8 ms·

Oculus Start: Technical and Financial Resources for Beginning VR Developers

89 points by indescions_2018 9y ago

staunch 9y ago
VR is still like tablets and PDAs before the iPhone and iPad. No surprise that Zuck hasn't done what Jobs did. I'm enjoying (in a friendly way) that many people have already given up on the technology and think it's going to fade away again. Because anyone that doubts VR is real and going mainstream is going to be in for quite a surprise! Oculus is still figuring out what the killer app for VR is, which means they've done a pretty bad job. That's what has slowed progress so much. Even this attempt at encouraging developers is weak. Where's the actual funding?! It's almost as if they don't get how big what they're doing is. To be fair though, transforming computing can take many months even in the modern world. Oculus should put games on the back burner and ask themselves what really cool life-improving things they could do with VR if they weren't limited by consumer pricing. They need to jump start the industry with a truly compelling experience and that might not be easy at $300. Business customers can afford much, much more. Just like VisiCalc launched the personal computer, so could a VR app that enables virtual offices, for example. Every tech worker could be afforded a $1-$3k head mounted display if it improved their productivity even slightly. Something like a 16K-16K display. That's a solid multi-billion dollar business that they can use to bring the amazing version mainstream. VR could plausibly trigger a seismic shift towards remote work, transforming cities, economies, and the world. That ought to be a big enough thing to get VR off the ground initially.
- ericflo 9y ago
  They are too busy trying to build a walled garden. They hired a bunch of console people and they see everything from that perspective, so the main goal is to sign exclusives to short term gaming hits as a way of getting more users locked into their services, not to create a general computing platform.
  - whywhywhywhy 9y ago
    You're not locked into their service at all, you can use Steam VR content on it and you can run arbitrary .exes on it. It's less of a walled garden than tablets, smartphones or consoles which almost everyone just seems fine with.
    - ericflo 9y ago
      We're finding out the cost, now, of the extreme centralization of these platforms, especially caused by their device-locked app stores. Doubling down on the idea because people "seem fine with" it is a bad idea, especially now that we have hindsight. It's no mistake that the big innovation of the era, cryptocurrency, is happening largely outside of all the platforms you listed. Also, I know that you can run SteamVR apps - I develop a VR game with hundreds of thousands of dollars in sales on Steam, but I've been locked out of the Oculus store for...unknown reasons? Someone behind the black box must've made a decision to block it.
      - pjmlp 9y ago
        We were always fine with it, PCs were the outliers. I never had any big issue having to deal with Spectrums, C64, Atari, Amiga, PC and their exclusives. Likewise with all the game consoles I've owned.
    - ryukafalz 9y ago
      I think the lock-in is more regarding Oculus-exclusive content. My understanding is the community has mostly gotten those working on other headsets by now, but Oculus itself certainly hasn't helped.
- ybrah 9y ago
  I've owned an HTC vive for a while now. Throughout all experiences, the ones that stood out the most to me were the social ones. I thoroughly believe that the future of work from home meetings will be done in VR. Playing social games and being able to convey messages through mic + body language and hand gestures is a very interesting experience. I have communicated with people who do not have any microphones, using simple hand gestures combined with motion.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
- whywhywhywhy 9y ago
  > Oculus should put games on the back burner To be fair Oculus are one of the ones in the industry looking beyond games. Look at Oculus Medium[1], it makes something that was extremely fiddly and required hours of practice into something instantly intuitive. I don't actually think VR will hit the mainstream, work like spreadsheets just don't benefit much from being in 3D space. The true magic of VR is the hand tracking, being able to interact with computing with both hands in 3D space. Definitely feel VR will find it's workplace niche in the creative space rather than standard office work. Worth mentioning too that games are an innovation driver, so don't discount them so fast. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_m1Jm_Osxls https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_m1Jm_Osxls
  - andybak 9y ago
    Agree about the creative space but I'd like to point out there's several high quality content creation apps from other sources: https://www.gravitysketch.com/ https://www.gravitysketch.com/ https://www.masterpiecevr.com/ https://www.masterpiecevr.com/ http://lyravr.com/ http://lyravr.com/ http://nvrmind.io/animvr/ http://nvrmind.io/animvr/ http://store.steampowered.com/app/606920/EXA_The_Infinite_Instrument/ http://store.steampowered.com/app/606920/EXA_The_Infinite_In... https://mindshow.com/ https://mindshow.com/ That's not even mentioned lots of other non-game applications. I've been trying to keep tabs on what's available on Steam and the Oculus Store: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xwqLF3CpYWxZ6kipzWGHaBn8rKPsptKxRCfHjVngxzA/edit?usp=sharing https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xwqLF3CpYWxZ6kipzWGH...
    - nickthegreek 9y ago
      Medium is hands down the best 3d sculpting app that's on VR right now. I was also incredibly impressed with what mindshow was capable of.
  - banderman 9y ago
    There are a lot of potential medical applications that will benefit from VR. Inspecting 3D x-rays especially. Real estate virtual tours, interior design, architecture...
- deleted 9y ago
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- deepnotderp 9y ago
  What's wrong with gaming in VR?
  - SimonPStevens 9y ago
    I think what he is saying is that gaming is just a small part of what VR could be, so it shouldn't be the focus. Imagine if the PC sector totally ignored all PC uses except gaming, it would still exist, but it would be a much smaller market.
  - flohofwoe 9y ago
    VR gaming is the very definition of 'niche': - VR only works well for some (fairly unpopular) gaming genres, like hardcore flight- and car-racing simulations - it's expensive besides the headset you need a powerful gaming PC at a time when the majority of 'normal' people just use their mobile phone for some light gaming - wearing a VR headset for more than 30 minutes becomes really uncomfortable - the new sensation quickly wears off, same as motion controls, everyone is back to gamepad, or mouse+keyboard - even though VR is available for mobile phones, it's not common to hang around in public with a VR headset on
    - thenomad 9y ago
      It's also extremely good for RPGs and MMOs, neither of which are unpopular genres. We haven't seen a lot of either yet, because both require considerable investment, but the first VR MMO, Orbus, is going very well, and Skyrim VR on PSVR is one of the first VR apps to really sell headsets. (My own VR RPG also did very well, and convinced me it's a great use of the medium.)
    - andybak 9y ago
      > VR only works well for some (fairly unpopular) gaming genres, like hardcore flight- and car-racing simulations Those two genres are a strange choice considering the most popular VR titles fall into entirely different categories. The VR gaming ecosystem is actually fairly diverse. The main issue is 1. too many shooters and online multiplayer titles 2. Most games are short (mainly because the economics of the size of the market pushed things that way right now) > wearing a VR headset for more than 30 minutes becomes really uncomfortable I'd dispute "Really". Very much depends on the headset. > the new sensation quickly wears off, same as motion controls, everyone is back to gamepad, or mouse+keyboard This isn't true for me and many others. I'm over a year in and still regularly have that "wow" moment again. I don't think we've scratched the surface of what's possible in VR even with the current technological limitations.
- taneq 9y ago
  No-one wants to wear a VR headset for their day job. Well, I'm sure there are a few, but even among us tech fanatics it's rare. Honestly I think the best application so far has been spicing up amusement park rides. Some of those new VR rollercoasters look amazing.
  - tw1010 9y ago
    "No-one wants to sit in front of a computer screen for 12 hours per day." "640K ought to be enough for anybody."
    - taneq 9y ago
      I'm not saying nobody wants to use VR in their day job. Hell, I'd love to! But I also don't want to wear an HMD (as they currently exist) because they're big and clunky and sweaty.
      - JibJabLab 9y ago
        I think that's kind of the point of OP. Oculus needs to design a lightweight, comfortable version that won't be bothersome after a few hours. Not everything needs to be software.
    - ddrdrck_ 9y ago
      In which country do you do office work 12 hours per day ? More importantly : no one is forced to look at their computer screen for 8 or even 12 hours a day. You can take a break when you want. You can stare at the window or the roof or your nails every 5 minutes if you want. On the contrary, with a VR headset, you would have to pull it off even for a 2 seconds break. It would be a nightmare, no one is going to accept that and no one should be forced to do that (except maybe in North Korea ?) This is one of the reasons VR will disappear once again. On the contrary, AR (augmented reality, e.g. hololens) may very well be the next big thing, once they resolve the current issues with hololens (resolution and most importantly field of vision)
      - 9y ago
- debt 9y ago
  “Something like a 16K-16K display. That's a solid multi-billion dollar business that they can use to bring the amazing version mainstream.” But that doesn’t exist!
- pjmlp 9y ago
  > Oculus should put games on the back burner and ask themselves what really cool life-improving things they could do with VR if they weren't limited by consumer pricing. Or as Alan Kay puts it, imagine what you would like to have 15 year from now, not what you can get today (or something like that, paraphrasing).
  - 52-6F-62 9y ago
    The one thing I consistently wish for, and maybe I should get on it... Field trips. Highly accurate (to the best of our ability) and high quality, free-roam field trips. Present day, or through time. I would LOVE to visit historical sites from various time periods, to see them in their (as known) beginning, prime, and decay. The amount of research and work to be done to accomplish that would be staggering... but the potential for improved global and historical understanding, the impact on education, and just weeknight entertainment would be immense. I've seen a couple primitive efforts, and they were a bit disappointing. Let me walk around a living 19th century England. Let me visit Dylan Thomas in his writing cabin. Let me see the Parthenon and Han Dynasty China. I would love to have this 15 years from now. Sooner, if possible!
    - ipsum2 9y ago
      Google is offering something like this for kids now. Guided tours around famous historical places in Cardboard: https://edu.google.com/expeditions/ https://edu.google.com/expeditions/
      - 52-6F-62 9y ago
        Thanks for passing that along. It's a step in the right direction. I want, greedily, a fully immersive, interactive view of historical places in their time, or at different times. I'll definitely have a look at this, though.
- jamesrcole 9y ago
  > Oculus is still figuring out what the killer app for VR is, which means they've done a pretty bad job. [...] To be fair though, transforming computing can take many months even in the modern world. It can take years or decades (or more) for people to figure out how to really use a new technology. People tend to assume that the sorts of timescales that apply to applied research or product development, apply to cases like this (figuring out what to do with VR) which are basic research.
- panic 9y ago
  Here's a free startup idea: the "mirror cafe". Two cafes, one in SF, one in NYC, with exactly the same layout inside (down to the positions of the tables). VR links the two spaces together. Once you put on the headset, you can see and talk to people in both places. You'd be able to "grab a coffee" with someone across the country (though you'd have to drink it with a straw to keep the coffee cup from colliding with the HMD)!
  - andybak 9y ago
    That's very neat. I think there's a lot of power in having physical spaces mapped to VR. Essentially you can simulate what AR will be like in 10 years without having to wait.
- flohofwoe 9y ago
  > To be fair though, transforming computing can take many months even in the modern world. I'm can't think of anything that has transformed computing within months out of nowhere. Usually decades of research and trial-and-error happen before everything falls into place and a new way to do things becomes 'obvious' within a short time. But you cannot ignore the decades of work that went into it, even if it isn't visible from the outside. VR is no exception, it's the 3rd decade (or more?) of serious VR research, and I guess it takes a few more decades until everything falls into place and VR becomes 'obvious' (or more likely, disappear from the public for another 20 years until the next hype cycle). Still, what happens right now is very important work for the coming generations.
- Kiro 9y ago
  How have you missed VRChat? It's taking over. That's the killer app right there.
  - phowat 9y ago
    Your comment got me curious, so I went on VRChat's steam page. This was the second "most helpful" review: " Today I sat at a virtual bar and pretended to drink with a cat, a xenomorph, and a tiny anime girl. What am I doing with my life. UPDATE: So a bunch of bu's from dragon ball just invaded a cafe I was working in and started asking if we wanted to invest in bitcoin. I can't make this stuff up. This is their discord; <address> " If that's the killer app, I wouldn't be too optimistic.
    - banderman 9y ago
      Maybe some people don't remember how popular chat rooms were back in the AOL days?
      - aruggirello 9y ago
        IIRC there was a lot of kicking and banning... so what does a kick look like in the glory of VR???
    - 52-6F-62 9y ago
      Clearly you've never MS Comic Chatted ;) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Comic_Chat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Comic_Chat
    - VectorLock 9y ago
      Try searching youtube for 'Uganda Knuckles' That seems to be the "killer app" for VRChat.
    - krapp 9y ago
      >If that's the killer app, I wouldn't be too optimistic. You could have said the same thing about the internet after seeing the web in Mosaic. People are using VR Chat, and adoption alone is what makes a "killer app." Complexity and depth and such can come later, but only after the masses have cared long enough to build on the foundation.
- empath75 9y ago
  I’ve said this since before vr was released, but the closest analogy is sound cards and 3D video cards when they were first released. Most people with PCs weren’t spending $100 for a sound blaster so they could play games. They waited until sound just came with PCs. VR won’t be a thing until headsets just start coming with new computers, and the base models of new computers have video cards fast enough to run them. It might take 5-10 years before that happens.
  - machinehermit 9y ago
    Totally agree, still a decade off at least. For me that is what makes it interesting though that you can still get in at the ground floor and have plenty of time to figure out things and be an expert before the crowd.
    - talmand 9y ago
      A decade is a long, long time for such things.
  - talmand 9y ago
    What we'll have 5-10 years from now will be far, far more advanced than what we have now, unless it all collapses. If the market for them holds steady I expect we'll start seeing package deals within a couple of years.
deleted 9y ago
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Kyragem 9y ago
VR will never have mass market adoption if they don't solve VR sickness first. Recent studies even show that it especially affects women due to physiological differences in visual and vestibular systems and may explains why only 5% of oculus/vive owners are females. Instead of funding lots of mediocre games, Oculus should really dedicate some resources in solving this particular problem, which excludes a large portion of our population from using VR.
- fooker 9y ago
  What percent of early adopters (of any tech) are women? What percent of pre-order game sales are attributed to women? If neither is significantly greater than 5%, your point doesn't hold up.
  - Kyragem 9y ago
    Video games have shown a gender parity for the past 10 years. 76% of facebook users are female. Blatantly ignoring and excluding this demographic is going to be the nail in the coffin of VR. ....but who knows maybe VR's 3rd wave in 2028 will get it right?
- PostOnce 9y ago
  Plenty of wildly successful mass market products from videogames to deodorant are marketed specifically to men, some always have been -- there are a few billion men after all. There's no reason women necessarily have to buy a product for it to be either successful or viable, and vice versa, products solely for women can also be a huge success. VR will get better; focusing on women who are far less likely to spend thousands of dollars on a hardcore gaming setup is not sane. I know a guy who bought, successively, a PS3, a high-end PC, and a PS4... and a copy of GTAV for each. How many women spend that kind of money gaming? Who is the average customer for a racing wheel, a flight yoke, a VR headset, an arcade fight stick, a set of 3 curved LCDs, etc? Your argument is an appeal to prevailing politics and emotion, not market logic and economics.
  - Kyragem 9y ago
lobo_tuerto 9y ago
If you select Mexico from the dropdown menu, the whole form just disappears, no feedback, no info, nada. That's cold. They should be more inclusive if they want to find that VR "golden thread". But this, this is not the way to do it. Why even include countries that are not eligible on the dropdown? Maybe just a case of bad UX I guess.
- topgunsarg 9y ago
  Sounds more like a bug than they just decided to hide the entire form from people who select Mexico...although I didn't bother to start the application process to verify that.
  - lobo_tuerto 9y ago
    Well, I just checked now, and they have removed Mexico and the other non-participant countries from the list now.
joeevans1000 9y ago
VR is cool regardless if it's going to take off. Unfortunately for Oculus, the Vive won this race. It's so much better as hardware. Further, when Facebook bought Oculus it became clear it was only a matter of time before the Rift was going to be contaminated with the increasingly unpopular (with young people, anyway) Facebook products. Oculus was a failure for Facebook, or, rather, Facebook was the failure of Oculus.

VR is still like tablets and PDAs before the iPhone and iPad. No surprise that Zuck hasn't done what Jobs did. I'm enjoying (in a friendly way) that many people have already given up on the technology and think it's going to fade away again. Because anyone that doubts VR is real and going mainstream is going to be in for quite a surprise! Oculus is still figuring out what the killer app for VR is, which means they've done a pretty bad job. That's what has slowed progress so much. Even this attempt at encouraging developers is weak. Where's the actual funding?! It's almost as if they don't get how big what they're doing is. To be fair though, transforming computing can take many months even in the modern world. Oculus should put games on the back burner and ask themselves what really cool life-improving things they could do with VR if they weren't limited by consumer pricing. They need to jump start the industry with a truly compelling experience and that might not be easy at $300. Business customers can afford much, much more. Just like VisiCalc launched the personal computer, so could a VR app that enables virtual offices, for example. Every tech worker could be afforded a $1-$3k head mounted display if it improved their productivity even slightly. Something like a 16K-16K display. That's a solid multi-billion dollar business that they can use to bring the amazing version mainstream. VR could plausibly trigger a seismic shift towards remote work, transforming cities, economies, and the world. That ought to be a big enough thing to get VR off the ground initially.

ericflo 9y ago
They are too busy trying to build a walled garden. They hired a bunch of console people and they see everything from that perspective, so the main goal is to sign exclusives to short term gaming hits as a way of getting more users locked into their services, not to create a general computing platform.
- whywhywhywhy 9y ago
  You're not locked into their service at all, you can use Steam VR content on it and you can run arbitrary .exes on it. It's less of a walled garden than tablets, smartphones or consoles which almost everyone just seems fine with.
  - ericflo 9y ago
    We're finding out the cost, now, of the extreme centralization of these platforms, especially caused by their device-locked app stores. Doubling down on the idea because people "seem fine with" it is a bad idea, especially now that we have hindsight. It's no mistake that the big innovation of the era, cryptocurrency, is happening largely outside of all the platforms you listed. Also, I know that you can run SteamVR apps - I develop a VR game with hundreds of thousands of dollars in sales on Steam, but I've been locked out of the Oculus store for...unknown reasons? Someone behind the black box must've made a decision to block it.
    - pjmlp 9y ago
      We were always fine with it, PCs were the outliers. I never had any big issue having to deal with Spectrums, C64, Atari, Amiga, PC and their exclusives. Likewise with all the game consoles I've owned.
  - ryukafalz 9y ago
    I think the lock-in is more regarding Oculus-exclusive content. My understanding is the community has mostly gotten those working on other headsets by now, but Oculus itself certainly hasn't helped.
ybrah 9y ago
I've owned an HTC vive for a while now. Throughout all experiences, the ones that stood out the most to me were the social ones. I thoroughly believe that the future of work from home meetings will be done in VR. Playing social games and being able to convey messages through mic + body language and hand gestures is a very interesting experience. I have communicated with people who do not have any microphones, using simple hand gestures combined with motion.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
whywhywhywhy 9y ago
> Oculus should put games on the back burner To be fair Oculus are one of the ones in the industry looking beyond games. Look at Oculus Medium[1], it makes something that was extremely fiddly and required hours of practice into something instantly intuitive. I don't actually think VR will hit the mainstream, work like spreadsheets just don't benefit much from being in 3D space. The true magic of VR is the hand tracking, being able to interact with computing with both hands in 3D space. Definitely feel VR will find it's workplace niche in the creative space rather than standard office work. Worth mentioning too that games are an innovation driver, so don't discount them so fast. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_m1Jm_Osxls https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_m1Jm_Osxls
- andybak 9y ago
  Agree about the creative space but I'd like to point out there's several high quality content creation apps from other sources: https://www.gravitysketch.com/ https://www.gravitysketch.com/ https://www.masterpiecevr.com/ https://www.masterpiecevr.com/ http://lyravr.com/ http://lyravr.com/ http://nvrmind.io/animvr/ http://nvrmind.io/animvr/ http://store.steampowered.com/app/606920/EXA_The_Infinite_Instrument/ http://store.steampowered.com/app/606920/EXA_The_Infinite_In... https://mindshow.com/ https://mindshow.com/ That's not even mentioned lots of other non-game applications. I've been trying to keep tabs on what's available on Steam and the Oculus Store: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xwqLF3CpYWxZ6kipzWGHaBn8rKPsptKxRCfHjVngxzA/edit?usp=sharing https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xwqLF3CpYWxZ6kipzWGH...
  - nickthegreek 9y ago
    Medium is hands down the best 3d sculpting app that's on VR right now. I was also incredibly impressed with what mindshow was capable of.
- banderman 9y ago
  There are a lot of potential medical applications that will benefit from VR. Inspecting 3D x-rays especially. Real estate virtual tours, interior design, architecture...
deleted 9y ago
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deepnotderp 9y ago
What's wrong with gaming in VR?
- SimonPStevens 9y ago
  I think what he is saying is that gaming is just a small part of what VR could be, so it shouldn't be the focus. Imagine if the PC sector totally ignored all PC uses except gaming, it would still exist, but it would be a much smaller market.
- flohofwoe 9y ago
  VR gaming is the very definition of 'niche': - VR only works well for some (fairly unpopular) gaming genres, like hardcore flight- and car-racing simulations - it's expensive besides the headset you need a powerful gaming PC at a time when the majority of 'normal' people just use their mobile phone for some light gaming - wearing a VR headset for more than 30 minutes becomes really uncomfortable - the new sensation quickly wears off, same as motion controls, everyone is back to gamepad, or mouse+keyboard - even though VR is available for mobile phones, it's not common to hang around in public with a VR headset on
  - thenomad 9y ago
    It's also extremely good for RPGs and MMOs, neither of which are unpopular genres. We haven't seen a lot of either yet, because both require considerable investment, but the first VR MMO, Orbus, is going very well, and Skyrim VR on PSVR is one of the first VR apps to really sell headsets. (My own VR RPG also did very well, and convinced me it's a great use of the medium.)
  - andybak 9y ago
    > VR only works well for some (fairly unpopular) gaming genres, like hardcore flight- and car-racing simulations Those two genres are a strange choice considering the most popular VR titles fall into entirely different categories. The VR gaming ecosystem is actually fairly diverse. The main issue is 1. too many shooters and online multiplayer titles 2. Most games are short (mainly because the economics of the size of the market pushed things that way right now) > wearing a VR headset for more than 30 minutes becomes really uncomfortable I'd dispute "Really". Very much depends on the headset. > the new sensation quickly wears off, same as motion controls, everyone is back to gamepad, or mouse+keyboard This isn't true for me and many others. I'm over a year in and still regularly have that "wow" moment again. I don't think we've scratched the surface of what's possible in VR even with the current technological limitations.
taneq 9y ago
No-one wants to wear a VR headset for their day job. Well, I'm sure there are a few, but even among us tech fanatics it's rare. Honestly I think the best application so far has been spicing up amusement park rides. Some of those new VR rollercoasters look amazing.
- tw1010 9y ago
  "No-one wants to sit in front of a computer screen for 12 hours per day." "640K ought to be enough for anybody."
  - taneq 9y ago
    I'm not saying nobody wants to use VR in their day job. Hell, I'd love to! But I also don't want to wear an HMD (as they currently exist) because they're big and clunky and sweaty.
    - JibJabLab 9y ago
      I think that's kind of the point of OP. Oculus needs to design a lightweight, comfortable version that won't be bothersome after a few hours. Not everything needs to be software.
  - ddrdrck_ 9y ago
    In which country do you do office work 12 hours per day ? More importantly : no one is forced to look at their computer screen for 8 or even 12 hours a day. You can take a break when you want. You can stare at the window or the roof or your nails every 5 minutes if you want. On the contrary, with a VR headset, you would have to pull it off even for a 2 seconds break. It would be a nightmare, no one is going to accept that and no one should be forced to do that (except maybe in North Korea ?) This is one of the reasons VR will disappear once again. On the contrary, AR (augmented reality, e.g. hololens) may very well be the next big thing, once they resolve the current issues with hololens (resolution and most importantly field of vision)
    - 9y ago
debt 9y ago
“Something like a 16K-16K display. That's a solid multi-billion dollar business that they can use to bring the amazing version mainstream.” But that doesn’t exist!
pjmlp 9y ago
> Oculus should put games on the back burner and ask themselves what really cool life-improving things they could do with VR if they weren't limited by consumer pricing. Or as Alan Kay puts it, imagine what you would like to have 15 year from now, not what you can get today (or something like that, paraphrasing).
- 52-6F-62 9y ago
  The one thing I consistently wish for, and maybe I should get on it... Field trips. Highly accurate (to the best of our ability) and high quality, free-roam field trips. Present day, or through time. I would LOVE to visit historical sites from various time periods, to see them in their (as known) beginning, prime, and decay. The amount of research and work to be done to accomplish that would be staggering... but the potential for improved global and historical understanding, the impact on education, and just weeknight entertainment would be immense. I've seen a couple primitive efforts, and they were a bit disappointing. Let me walk around a living 19th century England. Let me visit Dylan Thomas in his writing cabin. Let me see the Parthenon and Han Dynasty China. I would love to have this 15 years from now. Sooner, if possible!
  - ipsum2 9y ago
    Google is offering something like this for kids now. Guided tours around famous historical places in Cardboard: https://edu.google.com/expeditions/ https://edu.google.com/expeditions/
    - 52-6F-62 9y ago
      Thanks for passing that along. It's a step in the right direction. I want, greedily, a fully immersive, interactive view of historical places in their time, or at different times. I'll definitely have a look at this, though.
jamesrcole 9y ago
> Oculus is still figuring out what the killer app for VR is, which means they've done a pretty bad job. [...] To be fair though, transforming computing can take many months even in the modern world. It can take years or decades (or more) for people to figure out how to really use a new technology. People tend to assume that the sorts of timescales that apply to applied research or product development, apply to cases like this (figuring out what to do with VR) which are basic research.
panic 9y ago
Here's a free startup idea: the "mirror cafe". Two cafes, one in SF, one in NYC, with exactly the same layout inside (down to the positions of the tables). VR links the two spaces together. Once you put on the headset, you can see and talk to people in both places. You'd be able to "grab a coffee" with someone across the country (though you'd have to drink it with a straw to keep the coffee cup from colliding with the HMD)!
- andybak 9y ago
  That's very neat. I think there's a lot of power in having physical spaces mapped to VR. Essentially you can simulate what AR will be like in 10 years without having to wait.
flohofwoe 9y ago
> To be fair though, transforming computing can take many months even in the modern world. I'm can't think of anything that has transformed computing within months out of nowhere. Usually decades of research and trial-and-error happen before everything falls into place and a new way to do things becomes 'obvious' within a short time. But you cannot ignore the decades of work that went into it, even if it isn't visible from the outside. VR is no exception, it's the 3rd decade (or more?) of serious VR research, and I guess it takes a few more decades until everything falls into place and VR becomes 'obvious' (or more likely, disappear from the public for another 20 years until the next hype cycle). Still, what happens right now is very important work for the coming generations.
Kiro 9y ago
How have you missed VRChat? It's taking over. That's the killer app right there.
- phowat 9y ago
  Your comment got me curious, so I went on VRChat's steam page. This was the second "most helpful" review: " Today I sat at a virtual bar and pretended to drink with a cat, a xenomorph, and a tiny anime girl. What am I doing with my life. UPDATE: So a bunch of bu's from dragon ball just invaded a cafe I was working in and started asking if we wanted to invest in bitcoin. I can't make this stuff up. This is their discord; <address> " If that's the killer app, I wouldn't be too optimistic.
  - banderman 9y ago
    Maybe some people don't remember how popular chat rooms were back in the AOL days?
    - aruggirello 9y ago
      IIRC there was a lot of kicking and banning... so what does a kick look like in the glory of VR???
  - 52-6F-62 9y ago
    Clearly you've never MS Comic Chatted ;) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Comic_Chat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Comic_Chat
  - VectorLock 9y ago
    Try searching youtube for 'Uganda Knuckles' That seems to be the "killer app" for VRChat.
  - krapp 9y ago
    >If that's the killer app, I wouldn't be too optimistic. You could have said the same thing about the internet after seeing the web in Mosaic. People are using VR Chat, and adoption alone is what makes a "killer app." Complexity and depth and such can come later, but only after the masses have cared long enough to build on the foundation.
empath75 9y ago
I’ve said this since before vr was released, but the closest analogy is sound cards and 3D video cards when they were first released. Most people with PCs weren’t spending $100 for a sound blaster so they could play games. They waited until sound just came with PCs. VR won’t be a thing until headsets just start coming with new computers, and the base models of new computers have video cards fast enough to run them. It might take 5-10 years before that happens.
- machinehermit 9y ago
  Totally agree, still a decade off at least. For me that is what makes it interesting though that you can still get in at the ground floor and have plenty of time to figure out things and be an expert before the crowd.
  - talmand 9y ago
    A decade is a long, long time for such things.
- talmand 9y ago
  What we'll have 5-10 years from now will be far, far more advanced than what we have now, unless it all collapses. If the market for them holds steady I expect we'll start seeing package deals within a couple of years.

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Kyragem 9y ago

VR will never have mass market adoption if they don't solve VR sickness first. Recent studies even show that it especially affects women due to physiological differences in visual and vestibular systems and may explains why only 5% of oculus/vive owners are females. Instead of funding lots of mediocre games, Oculus should really dedicate some resources in solving this particular problem, which excludes a large portion of our population from using VR.

fooker 9y ago
What percent of early adopters (of any tech) are women? What percent of pre-order game sales are attributed to women? If neither is significantly greater than 5%, your point doesn't hold up.
- Kyragem 9y ago
  Video games have shown a gender parity for the past 10 years. 76% of facebook users are female. Blatantly ignoring and excluding this demographic is going to be the nail in the coffin of VR. ....but who knows maybe VR's 3rd wave in 2028 will get it right?
PostOnce 9y ago
Plenty of wildly successful mass market products from videogames to deodorant are marketed specifically to men, some always have been -- there are a few billion men after all. There's no reason women necessarily have to buy a product for it to be either successful or viable, and vice versa, products solely for women can also be a huge success. VR will get better; focusing on women who are far less likely to spend thousands of dollars on a hardcore gaming setup is not sane. I know a guy who bought, successively, a PS3, a high-end PC, and a PS4... and a copy of GTAV for each. How many women spend that kind of money gaming? Who is the average customer for a racing wheel, a flight yoke, a VR headset, an arcade fight stick, a set of 3 curved LCDs, etc? Your argument is an appeal to prevailing politics and emotion, not market logic and economics.
- Kyragem 9y ago

lobo_tuerto 9y ago

If you select Mexico from the dropdown menu, the whole form just disappears, no feedback, no info, nada. That's cold. They should be more inclusive if they want to find that VR "golden thread". But this, this is not the way to do it. Why even include countries that are not eligible on the dropdown? Maybe just a case of bad UX I guess.

topgunsarg 9y ago
Sounds more like a bug than they just decided to hide the entire form from people who select Mexico...although I didn't bother to start the application process to verify that.
- lobo_tuerto 9y ago
  Well, I just checked now, and they have removed Mexico and the other non-participant countries from the list now.

joeevans1000 9y ago

VR is cool regardless if it's going to take off. Unfortunately for Oculus, the Vive won this race. It's so much better as hardware. Further, when Facebook bought Oculus it became clear it was only a matter of time before the Rift was going to be contaminated with the increasingly unpopular (with young people, anyway) Facebook products. Oculus was a failure for Facebook, or, rather, Facebook was the failure of Oculus.