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Evidently blocking math is probably not okay. However, mining is useless without a way to send it back out to the network. I doubt ads need networking capabili

Evidently blocking math is probably not okay. However, mining is useless without a way to send it back out to the network. I doubt ads need networking capabilities - so just prevent that bit. That should do it, as far as I can tell.

nopriorarrests 9y ago
I know a bit about modern ad-tech. Ads absolutely need networking capabilities, for tracking stuff like "viewability", or "anti-fraud, brand safety and independent measurement" by some third-party provider. In fact, you can't get serious marketing budget from reputable brand without having your, err... their ad wrapped inside some JS which does networking calls. Brands want to audit each impression you, as ad-tech firm, will serve on their behalf.
- e1ven 9y ago
  Part of what I find frustrating as a user is that I don't like ANY of those features :) While I'd prefer a model without any advertising (and am willing to pay for it), I can put up with unobtrustive ads, without tracking, like Daringfireball uses. I've worked in adtech before, and I know that these techniques make money, and are important to advertisers. But as a user, I find them intrusive, and they are why I run adblockers.
  - nopriorarrests 9y ago
    Yeah, race to the bottom. Fraud in online advertising estimated to be tens of billions USD yearly, so brands require more and more "brand safety" and "measurements", each ad calls, like, 4 different vendors calculating some metrics, and this, in turn, fuels adblockers growth. Interestingly enough, "walled gardens", like facebook, are big and important enough to bully advertisers into playing by facebook rules, accepting FB measurement standards, without calls to 3rd party vendors. It's only open web which is polluted more and more each year.
    - chiefalchemist 9y ago
      > "It's only open web which is polluted more and more each year." Is water still polluted if more and more and more are willing to chug it?
      - nopriorarrests 9y ago
        I do not think that metaphor holds at all, if "water" is open web and "chugging" means spending advertising dollars there. I don't have a link on hand, but GOOG and FB captured something like 95% of digital advertisement growth in 2017. In other words, out of each new 1$ shifted to digital from TV and print, 95 cents went to duopoly. And advertisers which are still "chugging" open web, installing more and more "filters" and "purifiers" (different anti-fraud and measurement providers). People from digital media are talking about digital media crash. [0] Buzzfeed failed their revenue goal and fired 100 employees. [1] Mashable was sold for peanuts. [2] Business Insider, granddady of ad-monetized clickbait, pushing more and more articles under "BI Prime", which means paid access. A lot of people were clamoring for death of ad-supported publishing on open web. Well, the future is almost here. [0] https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/theres-a-digital-media-crash-but-no-one-will-say-it https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/theres-a-digital-media-... [1] https://www.recode.net/2017/11/29/16715350/buzzfeed-lays-off-100-greg-coleman-jonah-peretti-revenue-miss https://www.recode.net/2017/11/29/16715350/buzzfeed-lays-off... [2] https://www.recode.net/2017/12/5/16735262/ziff-davis-mashable-sold-50-layoffs-pete-cashmore https://www.recode.net/2017/12/5/16735262/ziff-davis-mashabl...
        B1FF_PSUVM 9y ago
        > Business Insider, granddady Now I feel like Methuselah, who played with dinosaurs before the Ark.
        chiefalchemist 9y ago
        Chugging means, the general public is not at all concerned about what it's being subjected to - be it privacy / tracking or the visual pollution of ads. If the market is the decider then I think the market is saying - quite loudly - the water is great to drink.
  - keldaris 9y ago
    As a user I love all of those features. Every single one of them makes my adblockers more effective, not to mention they drive more people to use adblockers. :)
- tinus_hn 9y ago
  Ads absolutely do not need this. One day these capabilities will be taken from the networks and they will survive. The advertisers will take anything they can. It’s up to others to set the limits.
  - nopriorarrests 9y ago
    Will be taken by who? As long as we have publishers and adnetworks allowing this behaviour, money will flow there.
    - tinus_hn 9y ago
      The audience is clawing back their rights using ad blockers and the browser vendors are already limiting tracking by eliminating apis used for tracking and limiting cookies. Ultimately the browser vendors and the users make the rules, not advertisers.
      - chii 9y ago
        but one of the biggest browser is owned by one of the biggest advertisers in the world. you'd expect dive conflict of interest at best, and anticompetitive behaviour at worst, from them.
anfilt 9y ago
Some Ads do you use networking capability. How do you think they do cross domain tracking? I have also seen some ads with chat boxes to either talk to the seller or other people viewing the add.

nopriorarrests 9y ago

I know a bit about modern ad-tech. Ads absolutely need networking capabilities, for tracking stuff like "viewability", or "anti-fraud, brand safety and independent measurement" by some third-party provider. In fact, you can't get serious marketing budget from reputable brand without having your, err... their ad wrapped inside some JS which does networking calls. Brands want to audit each impression you, as ad-tech firm, will serve on their behalf.

e1ven 9y ago
Part of what I find frustrating as a user is that I don't like ANY of those features :) While I'd prefer a model without any advertising (and am willing to pay for it), I can put up with unobtrustive ads, without tracking, like Daringfireball uses. I've worked in adtech before, and I know that these techniques make money, and are important to advertisers. But as a user, I find them intrusive, and they are why I run adblockers.
- nopriorarrests 9y ago
  Yeah, race to the bottom. Fraud in online advertising estimated to be tens of billions USD yearly, so brands require more and more "brand safety" and "measurements", each ad calls, like, 4 different vendors calculating some metrics, and this, in turn, fuels adblockers growth. Interestingly enough, "walled gardens", like facebook, are big and important enough to bully advertisers into playing by facebook rules, accepting FB measurement standards, without calls to 3rd party vendors. It's only open web which is polluted more and more each year.
  - chiefalchemist 9y ago
    > "It's only open web which is polluted more and more each year." Is water still polluted if more and more and more are willing to chug it?
    - nopriorarrests 9y ago
      I do not think that metaphor holds at all, if "water" is open web and "chugging" means spending advertising dollars there. I don't have a link on hand, but GOOG and FB captured something like 95% of digital advertisement growth in 2017. In other words, out of each new 1$ shifted to digital from TV and print, 95 cents went to duopoly. And advertisers which are still "chugging" open web, installing more and more "filters" and "purifiers" (different anti-fraud and measurement providers). People from digital media are talking about digital media crash. [0] Buzzfeed failed their revenue goal and fired 100 employees. [1] Mashable was sold for peanuts. [2] Business Insider, granddady of ad-monetized clickbait, pushing more and more articles under "BI Prime", which means paid access. A lot of people were clamoring for death of ad-supported publishing on open web. Well, the future is almost here. [0] https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/theres-a-digital-media-crash-but-no-one-will-say-it https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/theres-a-digital-media-... [1] https://www.recode.net/2017/11/29/16715350/buzzfeed-lays-off-100-greg-coleman-jonah-peretti-revenue-miss https://www.recode.net/2017/11/29/16715350/buzzfeed-lays-off... [2] https://www.recode.net/2017/12/5/16735262/ziff-davis-mashable-sold-50-layoffs-pete-cashmore https://www.recode.net/2017/12/5/16735262/ziff-davis-mashabl...
      - B1FF_PSUVM 9y ago
        > Business Insider, granddady Now I feel like Methuselah, who played with dinosaurs before the Ark.
      - chiefalchemist 9y ago
        Chugging means, the general public is not at all concerned about what it's being subjected to - be it privacy / tracking or the visual pollution of ads. If the market is the decider then I think the market is saying - quite loudly - the water is great to drink.
- keldaris 9y ago
  As a user I love all of those features. Every single one of them makes my adblockers more effective, not to mention they drive more people to use adblockers. :)
tinus_hn 9y ago
Ads absolutely do not need this. One day these capabilities will be taken from the networks and they will survive. The advertisers will take anything they can. It’s up to others to set the limits.
- nopriorarrests 9y ago
  Will be taken by who? As long as we have publishers and adnetworks allowing this behaviour, money will flow there.
  - tinus_hn 9y ago
    The audience is clawing back their rights using ad blockers and the browser vendors are already limiting tracking by eliminating apis used for tracking and limiting cookies. Ultimately the browser vendors and the users make the rules, not advertisers.
    - chii 9y ago
      but one of the biggest browser is owned by one of the biggest advertisers in the world. you'd expect dive conflict of interest at best, and anticompetitive behaviour at worst, from them.

anfilt 9y ago

Some Ads do you use networking capability. How do you think they do cross domain tracking? I have also seen some ads with chat boxes to either talk to the seller or other people viewing the add.