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By way of extreme stereotypes, accepting blurriness in the middle: Project management usually takes some fixed bundle of work and aims to ensure it is within s
by jacques_chester 9y ago
By way of extreme stereotypes, accepting blurriness in the middle:
Project management usually takes some fixed bundle of work and aims to ensure it is within scope, on time, on budget, to acceptable quality. The typical focus is to optimise for efficiency. If it is more efficient to build concrete pylons and then sling cables, that's what happens.
Product management tends to focus on what should be built and in what order. There is less focus on execution and more on understanding what the problem is -- or whether there is a problem. The typical focus is to optimise for value. If more user or business value comes from throwing a rope bridge, followed by a single lane suspension bridge, followed by a concrete bridge, that's the order the product manager will likely pick, even if it costs more and takes longer to get to the final stage.
Product management is more typical in software, where the ability to quickly iterate on or replace a product is available. Project management is more typical of problems where the cost of change is very high (construction, civil works, spaceflight etc), creating a strong incentive to do the thing once.
- dozzie 9y ago> Project management usually takes some fixed bundle of work and aims to ensure it is within scope, on time, on budget, to acceptable quality. And project manager does that by what means? What useful things can a project manager do to achieve these goals? Barring telling the team how to do their work (micromanagement) and reordering project goals (this is supposed to be product manager's job).
- rahimnathwani 9y agoYour comment suggests that all work involved in delivering something is either (i) setting and prioritising goals, or (ii) doing the work to achieve those goals. But there are other things that a good project manager can do in some situations, particularly around driving consensus around coordination between different teams when things are changing a lot, and figuring out ways that re-allocating resources can unblock other teams, and so deliver the project earlier overall. BUT many people with the job title 'project manager' aren't really doing those things, either because those things don't need doing in the organization where they work, or because they lack the skills/drive to do them. Even if you haven't worked in a project that required a project manager, or met a good project manager, it doesn't mean these things don't exist. (I'm not a project manager btw, and the things a project manager needs to do are not among my favourite tasks, although I do them when required.)
- dozzie 9y agoSo it's a list of things that may be done if we have an (almost mythical) good manager at hand and the organization in the company is right? Not a list of concrete responsibilities that just come with the position and if the guy doesn't fulfil them he's outright incompetent? Then again, what is the difference between fundamental responsibilities of project and product manager? The ones that need to be done by one and cannot be done by the other.
- rahimnathwani 9y agoJust like not every situation requires a bricklayer, and not every person claiming to be a bricklayer is actually competent at building walls. Your second question is answered here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16240377 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16240377
- jacques_chester 9y agoI think this is a bit of a false dichotomy. You can investigate, coordinate and herd cats without micromanaging. I don't see construction managers telling brickies how to spread mortar, but they will keep an eye on the rate of bricklaying and ask what's happening when it falls below normal.
- seanmcdirmid 9y agoThat’s strange. At Microsoft, project management works with the dev and design teams to define and order the development of features. Product management is primarily a marketing job and you might not ever meet one was an engineer.
- rahimnathwani 9y agoI've heard that at the MS role that most closely matches the Product Manager role at Amazon/Google/FB is called 'Program Manager'. Which is strange, because for anyone not working at Microsoft, a Program Manager is someone who manages a programme of (multiple) projects. Which is like an uber-project-manager, rather than a product manager.
- jacques_chester 9y agoI'm at Pivotal, it's where I first learned of the distinction in roles. If I was at MS I'd happily call that person a project manager, so long as I knew someone was focusing on that facet of the problem.