5 ms·

> Anyone with a record can attest to the stigma that doesn't leave after doing one's time. In fact, for most, it's a life sentence, a sentence that even low une

> Anyone with a record can attest to the stigma that doesn't leave after doing one's time. In fact, for most, it's a life sentence, a sentence that even low unemployment can't expunge. This is correct. I have a criminal record (though hopefully after probation it gets deleted - deferred adjucation) and lucky enough to have a well paying tech job because my company did not do a background check. However, you never know when you may be fired, have to leave, or the company may fail. I always worry ahead of time when I might need another job and be unable to find an engineering job that doesn't background check me. One time I accepted an offer after many interviews and worked at a place for two weeks - enough time for someone to settle down and feel like they are back to a normal life, and bang - background check, and I was out the next day. I am also in a support group with people with the same crime as me and those who were no as fortunate to be college educated suffer from unstable and low paying employment. Those are college educated are not much better off because the jobs that they know how to do and pay decently are behind background checks. It is very frustrating to know that you might not get a job not because of your skills, interview prep, or personality, but because of something you did years ago. I get it that not all of us are good guys or have learned our lesson, but everyone should be able to feed themselves and their families.

njovin 9y ago
Curious: why didn't you disclose to the employer up-front? I've had a few applicants do this. We don't discriminate for many minor crimes, but if I Google somebody or something comes up in a background check that's going to do more damage than if they'd just been up-front about it.
- recordthrowaway 9y ago
  > Curious: why didn't you disclose to the employer up-front? a) I didn't know as I was 22 and this was my first time getting a job after everything happened, so I was ignorant of the process. The subject never came up during interviews or offer signing. b) NYC has laws/rules (?) that don't let employers ask about criminal records before giving an offer. To me these laws are useless as I'd rather be rejected up front than accept an offer and then have to leave... Anyway, the company was a CRM start up and their excuse was that their investors wanted everyone in the company to be clean because we handle customer data or whatever, so I doubt I would've gotten the job even if I had been up front. But, I love where I work now so it's all good.
  - magic_beans 9y ago
    What kind of crime did you commit? I can understand how a company might be wary of hiring someone who murdered or sexually assaulted someone, it's a lot more tolerable to hire someone who, say, sold drugs or committed theft in a time of financial crisis.
    - emodendroket 9y ago
      This seems like a half-solution though. It's not like those who have committed violent offenses don't need to work.
      - bobwaycott 9y ago
        I’d extend this to say they not only need to work, but they need to be re-integrated into society as a full citizen after serving their time. I find this especially true if the crime committed is in no way related to the job they’re applying to.
        emodendroket 9y ago
        Yes, I agree wholeheartedly.
        jimmaswell 9y ago
        Would you want to work in the same building as a convicted arsonist?
        PakG1 9y ago
        Is he a serial arsonist?
        emodendroket 9y ago
        Do arsonists have a special propensity to burn their own workplaces?
    - bryanrasmussen 9y ago
- coldtea 9y ago
  >Curious: why didn't you disclose to the employer up-front? Because he didn't want his chances of getting hired drop in 1/10th what they were... >but if I Google somebody or something comes up in a background check that's going to do more damage than if they'd just been up-front about it. Well, then that's the same attitude as the one that doesn't give them the job in the first place. What business is of yours, their employee, if they did jail time in their past, as long as they are good at their job? Why should they volunteer that information to you, not only since giving it such kills their chances in lots of other employees, but in principle too?
  - UncleEntity 9y ago
    > Why should they volunteer that information to you, not only since giving it such kills their chances in lots of other employees, but in principle too? Because lying on your application about past crimes will 100% get you fired but being upfront about it leaves a different impression?
    - watwut 9y ago
      But if they don't ask, then it should be ok to leave it out.
    - neves 9y ago
      It is completely different. If they ask you and you don't tell, it is a lie. Imagine in a first date if you should say: I snore, every Wednesday I play soccer with my friends and arrive home somewhat drunk, and my family is full of assholes.
      - croshan 9y ago
        Imagine on a first date, your date tells you they're a convicted felon. That may be a closer analogy. We're talking about someone's previous criminal history, not the fact that they snore.
  - nashashmi 9y ago
    Many companies ask for past crimes . And if someone lies he has no crimes, they get terminated once a background check is done (if it ever is). Majority of the time checks are not done and they most probably never will be. If a check is not done, and it hurts your chances if a you are honest, why be honest. So the general rule is you say there are no crimes. And only get removed when they do a background check.
- syshum 9y ago
  > We don't discriminate for many minor crimes Well that depends on your definition of "minor crimes" and you have no idea what the person you are responding to has been convicted of a "minor crime" Further most companies do, even if unstated, discriminate based on criminal history. >if I Google somebody You should really stop that... You should not base hiring or any other choices off a google search, you are not getting accurate data. > or something comes up in a background check that's going to do more damage than if they'd just been up-front about it. That depends. Losing the job is all you are empowered to do thus it seems to me it is the same amount of damage
drewmol 9y ago
Here's my thoughts on your situation, based of my own expirience: >This is correct. I have a criminal record (though hopefully after probation it gets deleted - deferred adjucation) I can't emphasize enough how important it getting "deleted" can be for your future earning potential. You should of course expect to encounter situations where you'll need disclose and explain the situation in your future, regardless of the adjudication, as it certainly is a part of your history/ life story. However, by not having the conviction show up on a standard background check, you can also expect to avoid those situations where: >and bang - background check, and I was out the next day. By controlling the disclosure, you can ensure the opportunity to offer further explaination. IME, Humans tend to be much more understanding, flexible, reasonable and compassionate toward this topic in face to face situations. Also, just the simple act of admitting and reflecting on past mistakes can help to humanize you as a candidate, and lead to developing more personal relationships than you otherwise would have.
- knieveltech 9y ago
  Definitely get it expunged from your record if at all possible. Note: expungement does not automatically update a bunch of private background check databases that will also have copies of your criminal history. You may need to hire a 3rd party service to handle purging records from private databases.
Avamander 9y ago
This is why I love how in many countries in Europe criminal record is something you have to provide willingly, if they don't ask it from you then they won't get it.
- Erikun 9y ago
  Sweden has this too, but in recent years it is not enough. While the employers can't do background checks themselves, they are increasingly asking for the applicant to provide their criminal record. It's hard for the applicant to say no if they need/want the job.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - e12e 9y ago
    In Norway it's illegal to ask for a criminal record except when required by law (eg: you need a statement from police to work in child care - but the request need to state that. So a violent crime would show up (up to X years in the past, automatic expiry), while fraud would not be disclosed. Conversely a child abuse conviction would not show up on a financial controller application, but fraud might (although, I'm not sure any financial sector jobs are allowed/require a criminal record check).
- baud147258 9y ago
  Yeah, I remember for an intership in FinTech, I had to ask the gov my (empty) criminal record to provide during my application process. It was not asked right at the start, but I think before the last interview with RH.

njovin 9y ago

Curious: why didn't you disclose to the employer up-front? I've had a few applicants do this. We don't discriminate for many minor crimes, but if I Google somebody or something comes up in a background check that's going to do more damage than if they'd just been up-front about it.

recordthrowaway 9y ago
> Curious: why didn't you disclose to the employer up-front? a) I didn't know as I was 22 and this was my first time getting a job after everything happened, so I was ignorant of the process. The subject never came up during interviews or offer signing. b) NYC has laws/rules (?) that don't let employers ask about criminal records before giving an offer. To me these laws are useless as I'd rather be rejected up front than accept an offer and then have to leave... Anyway, the company was a CRM start up and their excuse was that their investors wanted everyone in the company to be clean because we handle customer data or whatever, so I doubt I would've gotten the job even if I had been up front. But, I love where I work now so it's all good.
- magic_beans 9y ago
  What kind of crime did you commit? I can understand how a company might be wary of hiring someone who murdered or sexually assaulted someone, it's a lot more tolerable to hire someone who, say, sold drugs or committed theft in a time of financial crisis.
  - emodendroket 9y ago
    This seems like a half-solution though. It's not like those who have committed violent offenses don't need to work.
    - bobwaycott 9y ago
      I’d extend this to say they not only need to work, but they need to be re-integrated into society as a full citizen after serving their time. I find this especially true if the crime committed is in no way related to the job they’re applying to.
      - emodendroket 9y ago
        Yes, I agree wholeheartedly.
      - jimmaswell 9y ago
        Would you want to work in the same building as a convicted arsonist?
        PakG1 9y ago
        Is he a serial arsonist?
        emodendroket 9y ago
        Do arsonists have a special propensity to burn their own workplaces?
  - bryanrasmussen 9y ago
coldtea 9y ago
>Curious: why didn't you disclose to the employer up-front? Because he didn't want his chances of getting hired drop in 1/10th what they were... >but if I Google somebody or something comes up in a background check that's going to do more damage than if they'd just been up-front about it. Well, then that's the same attitude as the one that doesn't give them the job in the first place. What business is of yours, their employee, if they did jail time in their past, as long as they are good at their job? Why should they volunteer that information to you, not only since giving it such kills their chances in lots of other employees, but in principle too?
- UncleEntity 9y ago
  > Why should they volunteer that information to you, not only since giving it such kills their chances in lots of other employees, but in principle too? Because lying on your application about past crimes will 100% get you fired but being upfront about it leaves a different impression?
  - watwut 9y ago
    But if they don't ask, then it should be ok to leave it out.
  - neves 9y ago
    It is completely different. If they ask you and you don't tell, it is a lie. Imagine in a first date if you should say: I snore, every Wednesday I play soccer with my friends and arrive home somewhat drunk, and my family is full of assholes.
    - croshan 9y ago
      Imagine on a first date, your date tells you they're a convicted felon. That may be a closer analogy. We're talking about someone's previous criminal history, not the fact that they snore.
- nashashmi 9y ago
  Many companies ask for past crimes . And if someone lies he has no crimes, they get terminated once a background check is done (if it ever is). Majority of the time checks are not done and they most probably never will be. If a check is not done, and it hurts your chances if a you are honest, why be honest. So the general rule is you say there are no crimes. And only get removed when they do a background check.
syshum 9y ago
> We don't discriminate for many minor crimes Well that depends on your definition of "minor crimes" and you have no idea what the person you are responding to has been convicted of a "minor crime" Further most companies do, even if unstated, discriminate based on criminal history. >if I Google somebody You should really stop that... You should not base hiring or any other choices off a google search, you are not getting accurate data. > or something comes up in a background check that's going to do more damage than if they'd just been up-front about it. That depends. Losing the job is all you are empowered to do thus it seems to me it is the same amount of damage

drewmol 9y ago

Here's my thoughts on your situation, based of my own expirience: >This is correct. I have a criminal record (though hopefully after probation it gets deleted - deferred adjucation) I can't emphasize enough how important it getting "deleted" can be for your future earning potential. You should of course expect to encounter situations where you'll need disclose and explain the situation in your future, regardless of the adjudication, as it certainly is a part of your history/ life story. However, by not having the conviction show up on a standard background check, you can also expect to avoid those situations where: >and bang - background check, and I was out the next day. By controlling the disclosure, you can ensure the opportunity to offer further explaination. IME, Humans tend to be much more understanding, flexible, reasonable and compassionate toward this topic in face to face situations. Also, just the simple act of admitting and reflecting on past mistakes can help to humanize you as a candidate, and lead to developing more personal relationships than you otherwise would have.

knieveltech 9y ago
Definitely get it expunged from your record if at all possible. Note: expungement does not automatically update a bunch of private background check databases that will also have copies of your criminal history. You may need to hire a 3rd party service to handle purging records from private databases.

Avamander 9y ago

This is why I love how in many countries in Europe criminal record is something you have to provide willingly, if they don't ask it from you then they won't get it.

Erikun 9y ago
Sweden has this too, but in recent years it is not enough. While the employers can't do background checks themselves, they are increasingly asking for the applicant to provide their criminal record. It's hard for the applicant to say no if they need/want the job.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- e12e 9y ago
  In Norway it's illegal to ask for a criminal record except when required by law (eg: you need a statement from police to work in child care - but the request need to state that. So a violent crime would show up (up to X years in the past, automatic expiry), while fraud would not be disclosed. Conversely a child abuse conviction would not show up on a financial controller application, but fraud might (although, I'm not sure any financial sector jobs are allowed/require a criminal record check).
baud147258 9y ago
Yeah, I remember for an intership in FinTech, I had to ask the gov my (empty) criminal record to provide during my application process. It was not asked right at the start, but I think before the last interview with RH.