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I think that's a little extreme and reminds me of the problematic trend of giving psychiatric medication to anyone who asks for it. I mean, yes, there's a chanc

by ajkjk 9y ago

I think that's a little extreme and reminds me of the problematic trend of giving psychiatric medication to anyone who asks for it. I mean, yes, there's a chance they 'actually have ADHD', but there's also a much higher chance they are one of the tremendous number of people who have trouble getting themselves to do things that aren't urgent. I'm on that list too. So are lots of people. Sloth sounds so incredibly normal to me.

sudosteph 9y ago
Everyone procrastinates sometimes, the difference with ADHD is the frequency and severity. So if this person procrastinates every day of her life, and it consistently impacts her functioning and relationships, it becomes out of the norm. ADHD is actually decently prevalent, but often missed in girls who are not disruptive in class. Often they can get by with a strong support structure (parents and partners) but struggle with the independence of adulthood, which OP described. The risks of untreated ADHD can be far more destructive than many people realize (car crashes, depression, financial insecurity) so it's at least worth evaluating for in cases like this.
taneq 9y ago
I'm not sure "actually have ADHD" is a thing. (Edit: Emphasis on "actually", not on "ADHD". ADHD is a thing. In between "really do have it" and "really don't have it", though, is a huge grey area, and that's what I'm getting at.) I mean, there are certainly people (maybe even most people) who function better on stimulants. And there are certainly people who don't function well when not on stimulants. But it's all a set of sliding scales, there's no clear line with "has ADHD" on one side and "just lazy" on the other.
- sudosteph 9y ago
  The science is not on your side for this view. I suggest you read up to get a more informed view, Dr. Russell Barkley is a great resource, has videos all over youtube. In the meantime, here's a quote from "International Consensus Statement on ADHD" (Clinical Child and Family Psychology Review, Vol. 5, No. 2, June 2002) > We cannot overemphasize the point that, as a matter of science, the notion that ADHD does not exist is simply wrong. All of the major medical as- sociations and government health agencies recognize ADHD as a genuine disorder because the scientific evidence indicating it is so overwhelming.
  - taneq 9y ago
    I'm not saying ADHD doesn't exist or that it's not a genuine disorder. I'm saying that there's a huge no-mans-land between "you're fine" and "woah yeah you clearly have ADHD and we should fix this."
    - TeMPOraL 9y ago
      Indeed there is, and the way psychiatry approaches it in terms of diagnosis isn't really good, either. There is a long but very insightful article on this topic that was recently featured on HN, by Scott Alexander, who's a practicing psychiatrist: http://slatestarcodex.com/2017/12/28/adderall-risks-much-more-than-you-wanted-to-know/ http://slatestarcodex.com/2017/12/28/adderall-risks-much-mor... Key quote for this topic: > But “ability to concentrate” is a normally distributed trait, like IQ. We draw a line at some point on the far left of the bell curve and tell the people on the far side that they’ve “got” “the disease” of “ADHD”. This isn’t just me saying this. It’s the neurostructural literature, the the genetics literature, a bunch of other studies, and the the Consensus Conference On ADHD. This doesn’t mean ADHD is “just laziness” or “isn’t biological” – of course it’s biological! Height is biological! But that doesn’t mean the world is divided into two natural categories of “healthy people” and “people who have Height Deficiency Syndrome“. Attention is the same way. Some people really do have poor concentration, they suffer a lot from it, and it’s not their fault. They just don’t form a discrete population. (Emphasis mine - pointing out the sentence which, in original article, is basically one big collection of links to references backing it up.)
      - rwnspace 9y ago
        I would argue that there is a discrete population with the 'disease' of ADHD, in the same way that doorways are a discrete difficulty for people who are very tall. One must either move into a house with very tall doorways, or learn to stoop. In any case, you'll probably often bang your head. This analogises to ADHD because failure to meet social and societal expectations often has real (and occasionally very painful) consequences. 'Attention' is normally distributed, but the environments that smoothly manage different degrees of attention are not.
- telchar 9y ago
  It is. Sure there is a spectrum, like autism is a spectrum, but if you're insinuating that ADHD isn't real you're wrong. The medical field has a pretty good consensus about this one.
  - taneq 9y ago
    I'm not. I'm saying there's no clear cutoff, not that it's not a thing.

by ajkjk 9y ago

sudosteph 9y ago

Everyone procrastinates sometimes, the difference with ADHD is the frequency and severity. So if this person procrastinates every day of her life, and it consistently impacts her functioning and relationships, it becomes out of the norm. ADHD is actually decently prevalent, but often missed in girls who are not disruptive in class. Often they can get by with a strong support structure (parents and partners) but struggle with the independence of adulthood, which OP described. The risks of untreated ADHD can be far more destructive than many people realize (car crashes, depression, financial insecurity) so it's at least worth evaluating for in cases like this.

taneq 9y ago

I'm not sure "actually have ADHD" is a thing. (Edit: Emphasis on "actually", not on "ADHD". ADHD is a thing. In between "really do have it" and "really don't have it", though, is a huge grey area, and that's what I'm getting at.) I mean, there are certainly people (maybe even most people) who function better on stimulants. And there are certainly people who don't function well when not on stimulants. But it's all a set of sliding scales, there's no clear line with "has ADHD" on one side and "just lazy" on the other.

sudosteph 9y ago
The science is not on your side for this view. I suggest you read up to get a more informed view, Dr. Russell Barkley is a great resource, has videos all over youtube. In the meantime, here's a quote from "International Consensus Statement on ADHD" (Clinical Child and Family Psychology Review, Vol. 5, No. 2, June 2002) > We cannot overemphasize the point that, as a matter of science, the notion that ADHD does not exist is simply wrong. All of the major medical as- sociations and government health agencies recognize ADHD as a genuine disorder because the scientific evidence indicating it is so overwhelming.
- taneq 9y ago
  I'm not saying ADHD doesn't exist or that it's not a genuine disorder. I'm saying that there's a huge no-mans-land between "you're fine" and "woah yeah you clearly have ADHD and we should fix this."
  - TeMPOraL 9y ago
    Indeed there is, and the way psychiatry approaches it in terms of diagnosis isn't really good, either. There is a long but very insightful article on this topic that was recently featured on HN, by Scott Alexander, who's a practicing psychiatrist: http://slatestarcodex.com/2017/12/28/adderall-risks-much-more-than-you-wanted-to-know/ http://slatestarcodex.com/2017/12/28/adderall-risks-much-mor... Key quote for this topic: > But “ability to concentrate” is a normally distributed trait, like IQ. We draw a line at some point on the far left of the bell curve and tell the people on the far side that they’ve “got” “the disease” of “ADHD”. This isn’t just me saying this. It’s the neurostructural literature, the the genetics literature, a bunch of other studies, and the the Consensus Conference On ADHD. This doesn’t mean ADHD is “just laziness” or “isn’t biological” – of course it’s biological! Height is biological! But that doesn’t mean the world is divided into two natural categories of “healthy people” and “people who have Height Deficiency Syndrome“. Attention is the same way. Some people really do have poor concentration, they suffer a lot from it, and it’s not their fault. They just don’t form a discrete population. (Emphasis mine - pointing out the sentence which, in original article, is basically one big collection of links to references backing it up.)
    - rwnspace 9y ago
      I would argue that there is a discrete population with the 'disease' of ADHD, in the same way that doorways are a discrete difficulty for people who are very tall. One must either move into a house with very tall doorways, or learn to stoop. In any case, you'll probably often bang your head. This analogises to ADHD because failure to meet social and societal expectations often has real (and occasionally very painful) consequences. 'Attention' is normally distributed, but the environments that smoothly manage different degrees of attention are not.
telchar 9y ago
It is. Sure there is a spectrum, like autism is a spectrum, but if you're insinuating that ADHD isn't real you're wrong. The medical field has a pretty good consensus about this one.
- taneq 9y ago
  I'm not. I'm saying there's no clear cutoff, not that it's not a thing.