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Facebook Dives into Home Device Market with Video Chat Product Named “Portal”
- minton 9y agoI’m not sure I would trust Facebook with an always-on wide-angle lens and microphone in my house. I can’t imagine the next-level of creepy ads that will enable. It’s creepy enough when they start showing ads for physical stores I’ve visited.
- paulie_a 9y agoOddly enough Facebook has the lowest quality of ads in my opinion. For the large amounts of data they have on me, they don't seem to utilize it effectively
- kaybe 9y agoHave you seen anyone using it effectively?
- lakechfoma 9y agoAbsolutely not. I'm really amazed by how bad Amazon is sometimes. I buy cat food once for a friend - eternally and constantly get recommendations for more cat stuff. I buy coffee filters every 6 months - I get "buy it again" a week later. This lasts for a month. Then it goes away. 5 months later, end of my regular buying period, and they seem to have forgotten all about them.
- wepple 9y agoI’m surprised how it can’t even stop advertising a you-only-need-one product like an ironing board to me a week after I definitely purchased one. This isnt even machine learning level problem space.
- lakechfoma 9y agoVery true. Oh you just spent $400 on a top of the line product that'll last a decade? Here, check out these $100 bottom of the barrel alternatives that'll surely break in a month. I get that Amazon is doing auction advertising but it seems like the value of their ads would be higher if they could correctly target them.
- Balgair 9y agoAds/recommendations are shown to you at an 'auction', companies bid in micro-second level timing to show you an ad/recommendation. So, when you say that you get low quality ads, you are telling us that the bidders think you aren't worth much. Hence, you get the same ad over and over, because you are being targeted by the 'long tail' of the bidders. Also, they 'forget' you for the same reason, because you aren't worth enough to them to become a 'regular'. It's not the bidders, it's that you wisely don't respond well to ads/recommendations on the internet. No offense ;)
- EduardoBautista 9y agoNot all the recommendations are paid ads.
- lakechfoma 9y agoAh well that put a positive note on my morning coffee. I didn't know that. But still wouldn't it be valuable to the bidders for Amazon to fix this? Or shouldn't Amazon value better targeting because relevant ads convince users to engage with the platform more? The people selling the coffee filters are still guaranteed my business, just not before 6 months. I always buy from the same seller too so it could be a good opportunity for a competitor to sneak in right at the 6 month mark and make a new repeat customer. I guess the answer to that is probably "well the system works well enough elsewhere so that would just be hyper-optimization"
- Balgair 9y ago
- soared 9y agoI've never heard of cheddar - it is almost more interesting than facebook's portal. Looks like tech broadcast news that is not on tv but digital only.
- soared 9y agoComical that they will charge $500. The data (revenue) they gain from me owning a portal I'd imagine would off set the cost to build and develop this product.
- cryptoz 9y agoSame price point and similar privacy invasion as a smartphone.
- sharkweek 9y agoMy friends and I got into a debate the other night, ranking the Big Five in order of trust. While nobody really reached a consensus on what company belonged at the top (Apple was probably closest), we all agreed that Facebook was at the bottom of the list, and that they were way, way below everyone else. There's honestly no way I would ever let Facebook have a device like this in my home (and for those wondering, I don't have Facebook on my phone).
- rm999 9y agoThat's an interesting one. I'd vote: Apple > Microsoft >> Google == Amazon >> Facebook Facebook is dead last by a mile.
- sharkweek 9y agoRight, mine was Apple > Microsoft > Amazon >> Google >>>>> Facebook
- lucideer 9y agoThis comes up time and time again on HN, and I continue to struggle to understand it. Admittedly, Facebook have very recently passed out Google on my rankings, and is now in last place, but it's always been a close one. Facebook is very much a tentative last. Google has been very comfortably last until recently, and could easily slip down again. What exactly is it that makes people trust Google? How is Google even remotely comparable to Amazon???
- kajecounterhack 9y agoHow is Microsoft more trustworthy than Google? Google's involvement in OSS vs Microsoft's time-old approach tells a huge story to people who write software. I trust Amazon less than I do Facebook. Facebook lets me see exactly what kind of advertising data they have on me and lets me export all my data. Google does the same. Amazon just shows me recommendations and tries to sell me android tablets full of crapware or sneak their crapware onto Ubuntu. If you've ever worked at Facebook you'll know internally their culture of openness is very similar to Google's "Don't be evil" ...but less explicit. And explicit company values matter, so that is a knock on them. But yeah, Amazon seems worse. Compare their internal cultures because it does affect what direction their products take. Apple is trustworthy only in the sense that they make hardware devices that, if backdoored, would be terrible for their business. Their cloud services have the same incentive structures as Google so I feel they're fairly equivalent (plus under the hood Apple uses one of the major cloud providers). Apple > Google > Microsoft ~= Facebook > Amazon. This ranking encodes: 1. Which physical devices I would trust more (iPad > Fire Tablet). 2. How wary I would be of using their services (e.g Google Search > Amazon Shopping). 3. Whose culture is better for user trust (Google's track record >> Microsoft or Facebook's track record).
- krisives 9y agoThat sounds like an absurd waste of time. Anyone who wants to do most of that can already do so, just they won't have the "luxury" of Facebook monetizing it.
- hbosch 9y agoI don’t see yet how this can possibly be more than a clone of the Echo Show, but twice as expensive and with Facebook-y features. I don’t spot anything particularly significant in this article that differentiates it — even the leaked image looks similar to the hardware. I have to assume most of the price difference would come down to screen size or resolution. In any case, it’s very interesting to think about Facebook getting into video as they are leaning into Live already. I wonder if there is also more Live programming products in the works as they continue to ramp up against YouTube, and explore content creation... but still, I don’t know many people now who video chat via FB (or any FB properties), but I’m on iOS and pretty much exclusively use FaceTime for that so I’m in a bubble there.
- Jyaif 9y agoThat's a brilliant product. Assuming it's reliable and user friendly, that's the kind of product I'd give my parents (or even grand mother) so that they can easily video chat with the rest of the family.
- hbosch 9y agoJust wondering: Have you looked into the Echo Show or Spot? Also, my theory is this story is coming out intentionally ahead of CES where Google will likely show a similar product to both this "Portal" thing and Amazon's Echo Show/Spot.
- notatoad 9y agoGoogle announced their version of this yesterday. they have a "smart screen" platform and are partnering with lenovo and a few others to launch products by the summer.
- tantalor 9y agoThe Google Assistant is coming to new smart screen devices, too, with JBL, Lenovo, LG, and Sony all crafting Google Assistant smart screens. https://androidandme.com/2018/01/news/google-assistant-smart-screen-devices-android-auto/ https://androidandme.com/2018/01/news/google-assistant-smart...
- bartman 9y agoI gave my 90 year old grandmother an Echo Show for Christmas and she loves it. My main goal was video chat (which she can also initiate herself), but she’s actively using it as a radio, weather station and calendar for the trash pick up. To help her remember the commands I made a reference sheet with the most common phrases, but what mainly helped her was to think of talking to Alexa as if she was talking to a dog: Giving clear, loudly spoken commands.
- wallflower 9y agoDid you see the recent SNL skit? I think that a real Alexa for Seniors would incorporate some of what this spoof Alexa does. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvT_gqs5ETk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvT_gqs5ETk
- tw04 9y agoDid they all sit down and go - you know, that Facebook phone thing was such a huge success... let's do that again!
- r00fus 9y agoNo, they know FaceOS and Fire(sale)phone did poorly but that Amazon is getting the side-angle with Echo/Show so they figured they might get a good 2nd place with the "I don't care if it's creepy" crowd.
- tw04 9y agoEcho did well because it was the first to market and quickly built up an ecosystem. Google home did well because google and because of the integration with their video/music/phone services. There's no incentive to jump on the facebook bandwagon, they offer nothing unique. And even among uneducated consumers, they've got a bad reputation WRT privacy. If their best and brightest couldn't see that coming... they're in trouble.
- fps 9y agoThis is a video chat hardware device, not an assistant. Facebook has become the de-facto messaging platform for most of the people I know, and Facebook's Video chat is typically what I suggest when I want to do a video conference with a non-technical user. Google totally blew their commanding network and technical lead by the repeated gchat -> hangouts -> duo migrations. No one I know is typically logged into hangouts anymore, and I've never even had a single contact sign up for duo or allo. Facetime is a non-starter for the 80% of the population that uses something other than a Mac and an iOS device. Facebook works everywhere, has all my contacts, and is something people know and use.
- BRAlNlAC 9y ago>they figured tvey might get a good second place with the "I don't care if it's creepy" crowd. except, usually you get a much better deal on a product when you go the "i dont care if its creepy" route. this is twice the price of the Amazon Show.
- ArchReaper 9y agoNow here's a device that actually is a straight wiretap. I wonder if they just hope that people don't care, or if they are actually going to design it in some kind of not-a-wiretap way (hopefully following Google/Amazon's example)
- chrischen 9y agoI’m surprised they aren’t releasing it for free to align with their mission of connecting the world, always on, all the time. Of course the catch would be it watches you, knows you by your face, and builds your advertising profile.
- newscracker 9y ago> Of course the catch would be it watches you, knows you by your face, and builds your advertising profile. And it would be enhanced to detect your emotional state from facial expressions, tone of voice, who you're with, your relationship with them, etc., and then suggest something (addictive) to cheer you up or keep you more excited. If someone didn't consider Facebook as being akin to an addictive drug, this one would prove them wrong once and for all! The sales pitch would be some drivel about meaningful connnections, interactions and experiences.
- sandov 9y agoI bet they'll bring the prices down sooner than later. Maybe they just want to create hype first.
- ThrustVectoring 9y agoThe catch is that it automatically builds a social graph based on recognizing the faces of people who visit you. No facebook account and don't pose for pictures? No problem, we'll just install facial recognition cameras in the houses of your friends.
- adjkant 9y ago> "According to people familiar with Facebook’s plans, Portal will be equipped with a wide-angle lens that is capable of recognizing individual faces and associating them with their Facebook accounts." In addition to Facebook being viewed as the least trustworthy as mentioned in other comments, let's just casually add in facial recognition cameras into our homes too! There are plenty of reasons to be wary of home devices no matter the company, but holy fuck I wouldn't touch this one with a 10-foot pole. As an alternative to this, I love Google's personal recognition solution of recognizing voice with a small model so that while it can distinguish between (I think up to 10?) people, it is in no way good enough to fingerprint your voice.
- ThrustVectoring 9y agoI won't go into homes with an active Portal, for as long as that's remotely practical. Jesus christ.
- sandov 9y agoWho would be so stupid to buy one of these?
- BigSlowTarget 9y agoI'm making a note here: huge success... Seriously Facebook guys, do you check nothing? There is no way the internet isn't going to connect wide angle lenses, invasion of privacy and a psychopathic if lovable computer program with Aperture Science. I hope that's what you're going for.
- aviv 9y agoI wonder how this ties into the recent rumors circling about Facebook buying RingCentral.
- alistproducer2 9y agoWhile I understand that my smartphone can be used as a listening device, the day when I will purchase a dedicated wire tap for my house will be never. I've been to people's houses that have them and sure they're fun when you're having some beers and want to hear a song I don't mind taking 2 seconds to manual select a song on my phone to keep a hot mic out of my house.
- myaso 9y agoLolz. That's some awesome industrial design -- did they use 1984 as inspiration?
- tinyhouse 9y agoI was hoping for a device with VR experience. I've been waiting for something like this since they acquired Oculus.
- throwawaymanbot 9y agoEwwwwwww... Not in a million years. Not a Zuckerbergs chance i'd use this.
- tzakrajs 9y agoPortal to hell.
- bigphishy 9y agoFacebook has jumped the shark.