4 ms·

Hmm... Smalltalk isn't quite as productive as MUMPS. The numbers seem pretty suspect. If the business functionality being provided is "deliver networked applic

Hmm... Smalltalk isn't quite as productive as MUMPS. The numbers seem pretty suspect. If the business functionality being provided is "deliver networked application to customer" then JavaScript would probably do well. If it's "create 3D rendering engine" then other language orderings are likely. How can you normalize the fact that different languages are appropriate for different domains? Do you have to come up with numbers that compare the business value of very different tasks.

coldtea 9y ago
>How can you normalize the fact that different languages are appropriate for different domains? There's nothing that makes Javascript especially appropriate for web apps, except for the fact that it's bundled as the default and only language on web browsers. So there's always that. Such accidents of history play more important role on what ecosystem and thus perceived suitability a language has, than the language's own merits. Judged purely on language merits, Smalltalk would have made an excellent language for web apps and more over JS.
- ianbicking 9y ago
  Take Smalltalk, throw away the image, or go over further and throw away the standard library (it's important that JavaScript never really had one), and what would you have? Take the database away from MUMPS and it's not even MUMPS. Languages and runtimes can't be separated, because you can't just transplant a language to a different runtime and maintain the same experience.
  - coldtea 9y ago
    >Take Smalltalk, throw away the image, or go over further and throw away the standard library (it's important that JavaScript never really had one), and what would you have? Still a damn fine language. That said, I don't think it's necessary to drop the standard library to make Smalltalk a web language, nor that it's "important that JavaScript never really had one". It would have been much better if it came with a better "batteries" for all basic stuff (parsing urls, string manipulation, making requests, etc) from the start. Ditto for the image -- one could very easily have web images, in fact that's part of what WASM would eventually achieve.
nradov 9y ago
Function point analysis is best suited to line-of-business CRUD and batch processing applications with limited algorithmic complexity. Of course it can be applied to other domains but then the numbers get a lot more subjective and comparisons are less accurate.
fulafel 9y ago
JS/WebGL is a very productive platform to develop a 3D engine on compared to alternatives. Only some compile-to-JS languages may be better.

coldtea 9y ago

>How can you normalize the fact that different languages are appropriate for different domains? There's nothing that makes Javascript especially appropriate for web apps, except for the fact that it's bundled as the default and only language on web browsers. So there's always that. Such accidents of history play more important role on what ecosystem and thus perceived suitability a language has, than the language's own merits. Judged purely on language merits, Smalltalk would have made an excellent language for web apps and more over JS.

ianbicking 9y ago
Take Smalltalk, throw away the image, or go over further and throw away the standard library (it's important that JavaScript never really had one), and what would you have? Take the database away from MUMPS and it's not even MUMPS. Languages and runtimes can't be separated, because you can't just transplant a language to a different runtime and maintain the same experience.
- coldtea 9y ago
  >Take Smalltalk, throw away the image, or go over further and throw away the standard library (it's important that JavaScript never really had one), and what would you have? Still a damn fine language. That said, I don't think it's necessary to drop the standard library to make Smalltalk a web language, nor that it's "important that JavaScript never really had one". It would have been much better if it came with a better "batteries" for all basic stuff (parsing urls, string manipulation, making requests, etc) from the start. Ditto for the image -- one could very easily have web images, in fact that's part of what WASM would eventually achieve.

nradov 9y ago

Function point analysis is best suited to line-of-business CRUD and batch processing applications with limited algorithmic complexity. Of course it can be applied to other domains but then the numbers get a lot more subjective and comparisons are less accurate.

fulafel 9y ago

JS/WebGL is a very productive platform to develop a 3D engine on compared to alternatives. Only some compile-to-JS languages may be better.