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Time to buy. Down from what price since January? Cryptocurrency is a long term play from a software and financial engineering vantage. It also continues to irri

Time to buy. Down from what price since January? Cryptocurrency is a long term play from a software and financial engineering vantage. It also continues to irritate the hell out of banks (bank accounts are being closed and restricted from exchange transfers, including coinbase) and general investors. It's not liquid enough yet, creates no need for middle men and Bitcoin itself is now being manipulated by futures contracts based on supply being increased artificially.

semi-extrinsic 9y ago
Yes, but what? Ripple's seen maybe the biggest loss, but it's not clear that part of its loss isn't due to decreasing confidence in the underlying, which is bad if you want to BTFD. Same can be said for many others. Though if you look at todays charts e.g. in ETH, it's clear someone's probably made good money intraday buying dips.
- spdy 9y ago
  Does it even matter? Everything went up LTC for example went from 3$ to 360$ Just wait till everything goes to the bottom and diversify between the top coins put them on an usb stick an forget about them until the next wave.
- KasianFranks 9y ago
  Agreed. Crypto is experiencing manipulation like stocks, bonds, debentures, CDs and derivatives of all kinds. Sharks, snakes, wolves are part of the game now for all kinds of reasons but the development communities also have a real chance at creating a better balance with assets based on the blockchain.
- cableshaft 9y ago
  Ripple will bounce back up (maybe not back up to $3 anytime soon, but I'm pretty sure it will go back up). A lot of people that got out are just trying to time the bottom as well as they can. I'm tempted to buy more myself. Part of me wants to wait to see if it drops more, part of me thinks I should just get in instead of trying to time the market and missing the opportunity.
  - semi-extrinsic 9y ago
    Why so sure? It seems to have gone up based on the news that Japanese banks were getting involved, but then it turns out they likely won't use the actual coins, just the tech?
    - cableshaft 9y ago
      Just based on the general patterns and trends, and that it seems to be the favored coin of the banking world, at least so far. But I very well could be wrong. Someone can be very confident and very wrong. But as a general rule I'm conservative with how much I put into these things, just a small amount each month. I can afford to be very confident and very wrong about Ripple.
- m3kw9 9y ago
  A lot of people don’t understand how ripple works and how the underlying mechanism works, it seems far more useful than bitcoin because of the transaction speed. But I think it is going down because that is the one they went up the most recently, which means the gains are more likely from hype than anything
spookthesunset 9y ago
Ahh the "time to buy cheap coins" rally of the die-hard bitcoin shysters. Your own post says "It's not liquid enough yet, creates no need to middle men and Bitcoin itself is now being manipulated by futures contracts based on supply being increased artificially." Does that sound like buying now is a good idea? Doesn't to me... Bitcoin is, was and always will be a highly manipulated penny stock. It spiked from $1000 to $20k for absolutely no reason, and now it is dropping down to $10k for absolutely no reason. Any price bitcoin spikes or drops to has no reason behind it... what kind of "store-of-value" / "currency" does that?
- nukeop 9y ago
  What do you mean "no reason"? Supply and demand are the reasons the prices are shaped the way they are. It's a near perfect market.
  - spookthesunset 9y ago
    > What do you mean "no reason"? As in "why is the price what it is". Saying "because of supply and demand" is useless, unhelpful pedantry.
    - celticninja 9y ago
      I think that's an unfair accusation, ultimately the price is determined by supply and demand for the product, your question should really be what are the fundamental reasons behind people buying at X price and I think those are many and varied.
  - kakarot 9y ago
    With a healthy dose of FUD from several directions.
  - bsaul 9y ago
    Was that sarcasm ?? In case you don't know, things like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_manipulation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_manipulation exists..
AndrewKemendo 9y ago
creates no need to middle men I've seen this consistently touted as a structural advantage to (bit)coins, but have yet to see a compelling technical explanation as to how/why this would be the case. The Satoshi paper doesn't discuss middlemen at all. Very few people (relatively) are actually mining and most are just buying with USD from an exchange which by default is a middleman. Many of the other coins are pre-mined so aren't decentralized at all, which takes that whole point out of possibility. Where's the proof of this claim?
- KasianFranks 9y ago
  P2P baby.
  - jhwang5 9y ago
    miners baby
- VMG 9y ago
  The Satoshi whitepaper calls middlemen "trusted third parties"
  - AndrewKemendo 9y ago
    Yes, good point, however I interpreted the "trusted third party" as preventing a central bank managed authority process that would "devalue" a currency through monetary creation. Nothing prevents that with bitcoin unless it was strictly used - you can always create derivatives that you sell to people. It's like expecting people to trade goods with gold etc...
justrobert 9y ago
The futures contracts trade less than 1% of the global spot btc volume on any given day. The products so far have been a failure.
scotty79 9y ago
I'd wait few months. Bitcoin tends to stabilize for few months before next ride up.
FabHK 9y ago
> irritate the hell out of banks (bank accounts are being closed and restricted from exchange transfers, including coinbase) It irritates banks not, by the way, because they're oh so scared about this fantastic new competitor to "their" money and money related businesses, but because it's often used (when it's used) for illegal transactions.
- Mandatum 9y ago
  I think it decentralizes account fees, lending, term deposits, funds, everything. It turns the traditional banking model on its head because anyone can "become a bank" and handle the traditional "keep your money safe" model that banking was originally created for. Those getting paid for transactions will be those investing in the network infrastructure - which is also decentralized, because again - anyone can jump in and do it. The only downside to it all is if whoever handles your "account" (or wallet) is breached, or someone steals your "money". Right now - no one will insure it. It'll come, and when it does - it'll likely be decentralized again, because that's entirely possible - throw 1% of your "account" into "insurance" and suddenly everyone is paying for their own insurance and third-party investigations into claims. That in itself will be heavily regulated by the companies running it, and I think the lower the fee - the more information they'll want from users.
  - spookthesunset 9y ago
    Do bitcoin pumpers ever come up for air? None, I mean absolutely none of what you are writing will ever happen. Why? Because if Bitcoin boosters understood anything about politics, economics, math, finance, computer science, monetary policy, business, accounting, marketing or seemingly life in general.... they too would look at it and go "sounds way to good to be true. no thanks". Every single thing in your post makes zero sense.... it is all breathless hype.
    - imcoconut 9y ago
      > Every single thing in your post makes zero sense Not true. Most of the post makes sense. Trustlessness and decentralization are pretty much the only benefits to bitcoin and others like it. There are obviously real costs for these features, but also real benefits. Do the benefits justify the current valuations - only the market can determine that. I personally am quite bearish on almost all cryptoassets (so I would not be considered a "pumper"), but certainly you must see the threat they pose to the incumbent masters of the monetary system?

semi-extrinsic 9y ago

Yes, but what? Ripple's seen maybe the biggest loss, but it's not clear that part of its loss isn't due to decreasing confidence in the underlying, which is bad if you want to BTFD. Same can be said for many others. Though if you look at todays charts e.g. in ETH, it's clear someone's probably made good money intraday buying dips.

spdy 9y ago
Does it even matter? Everything went up LTC for example went from 3$ to 360$ Just wait till everything goes to the bottom and diversify between the top coins put them on an usb stick an forget about them until the next wave.
KasianFranks 9y ago
Agreed. Crypto is experiencing manipulation like stocks, bonds, debentures, CDs and derivatives of all kinds. Sharks, snakes, wolves are part of the game now for all kinds of reasons but the development communities also have a real chance at creating a better balance with assets based on the blockchain.
cableshaft 9y ago
Ripple will bounce back up (maybe not back up to $3 anytime soon, but I'm pretty sure it will go back up). A lot of people that got out are just trying to time the bottom as well as they can. I'm tempted to buy more myself. Part of me wants to wait to see if it drops more, part of me thinks I should just get in instead of trying to time the market and missing the opportunity.
- semi-extrinsic 9y ago
  Why so sure? It seems to have gone up based on the news that Japanese banks were getting involved, but then it turns out they likely won't use the actual coins, just the tech?
  - cableshaft 9y ago
    Just based on the general patterns and trends, and that it seems to be the favored coin of the banking world, at least so far. But I very well could be wrong. Someone can be very confident and very wrong. But as a general rule I'm conservative with how much I put into these things, just a small amount each month. I can afford to be very confident and very wrong about Ripple.
m3kw9 9y ago
A lot of people don’t understand how ripple works and how the underlying mechanism works, it seems far more useful than bitcoin because of the transaction speed. But I think it is going down because that is the one they went up the most recently, which means the gains are more likely from hype than anything

spookthesunset 9y ago

Ahh the "time to buy cheap coins" rally of the die-hard bitcoin shysters. Your own post says "It's not liquid enough yet, creates no need to middle men and Bitcoin itself is now being manipulated by futures contracts based on supply being increased artificially." Does that sound like buying now is a good idea? Doesn't to me... Bitcoin is, was and always will be a highly manipulated penny stock. It spiked from $1000 to $20k for absolutely no reason, and now it is dropping down to $10k for absolutely no reason. Any price bitcoin spikes or drops to has no reason behind it... what kind of "store-of-value" / "currency" does that?

nukeop 9y ago
What do you mean "no reason"? Supply and demand are the reasons the prices are shaped the way they are. It's a near perfect market.
- spookthesunset 9y ago
  > What do you mean "no reason"? As in "why is the price what it is". Saying "because of supply and demand" is useless, unhelpful pedantry.
  - celticninja 9y ago
    I think that's an unfair accusation, ultimately the price is determined by supply and demand for the product, your question should really be what are the fundamental reasons behind people buying at X price and I think those are many and varied.
- kakarot 9y ago
  With a healthy dose of FUD from several directions.
- bsaul 9y ago
  Was that sarcasm ?? In case you don't know, things like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_manipulation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_manipulation exists..

AndrewKemendo 9y ago

creates no need to middle men I've seen this consistently touted as a structural advantage to (bit)coins, but have yet to see a compelling technical explanation as to how/why this would be the case. The Satoshi paper doesn't discuss middlemen at all. Very few people (relatively) are actually mining and most are just buying with USD from an exchange which by default is a middleman. Many of the other coins are pre-mined so aren't decentralized at all, which takes that whole point out of possibility. Where's the proof of this claim?

KasianFranks 9y ago
P2P baby.
- jhwang5 9y ago
  miners baby
VMG 9y ago
The Satoshi whitepaper calls middlemen "trusted third parties"
- AndrewKemendo 9y ago
  Yes, good point, however I interpreted the "trusted third party" as preventing a central bank managed authority process that would "devalue" a currency through monetary creation. Nothing prevents that with bitcoin unless it was strictly used - you can always create derivatives that you sell to people. It's like expecting people to trade goods with gold etc...

justrobert 9y ago

The futures contracts trade less than 1% of the global spot btc volume on any given day. The products so far have been a failure.

scotty79 9y ago

I'd wait few months. Bitcoin tends to stabilize for few months before next ride up.

FabHK 9y ago

> irritate the hell out of banks (bank accounts are being closed and restricted from exchange transfers, including coinbase) It irritates banks not, by the way, because they're oh so scared about this fantastic new competitor to "their" money and money related businesses, but because it's often used (when it's used) for illegal transactions.

Mandatum 9y ago
I think it decentralizes account fees, lending, term deposits, funds, everything. It turns the traditional banking model on its head because anyone can "become a bank" and handle the traditional "keep your money safe" model that banking was originally created for. Those getting paid for transactions will be those investing in the network infrastructure - which is also decentralized, because again - anyone can jump in and do it. The only downside to it all is if whoever handles your "account" (or wallet) is breached, or someone steals your "money". Right now - no one will insure it. It'll come, and when it does - it'll likely be decentralized again, because that's entirely possible - throw 1% of your "account" into "insurance" and suddenly everyone is paying for their own insurance and third-party investigations into claims. That in itself will be heavily regulated by the companies running it, and I think the lower the fee - the more information they'll want from users.
- spookthesunset 9y ago
  Do bitcoin pumpers ever come up for air? None, I mean absolutely none of what you are writing will ever happen. Why? Because if Bitcoin boosters understood anything about politics, economics, math, finance, computer science, monetary policy, business, accounting, marketing or seemingly life in general.... they too would look at it and go "sounds way to good to be true. no thanks". Every single thing in your post makes zero sense.... it is all breathless hype.
  - imcoconut 9y ago
    > Every single thing in your post makes zero sense Not true. Most of the post makes sense. Trustlessness and decentralization are pretty much the only benefits to bitcoin and others like it. There are obviously real costs for these features, but also real benefits. Do the benefits justify the current valuations - only the market can determine that. I personally am quite bearish on almost all cryptoassets (so I would not be considered a "pumper"), but certainly you must see the threat they pose to the incumbent masters of the monetary system?