jessaustin 9y agoSo much better than "obligatory" XKCD.
- beilabs 9y agoAfraid you have nothing on Australians affair with Avocado. https://www.sbs.com.au/comedy/article/2016/10/17/i-stopped-eating-smashed-avocado-and-now-i-own-castle https://www.sbs.com.au/comedy/article/2016/10/17/i-stopped-e... It's a staple of the Australian diet, fairly certain it's one of the 5 fruits a day over there adorned on the walls of schools across the country. Seriously though, I've seen Avocado go for $6 a piece.....those were hard times.
- neosavvy 9y agoYeah at least it's not the great lime shortage of 2014 https://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/26/upshot/why-everyones-talking-about-the-great-lime-shortage.html https://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/26/upshot/why-everyones-talk...
- twblalock 9y agoDuring the great lime shortage I continued to get a great deal on limes from 99 Ranch. The whole thing was a total joke.
- azinman2 9y agoThe Chinese community has their own sub-market: https://www.wsj.com/articles/why-fruits-and-veggies-are-so-crazy-cheap-in-chinatown-1466762400 https://www.wsj.com/articles/why-fruits-and-veggies-are-so-c...
- natecavanaugh 9y agoThere are 99 ranch's in Australia?! I don't know why, but I love that. Even in the US, it's one of the best places to get produce.
- toomanybeersies 9y agoIf you think those prices are bad, don't go to New Zealand. I have no idea why, but limes are extortionately expensive in New Zealand, even for imported goods. They're currently NZ$35 per kg (over US$10 per lb). It's standard to get a slice of lemon in your Corona (which are also extortionately expensive in NZ)
- mixmastamyk 9y agoWas proud to find out that the Haas avocado is from Southern California, where I grew up eating them and guac on just about everything. Other states used to make fun of that for years, implying we were all yoga hippies that put avocados on our salads FFS. Guess it’s finally caught on elsewhere. Was pleased to find a great selection on a trip to New Zealand recently, though kiwis still have trouble with the concept of guacamole and cal-mex recipes in general. Stiil good with just a spoon and black pepper thankfully.
- azinman2 9y agoAdd some salt and lime juice, maybe ancho chili too :)
- peferron 9y agoOr split it in half, fill the pit holes with vinaigrette, and eat it with a spoon together with bread and butter. Had a lot of fun with that as a kid :)
- magic_beans 9y agoI used to fill the pits with balsamic vinegar and chopped garlic and smear it on rye toast. FANTASTIC.
- scruple 9y agoI lived in Santa Barbara in the mid/late 2000s and absolutely fell in love with the local avocados. They were so cheap back then, too. You could regularly find them for 3/4 for $1. The place I worked at back then, one of the technicians would make a big batch of guacamole every single Wednesday, it was awesome. I'm in Orange County these days. I still eat a lot of avocados (it's part of my normal lunch during the week) but they're so much more expensive today and they're also, unfortunately, rarely local any more.
- ProfessorLayton 9y agoAvocados are delicious, and it seems that demand will continue to rise for the foreseeable future, especially as Latinos become a larger portion of the U.S population.
- zabana 9y agoThis. There's also the vegan hype train that needs to be taken into consideration.
- ramses 9y agoIn addition to latinos and vegans, there is a likely explosion of ketogenic eaters to come very soon, thanks to all the research pilling up about the great benefits of being in ketosis. Avocados are usually part of an omnivorous ketogenic diet.
- cableshaft 9y agoYeah, it's one of the staple superfoods for people on keto, usually. Gives them lots of potassium and all sorts of other goodies that they're missing out on by not eating most fruits.
- njarboe 9y agoLarge stands of avocado orchards around San Diego were not irrigated and died during the last drought due to the expense of water. A bit of a shame considering the time it take to get an avocado tree to produce. Some of the groves were also quite old and the land ripe for development, so that might have played into the decision of letting the orchards die.
- Baeocystin 9y agoI lived across the street from one of those abandoned orchards at the time. One 150' hose later, and the few trees I was able to rescue kept me, my friends, and my family in avocados for several seasons. Still miss living in that place.
- ben174 9y agoNot sure how this contributes to this thread, but I’m nearly 40 years old and have never once tasted an avocado. I was born and raised in California but for some reason I’ve always been repulsed by their appearance. I’ll realize this is ridiculous and will probably get over this at some point.
- conanbatt 9y agoYou live in california and never ate guacamole? I don't think that's even possible.
- Baeocystin 9y agoYou're going to be really sad one day when you finally try one and realize what you've been missing.
- bluthru 9y agoAs a child I thought guacamole looked absolutely disgusting and wouldn't touch it. It's amazing and you must try it.
- zafka 9y agoThat's funny. I am 58 and pretty much felt the same way all my life. Then a year or so ago when I finally got serious about losing the weight that snuck onto my frame from 45 on, I started a low-no carb diet. Suddenly Avacados became my friend. I now eat them in salads multiple times a week. You are going to be surprised. They are quite tasty!!
- radium3d 9y agoAvocados make me feel good and taste delicious, so I eat them.
- rsbartram 9y agoBecause they are exotic. I lived in Brazil and Peru and they are 5 cents. Fantastic!!!
- tchaffee 9y agoFor those who like to eat a half avocado out of the shell with oil and vinegar or other dressing in the hole, try a little soy sauce on its own. Amazing combo.
- PuffinBlue 9y agoIt seems like in the 'West' we only get common access to the Hass Avocado. Certainly in Britain anyway. Having just done a stint in the Caribbean I'm never going to be able to 'enjoy' a Hass Avocado ever again. Compared to whatever the exquisite orbs of heaven that are sold by the roadside in Antigua they are simply not worthy of merit. It's like making a pencil sketch of a lego recreation of the Sistine Chapel and claiming it can in anyway approach the majesty of the 'real' thing. For those adept at identifying varieties of Avocado, here's the one I'm talking about: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkNUJjHJMXY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkNUJjHJMXY